Tilly Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 My 14 week old GSD is a very vocal dog. He knows how to sit, come, drop, wait and toilet on command. I realise he is a pup but his contant vocals is driving me up the wall. He whinges almost contantly and when you ignore him he will jump and bark. I have been trying to ignore the behaviour and only praising when he is quiet ... but he is never quiet. I have finally managed to get him to sit for a few minutes before I open the crate door - and currently increasing the time between him sitting quietly and opening the door ... but I am not having the same success at the back door. I am feeling myself getting annoyed at him and really not feeling a lot of love for him at the moment. Maybe it is because I am really, really tired ... but can anyone offer some suggestions on how to get him to be quieter? Many thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 e-collar ... or are you not using many corrections? saying that my rottie NEVER shuts up ... he's on borrowed time before I blow my stack with him he whinges or barks all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teebs Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 I taught kaos to bark, it did stop her a bit, she sitll chats to me, but not as bad as she used to be! I do command her to speak a few times a day and reward her for it, but if i dont ask for it she gets ignored. I can have a whole conversation with her most of the time it doenst annoy me, but when im tired it can drive you up the wall!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janba Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 I had a border collie that was like that - whinged all the time as a pup. I really think he didn't know he was doing it and that it was just a subconcious habit. I stopped him by whining at him every time he started. That seemed to break his train of thought and eventually he grew out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 I wouldn't put an e collar on a 14 week old puppy. What training, exercise and stimulation do you give him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laeral Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 My GSD is the same. She likes to talk A LOT. She is a screamer and a whiner. She does whine more when she is bored or hasnt had a walk, so regular exericse and training has lessened the whining. When she gets excited, or if visitors come over she screams the house down. I understand your frustraton, It used to drive me absolutely mad. I think though over time I have become accustom to it and it doesnt bother me so much and she has developed a kind of chatter like a husky. But when she whines I could sometimes happily strangle her Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 missed the 14 weeks bit ... well its a pair of ear plugs and tough love for now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilly Posted July 7, 2009 Author Share Posted July 7, 2009 I started ignoring the behaviour (when we first got him) and only praising the good behaviour. Now that he is older he is getting verbal corrections as well as leash corrections ... and they are hard (because he is a hard pup) but he just doesn't register most of the time. He is on the leash at all times when he is inside but he just never sits or drops without vocals. He can be in a nice drop and still is giving off whinging - it looks like he is yawning. He is now starting to get the "leave" command but he only listens when I am really ticked off - so I guess that command if fine for stuff I really want him to leave (ie something dangerous). Some days I really think it is correction, correction, correction and very little rewarding. He definately goes to bed each night totally exhausted so he is getting lots of exercise. Training is still in 5 minute slots and he is doing really well with the training at home - he gets it right about 95% of the time. Walking on leash is the only thing he has a bit of trouble with - he prefers to hold the leash in his mouth. In about 4 weeks I will start taking him to swimming classes - but I need to wait until he is fully vaccinated before he can go. I was hoping to do some puppy agility with him so he becomes more aware of his feet etc - but again that will need to wait until he is fully vaccinated. Even feeding him this morning was a battle of the wills ... he knows he is to sit and wait for his breakfast and his food word is his release ... but the vocals started because I left him an extra couple of seconds (increasing wait time - now 25 second). How do I make it more fun again? Do I go back to ignoring the bad and praising to good - leaving out any corrections? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Now that he is older he is getting verbal corrections as well as leash corrections ... and they are hard (because he is a hard pup) but he just doesn't register most of the time. He is on the leash at all times when he is inside but he just never sits or drops without vocals. He can be in a nice drop and still is giving off whinging - it looks like he is yawning. Ok referring to the bolded bit (my bold) I would say that because of the constant leash restrictions,plus(hard) corrections..you now have an anxious pup- who vocalises even more because of this whining and yawning are a classic show of anxiety... but I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Walking on leash is the only thing he has a bit of trouble with - he prefers to hold the leash in his mouth. Give him something else to carry?? One reason I didn't ever consider a GSD as a pet was that ones I worked with were such vocal critters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janba Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Are you expecting too much too quickly? 25 secs is a long wait for a 14 week old pup who will still have a short attention span. Keeping him onlead and expecting him to stay still or quiet is also asking a lot - better to put him in a crate if you want him inside and contained. If you are only bringing him inside to train maybe go back to training outside and offlead and make the training a game. Do things like pupy push ups (sit, drop sit etc) short bits of heeling - 5-10 steps - with lots of reward for being beside you and not pulling. You need to make him want and enjoy the training not because it is a regime. The fact that you are having to escalate his corrections shows he is not enjoying what he is doing. I wouldn't be doing strong leash corrections on a 14 week old pups neck as the bones etc are still soft and you may do permanent damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paganman Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 I reckon your being way to hard on the pup and expecting way to much hes only 14 weeks old the whinging and stuff might be coz hes worried and isnt coping with the hard training your giving him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seita Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 I have a vocal pup too! He's a border collie, currently 20 weeks old and he loves to bark and tell everyone that he's not impressed or unhappy about something! I am ignoring most of the behaviour but if it gets excessive he gets told off, muzzeled and when he calms down he gets praised and the muzzel removed. If he's still being difficult at 6 months then the bark collar will come out but not before then... I just have to learn to cope with the insane barking that he does for much of his day. Oh and to make you feel better - no amount of exercise or training seems to change the amount of barking he does. He seems to be a stubborn pup who is just going to take a while to learn that calm dogs get attention and praise and noisy dogs get ignored or corrected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 I think you need to see a good trainer- its concerning that a 14 week old is getting really hard corrections and not improving- he may be a hard pup but if you're giving corrections they should work quickly and you shouldn't have to keep giving them repeatedly in the same situation. He sounds a little confused and to be honest, a whole lot of internet advice is likely to confuse you too which won't help IMHO. He is a baby but babies do become adults so i think its right to try to get on top of this now. What does he love? Does he play tug? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 K9: I agree, you may have a hard pup or just a high drive pup that is learning the wrong way to deal with you, for a start , begin the Triangle of temptation so the pup knows that energy & noise wont buy success, this may be all you need or it may not. I would back off the corrections until you see a pro, the pup will not know how to process the negative information at that level of drive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incavale Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 At 14 weeks he is still teething & that may have something to do with the whining etc. Is he getting bones? Give him whole raw carrots to play with. At first he won't eat it but he will. We chill them when pups are teething. Most dogs don't talk well with their mouth full. Some GSDs just keep on talking & talking & talking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilly Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 At 14 weeks he is still teething & that may have something to do with the whining etc. Is he getting bones? Give him whole raw carrots to play with. At first he won't eat it but he will. We chill them when pups are teething. Most dogs don't talk well with their mouth full. Some GSDs just keep on talking & talking & talking. He eats raw carrot - basically anything I give him ... and yes he can still talk with his mouth full He even talks in his sleep ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incavale Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 I read that you're taking your pup swimming . We had one that talked when she swam . Have a read of the Triangle of Temptation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incavale Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 I think I read on another thread that the pup spends quite some time outside & the intention is that he will be an outside dog. A problem you might have already is a pup with seperation anxiety. We've had a couple like that over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 Some GSDs are pretty vocal, especially when they get excited or anxious. Certain lines are worse than others. I managed to get about 5 years out of mine before she started to become vocal, simply by making sure that I never reinforced her vocalisations. She never, ever got what she wanted if she was making a noise. As soon as she was quiet, I praised her and she got what she was after. Realistically, this can only be successful for so long before you accidentally reinforce whining, or worse, become complacent or busy and let a few through to the keeper. Still, the vocalisation only increased a little until a big life change (birth of my daughter) changed the picture quite a lot. Suddenly I didn't have a life devoted to doing stuff with my dogs. I still make a considerable effort, but they don't come first any more and they know it! Any stress or anxiety will make the problem worse. It is noticeably worse if, say, we have a period of inclement weather and I don't walk my GSD for a few nights. The next time she hears me set the crate up in the car, the shrieking begins. At least I know she is excited! I am lucky in that there are still only a few situations where this happens. Some are easier to deal with than others. If I have to set the crate up in the car, she will shriek at the side gate by the car-port in anticipation. There isn't much I can do about this (that is practical), but I CAN train her to shut up as I approach the gate. I just stop approaching the gate while she is making noise, and resume the approach and let her out when she is quiet. Similarly when we arrive at our destination. I will not get out of the car until she is quiet. First lesson learned. Let's say she whines while I am out of the car, I won't open the tail-gate until she is quiet. Second lesson learned. Let's say I can get out of the car and open the tail-gate, and then she starts whining - I let my other dog out and shut the tail-gate again until she is quiet. Third lesson learned, next she has to be quiet before I open the crate, then after she is out of the car, then as we begin our journey etc At least we can arrive somewhere without too much fan-fare. Getting there is another story, but given my lack of time and resources I have just decided to put up with some whining on the journey to our destination. I should probably give her something to chew and see if that keeps her quiet, but it's remarkable how much something will stop bothering you when you've decided to accept it as part of a compromise. If she is being walked or trained a lot it isn't really a problem, so I just consider some amount of whining in those trickier situations to be useful feedback and get on with giving my dogs as much recreation and training as I can manage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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