alanglen Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 (edited) Just a slight grump because I'm sure I'm not the only one who has encountered this! Trialling yesterday with very nice pass (for a CCD title, only her fourth entry) and outside the ring of our stays, multiple competitors took their dogs up to the judging sheet to check their final scores. 4 handlers and 4 dogs, the dogs disagree and a handler shouts "NO", "get back" and "DROP", of course my 17 month old on the end of the ring, automatically drops and then looks at me all confused! AAAAAGGGGHHHH there goes the quick title because of an inconsiderate person!!!!! I'm not willing to train my dogs to ignore the word No! She ignores wheely bins, tennis balls being thrown, other dogs and all sorts of distractions at club! I can't believe the complete rudeness and poor manners of these people, could they not have waited 3 minutes!!!!! So we played games and made it fun for her because she really is a nice little working dog (something I have not had in obedience much before!! giggles!) but the people really need to think more! There should be a manner list for humans before entering a trial! Edited to add, is there any way to prevent this at a trial?? Edited June 28, 2009 by alanglen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Was that at the Hastings trial? I didn't see that happen - I was in the first group of stays (of 3) and then went as far away as possible from the ring to give everyone a fair chance. Definitely a case of bad manners - how hard is it to wait a few minutes??? What breed of dog do you have alanglen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkySoaringMagpie Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Edited to add, is there any way to prevent this at a trial?? You have to rely on the officials and club committee - most of the time they'll spot someone doing something inconsiderate and tell them to stop but sometimes it's hard to spot something before it's too late. When we were very, very new and wet behind the ears we started disassembling our gazebo near a ring doing a stay. A club member rushed up and told us not to. We were mortified and instantly stopped what we were doing, but we learned to pay attention from then on. Most of the time it's just cluelessness but as you say, it's pretty irritating if you are sitting on a pass! The other thing I think is rude is to regularly take a dog whose stays are not proofed into a ring - whether because they are just not trained well enough or the dog has a DA problem. When Faxon was going through there was one dog who regularly broke his stay in a distracting way. People would pray they weren't next to it in the catalogue. Sure, the other dogs should be proofed, and Faxon once held a stay like a trouper with a small herding dog standing in front of him eyeballing him ;) But I think it's one thing to take a dog in if it's not quite there in a solo exercise, another thing if it has a habit of regularly ruining the day for others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staranais Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 I'm not willing to train my dogs to ignore the word No! She ignores wheely bins, tennis balls being thrown, other dogs and all sorts of distractions at club! I can't believe the complete rudeness and poor manners of these people, could they not have waited 3 minutes!!!!! You could consider teaching her to ignore commands from other people when she's working for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanglen Posted June 28, 2009 Author Share Posted June 28, 2009 I have been trying to teach her to ignore others, she doesn't appear to respond to the judge's commands at all but she is a sensitive girl. We train with a club with lots of big dogs and the handlers speak gruffly to their dogs and she copes really well and doesn't respond. I think it was mostly just bad luck and bad timing and there goes my really well proofed stays! It was the hastings trial, I have chockie labradors, it people from your first group (not u!) that did it to us in the second group. I did tell one of the handlers afterwards, but at least 2 of the 4 people involved should know better. It was just being inconsiderate, I really don't think that they meant to be so loud, or so close to the ring but.... I know what you mean about the stays, I was saw a dog scuffle at knox a few weeks back in the stays with 2 dogs that were not well proofed, made me very nervous for my turn, my girl would have no idea about any of that! I have been trying to teach her to ignore other peoples commands but not exactly sure how to recreate that situation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyStar Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 (edited) Oh I feel for you! I agree, there are some people who really don't think of others at trials. I try to be mindful but as I'm also a newbie, I would hope that if I did something I shouldn't that I wasn't aware of that someone would whisper in my ear so I don't make the same mistake in the future! I've been outside the ring during stays and remember being frozen still as I don't want to distract the dogs I've had people run their dogs up and down the edge of the ring while I've been in the CCD ring and it was distracting for Ruby. Yep, I know I need to proof for more distractions, but I still think it's very inconsiderate to do so. And the 2 judgs I've had also thought so, as they both told the offending people to move off in a not so nice way as the judges must realise CCD dogs in general aren't going to be as proofed and focused as the higher class dogs. One person ran with their dog right next to the ring when we were sitting on our final pass needed for our title during the recall. As Ruby came towards me, the other dog flew past distracted her to what she was doing and she ended up coming back to me in a very crooked front, almost at heel! Lucky the judge didn't fail us cos she said the major part of the exercise wad complied with, the actual coming to me But she did tell that person off for being inconsiderate next to the ring. Turned out, both times, the offenders were a CCD dog who were in the ring right after me! They didn't cause us to fail but we lost a few points. Another time I've been about 30 secs from entering the ring trying to get Ruby focused on me and ready, when this moron in the ring after me brings his dog right up to mine to ask me if I'm in next People would pray they weren't next to it in the catalogue. I had a dog next to me in the lineup one time who is known to bark and whine in a distressed manner throughout the entire stays. I was dreading the stays. And I know it sounds horrible, but I was glad the dog/handler decided not to stick around for the stays in the end! Edited June 28, 2009 by RubyStar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 (edited) It's difficult in the stays when there are reactive, unsteady dogs! It's particularly hard when you have a young dog in the ring - probably one reason I waited until Zig was a bit older before trialling. A GSD approached Zig in one of his trials - Ziggy did everything he could (apart from move) to avoid the dog and was leaning back (and wagging his tail) at the most impossible angle. Eventually the GSD made a leap at him and Zig was forced to jump sideways to get out of the way. I really think someone should have grabbed the dog before it got that far but at least the judge allowed us to re-do our stays. In training last week, a dog tried to play with Zig during the sit stays so it was a wonderful opportunity to be able to race back and stuff his face full of chicken for staying perfectly still and looking to me for direction! To be honest, I will probably skip CCD with my next dog for that reason - some of the dogs in the ring are very under prepared. However, it has been really good to get back into the swing of trialling after such a long absence, practice my ring craft and gain some confidence. I remember your lovely dog, alanglen - do come over and say hello next time....there's not many Mad Spotted Dogs so we won't be too hard to find Where does your girl look when she is doing her stays....at you? ETA: Oops, RS! Zig was a whiner during the stays I think he's conflicted between sitting still but wanting to play with everyone. But I'm working on it very hard and he was so much better this time - a couple of short whines and then he sighed as if resigned to his fate Edited June 28, 2009 by The Spotted Devil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanglen Posted June 28, 2009 Author Share Posted June 28, 2009 Thank-you for the reply! I really am so proud of this little girl! The next trial down here is state trial, but she may be in season by then so it may be a couple of months before I get to have another go! Oh well, she loves it and that's the main thing! It's a shame I get so nervous! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanglen Posted June 28, 2009 Author Share Posted June 28, 2009 Sorry my reply was to the last posting and a bit slow! Spotted devil, she stares at me! She can be a little "looky" but she spends most of the time staring at me and waiting! I realise that she is young but she is really preparing very nicely. I think I hindsight I may skip CCD too, I was chatting to a more seasoned trialler and she advised me to get her out of the lower classes asap! I shall say hello next time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 Sorry my reply was to the last posting and a bit slow!Spotted devil, she stares at me! She can be a little "looky" but she spends most of the time staring at me and waiting! I realise that she is young but she is really preparing very nicely. I think I hindsight I may skip CCD too, I was chatting to a more seasoned trialler and she advised me to get her out of the lower classes asap! I shall say hello next time! I think that's good that she looks at you - personally I would reinforce that behaviour in training - do a stay from a shorter distance and reinforce with food when she looks you in the eye, especially when she looks away at a distraction and then looks back at you. I'm not sure that I'd specifically want to practice with people yelling commands around me - I think I'd put the whole experience down to bad luck (and bad manners!) and keep reinforcing those stays. See you around at the trials! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyStar Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 ETA: Oops, RS! Zig was a whiner during the stays I think he's conflicted between sitting still but wanting to play with everyone. But I'm working on it very hard and he was so much better this time - a couple of short whines and then he sighed as if resigned to his fate Didn't mean to offend! But this dog is CONSTANT. Sounds like you're making progress! I reckon my Millie is gonna be a barker!!! She hates when I'm not in sight! So I will probably not progress far with her if I ever get to Open if that's the case cos I wouldn't have a clue how to fix it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanglen Posted June 28, 2009 Author Share Posted June 28, 2009 Thanks spotted devil, I will certainly be taking the next few weeks to reaffirm her stays, such a shame because she has not had issues in the sit stays and I really did think I was taking in a well proofed dog! How many dogs in CCD could cope with a tennis ball over their back, mum running away or falling over, wheely bins, BBQ smells, people calling dogs, birds etc? she has no problems with these but the "no" word has not been in my training routine! They only hear that word when their safety is at risk! But I certainly am nervous with a lot of other dogs who don't appear to be as prepared! I shall see you around S.devil! We will be back and in novice very soon no doubt! It depends on her season as to if I can get a trial in before or not, I don't think there are any others until august 1 with state trial? (We are tracking during the geelong trials) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 (edited) It's ok, RS! The whining popped up out of "nowhere" so hopefully it will pop back there with a little more work Yes, alanglen, things are quietening down a bit - we have a Group 7 obedience trial late August which I plan to enter as it's held by the Dally club. I may also consider the state trial but July is very busy for me. There's no rush anyway. Don't get too worried about her breaking her stays - go back to basics and heavily reinforce her and that will help. Plus, I find it's not until Zig actually stuffs something up (often just offering a behaviour) that he really understands what the exercise is Oh, I can't wait to have a shot at tracking! Maybe next year. Edited June 28, 2009 by The Spotted Devil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanglen Posted June 28, 2009 Author Share Posted June 28, 2009 Jindi loves tracking! She has her TD and is going on further in a few weeks, providing this season stays away! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogdude Posted June 28, 2009 Share Posted June 28, 2009 I reckon my Millie is gonna be a barker!!! She hates when I'm not in sight! So I will probably not progress far with her if I ever get to Open if that's the case cos I wouldn't have a clue how to fix it I start them off sitting on a corner of a wall (at the 90 degree angle) and postition yourself so that the dog is looking on one side, and you can only see the back half of him. You can be less than a metre or two away and he won'nt know it as long as you are downwind and quiet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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