Tick Treatments

[HarleysMum]

Hi, we live on the south coast NSW right by by the sea with the escarpment and bush around us. We have 2 setter dogs which were both clipped and trimmed to be manageable for spring/summer grooming and searching for ticks with both on revolution and wearing tick collars. But this wasn't enough. One of our setters got 2 paralysis tick on his back thighs (one on each outer side). We have been recommended proban - with 2 large dogs that works out about 7 tablets every 2 days, the other alternative is frontline. I'd like to hear from those with practical experience which method is the best/safest for our dogs. Obviously we're checking them every day aswell as spraying them with permoxin but can't decide the best step forward. luckily our setter survived - the ticks had been on him 2 days and he was already experienced paralysis in his back legs and throat - he was administered the anti-serum and is ok now. But this was such a scare for us and we feel very naive that we thought we had them protected against this - but obviously not so. It's a mindfield of different products for ticks/fleas/heartworm - some do one but not the other.... Which product/s works the best in the environment we live in to cover ticks/fleas/heartworm?

[puakenikeni]

HarleysMum

You live in Coledale? Is that down in the gong? If so - can you tell me if dogs are allowed on Coledale beach? Ive emailed council 3 times and no response.

Good to hear your setter bounced back after the tick incident

Now.

Onto your query. If i remember correctly - there was some sort of incident about Proban in that some dogs got violently sick on it?

I think the best thing you can do in your situation would be to use Frontline Plus and apply it every two weeks to keep the ticks at bay. Not too sure exactly what other "spot ons" do ticks but im sure some of the cluey ones will be here soon to give you a better answer.

[HarleysMum]

yes we do - we're opposite Sharkey Beach - there are a few beaches on the North Coast of the Gong - from Austinmer this is about what I know re dogs allowed on beaches:

Austinmer = strictly prohibited

Little Austi = yes, allowed off lead

Sharkeys = not off lead, but allowed on lead- signs went up about 4 months ago

Coledale Beach = prohibited (but off-season in winter you'll find dogs on the beach)

Now as Sharkey beach is home to a number of dog owners and is home to serious surfers - (with most surfers bringing their dogs which wait for their owners at the edge of the water - all in a line ) - you'll find numerous dogs off lead on the beach, ignoring the signs. Most of the dogs and owners all know each other and get on well. When summer really comes however and the tourists hit the beach no doubt the inspectors will be out - but otherwise early morning and evening you'll find mostly dogs and surfers enjoy sharkey beach! Our dogs don't run on the beach only because we'd probably never see them again!! they're still in training! hope this helps

[puakenikeni]

Much appreciated. Thankyou very much.

[gusgem]

Correct me if I am worng, but I thought revolution only did fleas....I know I will be automatically corrected by the flea/tick treatment nazis when I ask that.

I am in sydney close to the coast and my dogs are always at the beach. I use frontline and a tick collar, but the thing is you really have to be religious with it. It is not 100%, nothing is. Some dogs even get them with using proban, which I haven't personally used myself.

I think the main thing is to be really anal about checking them. Frontline tends to give a better coverage then just a collar because it travels through the oils in the coat and can go to the back end. if you can afford it, get the spray, works much more effectively, but the nagain, you do have two big dogs!

As for heartworm, I use the injection, but purely for convenience! Some people on this forum believe you can't give to certain dogs and it is unsafe in collies etc etc but if they actually talked to a vet, they would find out that it is ivermectin that collies react to not what constitutes the proheart injection.

I think you will find it hard to find something that will work for everything!!

hope your doggies are ok now.

Just reading back- gosh I sound like an angry bitch!!

[HarleysMum]

i'm definitely getting the impression that frontline is the way to go and i'll look into the injection for the heartworm. does frontline also guard against fleas? I know i sound stupid, but when we first looked into this we were recommended revolution as being better than frontline for a certain reason - but it wasn't obviously ticks!!? it's such a mindfield out there - and i'm sure the proban way works for some dogs but it's a large amount of tables for each dog every 2 days and that's got to have some effect on them. Hubert is prone to a reaction - after he was bitten one of the tick bites the bite swelled up and was hardened underneath and we had to put him on a course of antibiotics and the vet said he was skin sensitive. He is also allergic to proplan food due to the preservatives and additives in the non-breeder packs (even though they advertise them in the pet places as perfect for show dogs etc??) . I think Hubert will be the one that will have difficulty taking proban. Harley is much sturdier - he luckily hasn't had a tick bite so far, never any fleas and doesn't have sensitive skin. but i would prefer to have both dogs on the same treatment otherwise it will get too complicated. I had heard of something to do with a sonar sound device that ticks can't stand the sound of and they don't go near the dog - but maybe I was dreaming this??!!

[puakenikeni]

Hi again

Yes Frontline Plus does fleas as well.

And you're right - there are so many products out there and its very easy to get confused. You might want to do a search and read some of the old threads on "fleas", "heart worm" etc etc.. I know Rappie helped me make my decision on flea/hw treatment so u might want to get more technical advice from her?

[Divine Angel]

Hi, I live close-ish to you (Nowra) and I called my local vet yesterday as I was a bit confused about all the info I read on here.

My pup will be a large dog and the vet recommended Frontline because otherwise, Proban would be 4 tablets every 2 days.

Daily checks are a MUST (obviously).

You should also invest in a tick collar and be aware that some of these may cause a reaction on the dog's skin.

Hope this helps

[stand. poodle fan]

I live in a very high risk paralysis tick area and have used Proban for years because ticks can get into nasty areas like ear canals, mouths and bottoms where the only possible product that will work is one that is in the bloodstream. My dogs also swim frequently and during show season I bath them twice a week so I feel that anything applied topically will have diminished efficacy. My showdog has a huge coat so searching is impossible. Tick collars stop working once they are wet so if your dogs swims or even gets wet during rain it stops working (I would also be worried about topically applied products if you have children who touch the dog often as there is the chance that they could be injesting/absorbing these chemicals). You can use some products in combination but get a list of these from your vet because some can be toxic when used in combination.

[Mystiqview]

Proban Tablets:

One tablet/10kg dog given every 48 hours. It has to be given pretty much every 48 hours to keep up the toxity in the dog. So if you miss one.. well...

Frontline plus: top spot every two weeks. Can work out very expensive, especially if you have more than one dog.

Tick Collar - Bayer makes Kiltix and Virbac makes Prevent tick.

Bayer collar claims to last up to 6 weeks where the Virbac brand claims 2 months.

It is all dependant on how often you wash the dog, how long the dogs coat is and how often the dog goes swimming. All these can affect the length of time the collar is effective. The collar is also only really good for the neck, and chest areas (where most ticks attach).. It is not really effective for between the pads and rear ends, where ticks can also attach.

The companies claim that the product is waterproof, however when you wash the dog, you remove some of the poison (dont wash with collar on) however if you have long haired dogs, it can take up to a week for the poison to work its way back through the coat.

Final: Tick rinses. These last between 3 to 7 days. Fido's tick rinse claims 3 days and Permoxin claims 7 days. Some of the other brands such as Maldacin and Malaban last 7 days as well, however you cannot use these while on Proban or tick collars as it uses the same poison and when used together it can poison your dog.

Best method.. daily checks. Even using any of the above, they are not 100% guaranteed. Every product still recommends daily or twice daily checks.

Areas to avoid: creeks, srubby and long grassed areas, as these are where ticks love to reside. However short grass where scrub is nearby can also have ticks as possums, birds, bandicoots and kangaroos/wallabies are natural hosts to ticks and the tick can hitch a ride anywhere.

If you find a tick on the dog, no matter how long and what signs are presenting (there is another thread on ticks), you need to keep the dog quiet for at least 48 hours, even if there is no visible signs of paralysis. Tick toxin can affect internal organs, and serious paralysis often leaves an interal organ scarred.

If you have to see a vet for the tick anti-toxin, it will cost at a minimum of $250. One of my bitches this year (first year in 12 we had a tick on this property) she had to have the syrum, it cost me $250, and she was only very mildly affected. If your dog is affected by ticks, you need to keep the dog quiet for at least 3 weeks after the syrum.

[HarleysMum]

thank you very much for such a thorough breakdown of all the options. With both dogs being long haired (have been clipped but still have length on the legs, stomach and chest), also with long grasses everywhere and of course the sea, hosing down after sea runs, rain, weekly baths etc. the daily check is a necessary precaution. When Hubert was administerd the anti-toxin it cost us $400 - so obviously with both dogs at risk it could be a very expensive season.... We've decided to go on revolution and keep the tick collars but change them regularly and we take them off when they're near water or it's raining etc. But as you say nothing is 100% so a daily check on both dogs (normally my husband does one and I do the other - but last night I had to do both - took about an hour!) - is the only way to go to be sure. I just hope a company comes up with a sure way to avoid our pups ever getting ticks, we'd be devastated as any dog owner would of losing our beautiful pups. Just as well we don't have children yet - tick monitoring is a full-time job! ;)

[Mystiqview]

Harleys Mum,

I do not know much about revolution, but did not think it did ticks.

Just check the active ingredient as if it is the same/same family as the tick collar you can poison the dog.

Swimming/washing is the worst for tick collars... rain unless they are out in the downpour should not affect it. I am lucky here as I do not have long grass where I am and I do not frequent dog parks that much where there is scrub.

[mita]

Huskymiko....thanks for that great run-down on all the options & preventions. It's the kind of info that should be in brochures handed around to pet owners.

And I like how you've said...that even doing all those things...there's no 100% guarantee that a tick won't get on your dog.

We're all still reeling at the death of the prettiest, sweetest Tibbie girl ever... in the area north of Sydney. She was on Proban etc & groomed by a doting owner every night.

The fatal flaw in that case was misreading the symptoms. The Tibbie started to limp on 1 front leg...& the owner thought she'd sprained or injured it. Phoned the vet clinic & found that her special vet....who's always looked after her...was on the next day. So an appointment was made. Hours later, saliva began pooling in the Tibbie's mouth....& the owner thought she'd got stressed.

At last her legs 'went' & the devastated owner realized it could be a tick. It was! On back of neck, right next to collar. Treatment came too late & she died.

So please spread the news that the first symptoms may be other than 'going in the back legs'...it can be throwing up, saliva pooling in mouth, appearing to limp on one leg (back or front), making strange sounds in throat.

Also use a strong magnifying glass when searching for ticks. And it's necessary to look for a crater or hole where the tick might have been but has gone...leaving the toxin in the dog.

Edited November 27, 2004 by mita

[Maverick]

There has been alot of talk about this on one of the Yahoo groups. A vet finally spoke up and her suggestion was that you use Frontline with a tick collar. Double back up but still do daily checks.

She said that Frontline can reduce the severity of tick paralysis.

Also, the tick collar can be fatal if eaten so no good if you have puppies or dogs that like to rip each others collars off.

[Mystiqview]

Harleys mum,

Checked with the vet yesterday as I had to get some heart worm stuff. Revolution DOES NOT do ticks.

He also said that do not rely on Frontline for ticks. From what they are seeing it is proving to be ill-effective (we live in Tick country).

Vets main recommendation is proban or collars with twice daily checks. If dog has long coat, clip it.

Have heard the virbac collar is worse for poisoning if eaten/chewed. Then if I had young puppies, I would also be sus about the bayer one too - as pups just love to chew.

[HarleysMum]

our vet agrees with yours - we saw him on Saturday for their annual heartworm injections he said there's only a month to go of the heavy tick season in this area and he recommended for our dogs to stay with the tick collars as the product on the tick collar spreads through the coat, advantage for fleas but no frontline or proban, just continue with the daily rigourous checks, we which are doing religiously!! I trust his judgement, he's an excellent vet and knows our dogs well, so I'm presuming he's recommended this course of action specifically for our dogs others will no doubt be different, depending on where you live etc. He was the one that treated Hubert recently for his tick bites.

[Luna]

Is anyone familiar with a monthly injection to prevent ticks? I think it starts with D but I am not sure and it only costs about $12 for a Labrador size dog. Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks

[HarleysMum]

Hi Luna, from everything I've heard, read about or discussed with my vet I haven't heard of a monthly injection for ticks. If there is one - I would love to know about it! but i doubt it exists otherwise we wouldn't be forced to use frontline, proban etc, particularly at the prices they charge for the treatments. The best scenario would be an annual injection that covers everything: ticks, fleas, heartworm, other worms etc etc. With the way that tick anti-serum is produced I think we're a long way away from a convenient way to take good care of the health of our dogs, but I'm sure they're are plenty of people out there that would contribute to research to support such a product becoming reality... it's up to the veterinary pharmacuticals to make it happen - the demand is certainly out there!!

[Guest sonyaw]

Just wondering how other breeders go when they have a few dogs with tick control?

We have just moved to a tick area, and I just spent a fortune on frontline but it doesnt last for that long as you know, but I dont think Ill be able to afford to but it every couple of weeks, we currently have 3 adult dogs, 2 younger ones and a litter of pups who are 5 weeks old.

So far we have been here (coffs harbour area) for a month and Ive only had one tick on a dog, which was only a tiny brown tick on one of the younger dogs, but it hadnt attached itself so I was lucky there, we just bought some new dog runs so the dogs are now up on the paved area outside the backdoor, as so far so good with no ticks.

Our cats now are a different story, we have 4 of these and so far we have taken paraylasis ticks off them nearly very day, they have all been frontlined but I still do the daily checks and they are getting big buggers on them.

So what do other breeders use when they have quite a few dogs?

Should I just stick to doing the daily checks? Or still go ahead with using frontline or something else on them as well ??

Thanks in Advance

[Mystiqview]

I have borders.. Long coats and use Tick Collars. Call me skimpy, but Proban for multiple dogs over 10kg is very expensive unless you can buy a bulk supply at a cheaper rate.. (have not been able to do so yet).

You can also use Frontline in conjunction with tick collars...my personal experience with frontline is that it is not worth the paper it is written on.

If you wash the dog, use something like Fido's or another pryethian flea tick/rinse. Do not use solutions like Malaban, Maldacin etc as these products use the same chemical used in tick collars and proban.. you can overdose the dog on the poison.

Point to remember with tick collars.. it does work throughout the coat, however if you have a long haired dog, it can take up to 10 days to get back through the coat...

For me: tick collars and twice daily checks. I have also cleared the yard of as much scrub and rubbish as I can to limit the ticks. However this does not stop birds from dropping them in the yard. I also do not have a tree corridor for animals like possums to enter my property. I also keep my dogs away from creeks and other scrubby areas. If I take them to the beach, I take it to one which has no scrub nearby. (Sandgate beach is great - unlike Nudgee, which has mangroves nearby the off lead area)

For those Queensland readers: January Issue of Dog world has a two page article on ticks. (Have not heard of a monthly injection either, and our vet regularly posts articles in the local newspaper.. if there was such a thing, I would think that he would have posted it.. But I will stand corrected if there is something new on the market)

Edited December 26, 2004 by Skyes Dalimit