Opinions Fpr A Rescue Dog

[peibe]

Because a dog growling is not fear aggression

A dog will growl if someone goes to their food, steps on them, etc

does not make them a bad dog

We try to humanise dogs too much and need to remember they are dogs

They will growl when scared

Bark when angry or happy

Not all growling is fear based

Fear aggressive dogs do growl. I don't know if this dog is fear aggressive, which is why I was careful to use the word "might" frequently. My dogs don't growl if I go near their food, if they did I would not accept this as normal and would rectify it. I am the last person to humanise an animal, but I will not accept aggression in my dogs towards humans and I would be concerned enough with this dog to have a professional trainer assess it. I certainly would not consider growling at humans ok by any stretch of the imagination.

Because a dog growling is not fear aggression

Not all growling is fear based

Again, I am unsure what you really mean as the above two statements are contradictory. Did you mean that fear aggression was not expressed by growling, as you said in the first bit?

I did not say that Fear Aggressive dogs do not growl

I said that if a dog growls it is not always fear aggression

What is wrong with a dog using its growl to voice it displeasure?

A warning is always a good thing from an animal, does not make them bad

They are dogs

I actually think a dog growling at a person is a serious issue. I also know that dogs with aggression issues are not necessarily bad dogs (I have one). But I also know that taking on a dog with aggression issues means 'day in day out' vigilance for the new owner - for the rest of that dog's life.

growling does not mean aggression - its part of the vocabular repetoire of a dog in order to communicate with a human or another canine. The dog you worry about is the one that doesnt say anything at all and just *bang*.

Remember too some breeds communicate differently through growls - there is a play growl which my dogs do with me, there is the rotties growl when he wants his food or attention, there is the malinois growl that someone is on the property and she's heard them at night.

Dogs with aggressive reactions are not bad dogs - the truely 'bad' dog is the one that can never be controlled and needs the vet, about .00001% of the dog population is unfixable to some degree. You also have to be careful how 'vigilant' you are as well about something that may be trivial - I have seen owners treat their dogs like they could suddenly morph into the Devil just because they had a growl or showed some teeth once. Have a good investigation and you find the poor dog was just caught in that moment and panicked or reacted from extreme pain/stress etc.

So many different possibilities its not fair to tar a dog with the 'untrustworthy' brush because he behaved like a dog.

Perfectly said, I wish I could of put my words into exactly what you have written

[Loving my Oldies]

Upshot is. I took into the pen, all was well full of cuddles and kisses. I left the kennel, the owner a chap went in with a bed, pointed at the dog saying go to your bed and the dog growled...thats it...no bite, no rush just growled.

I feel that the whole situation was out of character for the dog. The mans body language was not the best but he breeds dogs, has boarding and seemed a reasonable chap for the short time I met him.

If someone showed me to my room, pointed at me and said: go to you bed, I'd probably growl too. Just because this man breeds and has boarding kennels doesn't mean he knows anything about dogs. Probably knows less than I do - LOL. At least I know not to start ordering a dog around within 2 seconds of meeting him.

If he'd crouched down, talked sweetly and calmly to the dog and showed him his bed with little treat in hand, none of this would have happened.

Poor dog - thank god he has you on his side.

And, yes, I have a dog (admittedly a small dog) who growls all the time too. We go to bed and Danny spends the first 1/2hour growling at every movement and the smallest twitch that I or one of the other dogs might make. Drives me mad, and nothing stops him. Sometime he is so bad that I take his muzzle in my hand to shut him up .

[Are You Serious Jo]

I said that if a dog growls it is not always fear aggression

Please point out where I said a growling dog is always fear aggressive? The OP was concerned enough to ask about a behaviour and I mentioned that fear aggression was one possibility based on two things she described. Thankfully she was sensible enough to talk to a trainer as suggested. A growl does not automatically make it a bad dog and I can't remember anyone saying it did. What it does indicate is that someone who knows what they are talking about should assess the dog as the OP wasn't confident enough to determine what was behind the behaviour. Can you tell me what the hell is wrong with suggesting that an inexperienced person take something seriously, because a dog that growls can mean behavioral issues that would result in a bite in the wrong hands.

Seriously, are you trying to tell me that dogs that have bitten people never ever growled first?

[Nekhbet]

Seriously, are you trying to tell me that dogs that have bitten people never ever growled first?

not every dog that bites will growl - there are breed/learned factors that can mean a dog will not growl first. Both my OH and myself have been privvy to these situations. It does happen.

[Rusky]

many dogs that bite do not growl first.

[peibe]

I said that if a dog growls it is not always fear aggression

Please point out where I said a growling dog is always fear aggressive? The OP was concerned enough to ask about a behaviour and I mentioned that fear aggression was one possibility based on two things she described. Thankfully she was sensible enough to talk to a trainer as suggested. A growl does not automatically make it a bad dog and I can't remember anyone saying it did. What it does indicate is that someone who knows what they are talking about should assess the dog as the OP wasn't confident enough to determine what was behind the behaviour. Can you tell me what the hell is wrong with suggesting that an inexperienced person take something seriously, because a dog that growls can mean behavioral issues that would result in a bite in the wrong hands.

Seriously, are you trying to tell me that dogs that have bitten people never ever growled first?

Do you just follow me around to pick at my comments?

I was answering your confusion, you thought I was saying the above

Never said all dogs who bite do or do not growl

Lots do not growl

Never mentioned anything wrong with seeing a Behavourist and actually recommended it myself

All my rescues see one if I am unsure of temp issues, better to have someone outside your circle giving you and outside opinion

Never said anything was wrong with an inexperienced person asking another for help

and frankly and experienced person should too because sometimes the emotional attachment that goes with a rescue dogs leaves them unable to make an unbiased opinion

You seriously have a way to twist works jdavis

Seriously, are you trying to tell me that dogs that have bitten people never ever growled first?

not every dog that bites will growl - there are breed/learned factors that can mean a dog will not growl first. Both my OH and myself have been privvy to these situations. It does happen.

many dogs that bite do not growl first.

Thanks, I was starting to think I was the only one who thought this way

Sorry to bring this to your thread

I will keep my opinions to myself from now on as jdavis seems to be on my bandwagon?

[Nekhbet]

nope ... the ones who do think that way havnt been exposed to enough dogs.

[Rusky]

Thanks, I was starting to think I was the only one who thought this way

Sorry to bring this to your thread

I am pleased you did and like nekhbet think that probably they just haven't been around dogs as much as some of us.

this is from Ian Dunbar which sums up no growling better than I could

Basically, most dogs have two bona fide reasons to bite: 1. Because they are dogs and that's what dogs do and 2. Because by and large, people are not very nice to them.

When dogs are upset or frightened, they don’t call a lawyer, or write a letter of complaint, they simply growl and bite. Ironically, in the rare instances when a (usually) fearful dog does follow through, he is often accused of unpredictably biting without provocation — without warning and without reason. In reality though, there were most certainly many good reasons for the dog to bite and he most certainly gave numerous warnings, even though the warnings may have been too subtle for most human observers.

Many dogs do, however, bite with little threat or warning, but this has very little to do with aggressiveness. On the contrary, the vast majority of dogs bite because they are fearful, frightened, unsocialized, and/or lack confidence. A bite might be expected if the dog were cringing, or snapping and lunging, but often the dog's standoffish demeanor is the only overt warning. And of course an unsocialized sleeping dog may bite if disturbed or frightened. Other dogs bite due to uncontrolled rambunctiousness. The dog may be in a decidedly happy frame of mind and is only doing what he did as a puppy, because no one taught the puppydog that unsolicited playbiting was unacceptable. Now the adolescent dog's playfulness is out of control and he hurts people. Thus a dog may bite with nary a growl. Indeed, the biting dog may be playfully wagging his tail!

There is an additional, quite insidious reason for a dog to bite without warning. Originally the dog would growl whenever he was upset. Although people heard the growl, they did not listen to what the dog was saying. The dog was upset but no one paid heed. Instead they punished the dog for growling. The dog now had two reasons to be upset, the original reason and the fact his owner is angrily bullying him — and so, the dog growled more. Unfortunately, the level of punishment was increased until it effectively inhibited the dog from growling. The dog no longer growled, but he was still upset, in fact, very upset. Now we have the equivalent of a time bomb without the tick. The dog is doubly upset but no longer shows it, because the owner systematically punished him for trying to communicate his feelings. By all means instruct a growling dog to shush but ALWAYS investigate and attempt to resolve the underlying cause.

[peibe]

Thanks, I just wish I was more articulate sometimes would get me out of trouble lol