Guest Willow Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) I have two dogs, one of them has had the following intermittant signs for the last three or four weeks: Every few days, I will wake up to a (normal) poo in the lounge room (unusual for him). Then that morning he will not want his breakfast. Later that day he will have diarrhoea, which will either be pale grey & watery with white mucous, or like raw egg white with blood.....there is almost no odour. He will have this for a few hours (half a day or so), then suddenly be fine and normal for a few days (up to a week) ...and then the cycle starts again. I need to stress that he has been to the vet, who is completely baffled. She saw him in the middle of one of his "funny turns" and all his vitals were normal, and he was totally calm (he had the resting heartrate of a very fit dog apparently). A faecal sample has been sent to the lab, but could be a few days before we get the results. We don't have any poisons on the property (none at all, not even any locked away safely, I just won't have them around) and he is not a dog who will eat random junk he finds lying around. He doesn't eat unusual things on walks, and I doubt it's contagious, as our other dog is the picture of health, despite having the weaker immune system of the two due to cancer treatment last year. I am totally baffled.....has anyone seen anything like this in their own dogs???? :rolleyes: Edited March 20, 2009 by Willow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Something in the dim recesses of memory is whispering "hookworm".... Or IBS ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted March 18, 2009 Share Posted March 18, 2009 Irritated bowel would be my (lay person) guess. Mucus covered poo is one symptom. Start keeping a food diary and note what he eats and when this happens. My guess is that it may be related to a particular food. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Willow Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 Something in the dim recesses of memory is whispering "hookworm".... I'm obsessive about worming......I guess anything is possible, but worms would be unlikely (fortunately) Irritated bowel would be my (lay person) guess. Mucus covered poo is one symptom. Start keeping a food diary and note what he eats and when this happens. My guess is that it may be related to a particular food. Food diary is a good idea PF :rolleyes: Poor little thing, it must be awful having a sore tummy actually, it's interesting you both mention IBS, because he has been a bit windy recently too.....that's a symptom in people isn't it??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogbesotted Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 coccidioses perhaps. one of the symptoms is jelly like clots with filaments coated in red blood cells.... also colitis can cause this (IBS) just throwing up ideas H Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cockerlover Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 Excess bones? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stitch Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 I have a 6yo bitch who was getting stomach upsets with accompanying diahorrea 'accidents' much the same as you are describing with your dog except her accidents were always placed as close to the back door as she could get, poor girl and were probably every 3 weeks or so. She was also losing a little bit of weight so I took her to the vet several times, to try and get an answer. After trying everything else he did bloods, etc. and nothing showed up as unusual. This problem continued on for a few more months with no diagnosis so he put her on a course of antibiotics, can't remember which ones unfortunately, but after that she settled right down. We presume it was a low grade infection, the exact cause we will never know. I now know that I can't give this dog too much to eat at one time as this seems to upset her. Also I have to keep the fat content low so one could suspect collitis from that but no definite diagnosis. Hope this helps but I would be interested to hear what your vet turns up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rose of tralee Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 As soon as I saw your title, I thought whipworm. Best for a correct diagnosis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rose of tralee Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 As soon as I saw your title, I thought whipworm. Best for a diagnosis. edited to delete a word for clarity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felix Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) Coming in cycles would suggest a parasite. I agree that whipworm fits the symptoms. Your vet should probably look at the poo sample. Have in mind that in between those episodes there actually may not be parasites in the poo. Edited March 19, 2009 by felix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Willow Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 Excess bones? No, I don't feed bones......I can definitely eliminate that as a reason. I have a 6yo bitch who was getting stomach upsets with accompanying diahorrea 'accidents' much the same as you are describing with your dog except her accidents were always placed as close to the back door as she could get, poor girl and were probably every 3 weeks or so.She was also losing a little bit of weight so I took her to the vet several times, to try and get an answer. After trying everything else he did bloods, etc. and nothing showed up as unusual. This problem continued on for a few more months with no diagnosis so he put her on a course of antibiotics, can't remember which ones unfortunately, but after that she settled right down. We presume it was a low grade infection, the exact cause we will never know. I now know that I can't give this dog too much to eat at one time as this seems to upset her. Also I have to keep the fat content low so one could suspect collitis from that but no definite diagnosis. Hope this helps but I would be interested to hear what your vet turns up. Thanks stitch....glad your girl is ok.....I'll post the test results when they come through. Coming in cycles would suggest a parasite. I agree that whipworm fits the symptoms. Your vet should probably look at the poo sample. Have in mind that in between those episodes there actually may not be parasites in the poo. I really don't think it could be a worm problem.....I use drontal allwormer which covers agains hookworm, whipworm, roundworm & tapeworm. I use this every 12 weeks, and in between I use a tapewormer as we live in a rural area & I am paranoid about hydatids......I hope it's not a worm problem after all the effort I put into keping them worm free!!! 'tis a mystery...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pomquest Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 Like dogbesotted said....a test and/or treatment for cocci wouldnt be out of place. Cocci can kill. S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TangerineDream Posted March 19, 2009 Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) Sounds like chronic pancreatitis - around the time it started did he have anything that was very fatty like a bone or bacon? What do you feed him? Cadence (previous GSP) was like that if I didn't watch the amount of fat in his diet like a hawk.....I used to get poos like that when he had been having a diet with too much fat for the previous few days and it got to a level that his pancreas couldn't process...and off the cycle would go again.......learnt what I could feed him regularly, what I could feed him for no more than 2 days etc..the magic number with tinned food was 7% fat and with dry food 8% fat - any more and about 5 days down the track that's exactly what we'd have...back onto bland chicken and rice and yoghurt for 4 days then slowly back to normal diet..... Edited March 19, 2009 by TangerineDream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizzy06 Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 Sounds like chronic pancreatitis - around the time it started did he have anything that was very fatty like a bone or bacon? What do you feed him?Cadence (previous GSP) was like that if I didn't watch the amount of fat in his diet like a hawk.....I used to get poos like that when he had been having a diet with too much fat for the previous few days and it got to a level that his pancreas couldn't process...and off the cycle would go again.......learnt what I could feed him regularly, what I could feed him for no more than 2 days etc..the magic number with tinned food was 7% fat and with dry food 8% fat - any more and about 5 days down the track that's exactly what we'd have...back onto bland chicken and rice and yoghurt for 4 days then slowly back to normal diet..... Sounds like Chronic Pancreatitias to me too. My girl suffers from it and i'm in the process of trying to work out her system. I get her under control and then 3 months later it happens again. Normal blood tests don't usually diagnose this disease. Lizzy was sick for a few months and they couldn't for the life of them work out what was wrong, at one stage they thought her kidneys were failing. After me nagging they finally did a test that gets sent to W.A and i think it is about 80% accurate at diagnosing pancreatitis. Finally came back positive. So now it is a matter of trying to control it. It is a horrible painful condition. You said about not eating food and then a few hours later your dog will? this is what Lizzy was doing all the time. The thought of food sets of pains in the pancreas. Lizzy will go to eat food and then it is like something stops her and she cannot eat. She will also eat alot of grass and sometimes vomit and you can tell that something is just generally not right with her, a lot more quieter, a little depressed perhaps and very glassy looking eyes! I strongly suggest you ask your vet for this test. If it is Pancreatitias you shouldn't be feeding the pooch and they should be starved for at least 24 hours. Also some dogs just cannot stomach virtually any fat at all. Liz is just getting over a flare up at the moment and i cannot work out what set her off this time. So now i will be keeping her diet to the absolute bare miniumum of fat. (don't know how i can go and lower though honestly) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stitch Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 Lizzy06 what are you feeding to control the pancreatitis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizzy06 Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 Lizzy06 what are you feeding to control the pancreatitis? I wouldn't say she is controlled exactly! But i have her on Royal Canin Low fat digestive tins / biscuits. I feed that in the mornings and evenings i was feeding her boiled chicken or kangaroo, blended vegies and rice. I'm trying to work her little body out still. She is also on Enzyplex (enzymes with each wet meal) she flared up over the weekend after 3 months of doing well. So now i'm back to the drawing board of working out what went wrong. ALl i can think is that i was over feeding her in the evenings or you see she has a drinking problem... hardly ever drinks so i was sitting down with her in the evenings with around 100-120mls of water with a little cottage cheese in it to get her to drink. Perhaps it was to much water for her body to take. So i will stop this and stop the cottage cheese. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TangerineDream Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 I always cooked Cadence's food if I could and the following gave me good control of his condition and he didn't have an attack for 9 years - I learnt to recognise the signs of an impending attack - ie: poos would get runny and then start to be jelly like and I'd instantly change his diet.. normally.... chicken mince boiled (1kg in water in microwave for 12 minutes) cooled and into the fridge till the fat congealed on the top - scrape all fat off and throw out) used to add white long grain rice and small amount of oatmeal cooked together. With him I used Supercoat because he could deal with the fat content (8%), but another might suit your dog better - just be mindful of the fat content being the baddy. If he showed signs of an impending attack he went straight onto boiled chicken fillets (human quality from Coles) and boiled rice with no oatmeal for 4 days with a tablespoon of Greek yoghurt mixed in. Nothing else at all till his system settled down.... Rule was that no-one but me ever gave him food without asking, and I had to approve it....... he never ever had any of these since the first attack... no fresh bones (marrow not good for them either) no bacon no chicken skin no ham no treats other than Bonio biscuits (all of the other treats including dried liver) had too high a fat content no rawhide chews, pigs noses etc no gravy no cooked meat of any kind- the fat content of all of them was just too high. He could eat the little Pal pouches of food when travelling but only for 2 days out of 10 - after that the level in his system would mean that he had to go back to his normal diet - that 1 extra day could have tipped him over the edge....... interestingly (the vet was surprised) - he could eat cheese with no ill effects It's really a case of getting know what your dog can and can't deal with - go onto boiled chicken breasts and rice till the poos have been stable for about 4 days, then start introducing 1 change every 10 days till you have his diet to what you want...any sign of a problem, back onto chicken fillets, rice and yogurt...then try a different change.. hope this helps you guys a bit, worked for us, but did take a while to work it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizzy06 Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 I always cooked Cadence's food if I could and the following gave me good control of his condition and he didn't have an attack for 9 years - I learnt to recognise the signs of an impending attack - ie: poos would get runny and then start to be jelly like and I'd instantly change his diet..normally.... chicken mince boiled (1kg in water in microwave for 12 minutes) cooled and into the fridge till the fat congealed on the top - scrape all fat off and throw out) used to add white long grain rice and small amount of oatmeal cooked together. With him I used Supercoat because he could deal with the fat content (8%), but another might suit your dog better - just be mindful of the fat content being the baddy. If he showed signs of an impending attack he went straight onto boiled chicken fillets (human quality from Coles) and boiled rice with no oatmeal for 4 days with a tablespoon of Greek yoghurt mixed in. Nothing else at all till his system settled down.... Rule was that no-one but me ever gave him food without asking, and I had to approve it....... he never ever had any of these since the first attack... no fresh bones (marrow not good for them either) no bacon no chicken skin no ham no treats other than Bonio biscuits (all of the other treats including dried liver) had too high a fat content no rawhide chews, pigs noses etc no gravy no cooked meat of any kind- the fat content of all of them was just too high. He could eat the little Pal pouches of food when travelling but only for 2 days out of 10 - after that the level in his system would mean that he had to go back to his normal diet - that 1 extra day could have tipped him over the edge....... interestingly (the vet was surprised) - he could eat cheese with no ill effects It's really a case of getting know what your dog can and can't deal with - go onto boiled chicken breasts and rice till the poos have been stable for about 4 days, then start introducing 1 change every 10 days till you have his diet to what you want...any sign of a problem, back onto chicken fillets, rice and yogurt...then try a different change.. hope this helps you guys a bit, worked for us, but did take a while to work it out. Thankyou for this. Wow i will be the happest person in the world if i can get Lizzy to have not more atacks for 9 years!! Were you giving a few meals a day as well instead of the one main meal? Would i tbe possible to get a dogs system to handle a different meal in the morning as to the evening. As for instance. The digestive food in the morning and then chicken / rice / vegies evenings? Did you used to feed vegetables. Is Chicken fine for a rest of their life diet ie no red meat? you also said NO Fresh Bones. Was there some sort of other bone you fed. My girls back teeth are pretty horrible. I try to brush them daily.. but tthey are still dirty. I had taken Lizzy to the vet on saturday for follow up blood testing on her kidneys and it was the next morning she vomited etc. I rang the vet and said i thought she was fine until she had been there. He said perhaps the stress of her needles (as she was yelping set her off) i find this a little hard to believe. Her poos were abnormal for a few weeks solid but like a yellow / greenish off colour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TangerineDream Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 No bones at all - too much fat....I scaled Cadence's teeth with a human dentist scaler (picture upside down GSP snoring) or used the greyhound 2 x 4 biscuits...occasionally gave him vegies but not often.....no red ever meat at all and he was as healthy as, so chicken for the rest of their lives is fin - you do need to boil it to get the fat out unless you feed straight fillets (I wasn't rich enough!)! The result after the stress of the vets visit sounds like colitis thrown in for good measure, not unusual.......forgotten what is good for that - there's a natural additive I read somewhere.... I used to give Cadence an Evening Primrose Capsule also at night. Once I had stabilised his system I discovered that I could feed Cadence some VIP roll, weetbix, water & a teaspoon of milk for colour in the morning...be careful with even a tiny amount of milk though until you know what your dog can take or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InspectorRex Posted March 20, 2009 Share Posted March 20, 2009 Could be Inflammatory Bowel Disease- NOT to be confused with Irriatable Bowel Syndrome Your Vet needs to do at least a faecal float and analysis and see what that shows up and then decide if a referral to an Internal Medicine Specialist is warranted. To test for IBD the dog goes under GA and has endoscopes done and biopsies are taken and sent off to pathology. I know as I have had one dog with it and I have the same condition myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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