Guest rhapsodical78 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Genuine question- why not switch to an am staff? Who have the same qualities? Apparently not Cosmolo. Amstaffs are not working dogs. They are just pretty. Apparently neither they, nor any other bull breed are: extremely versatile, loyal, intelligent, active, game, focussed, agile, courageous, good looking, affable, good humoured, outgoing, biddable, affectionate and have solid nerve. Further, they love people, including children and are very reliable Or so Rhaps would have me believe. I'd have thought that a Bull Terrier or Amstaff would offer these qualities in a dog that is not a restricted breed. I get that people don't want APBTs to become extinct. I don't get why people who don't want to abide by laws can't be encouraged to own a breed that doesn't require such a restricted lifestyle. I don't think its in any dog's interests to live that life but that life sure beats impoundment and euthanasia. This conversation is getting circular; you're clearly just not going to get why people are passionate about one breed over another. Kind of odd for a dog person, but there you go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhou Xuanyao Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 pf you dont sound like your even reading the responses to your questions your just repeating the same things over again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 But if there are some lines of Am staffs that have the desired qualities, why not choose them vs a dog who will have to live with everything that comes with a RB tag and possible persecution/ seizure and euthanasia? They're not the only breed with the qualities you mention. I don't think most people who choose to own a pit do it thinking thats the only way to get those qualities either-most people don't think about those things. I have met some lovely APBT's- but also met some papered am staffs who were extremely similar in temp and behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 pf you dont sound like your even reading the responses to your questions your just repeating the same things over again. maybe its not really pf maybe a chimp has abducted her and taken over the computer I keep repeating the same questions in the folorn hope that someone will actually try to answer them Calsonic. Still hoping. At least Cosmolo seems to be trying for the same answers. The only bull breeds other than Staffords I have seen in agility or obedience are some Sydney Amstaffs in agility. They go at it with gusto! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rhapsodical78 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 But if there are some lines of Am staffs that have the desired qualities, why not choose them vs a dog who will have to live with everything that comes with a RB tag and possible persecution/ seizure and euthanasia? They're not the only breed with the qualities you mention. I don't think most people who choose to own a pit do it thinking thats the only way to get those qualities either-most people don't think about those things. I have met some lovely APBT's- but also met some papered am staffs who were extremely similar in temp and behaviour. I think I mentioned that conformation has to take precedence with the amstaff, even if other areas are focused on. I'm not saying you can't have both, but I think you'd have to be pretty damned careful and you'd never know what you were getting. All registered breeders seem to play the 'I breed for original temperament' card. At the end of the day it's all about conformation because that's all that counts in the ring. But if you don't understand what it is to be passionate about something then I don't think this conversation is going to work. Try asking a Collingwood supporter to go for Carlton. They both play football, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Don't know what makes you think i don't know what its like to be passionate about something I am passionate about not getting a dog thats bound to end up seized and dead because i broke the law instead of looking a bit harder for a breeder who bred the qualities i wanted in a dog. Not all registered breeders show? So they are not all breeding for conformation in the ring. And what makes you think you'll get the qualities you want in a dog from a BYB of APBT's? How do you 'know what you're getting' with a BYB pit? Nobody dies if i choose to cheer a certain football team- the same cannot be said for me choosing to own an APBT in many states. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) This conversation is getting circular; you're clearly just not going to get why people are passionate about one breed over another. Kind of odd for a dog person, but there you go. What I don't get Rhaps (PF here not chimp) is why people who are passionate about a breed would knowingly subject it to an uncertain life when another dog with similar characteristics could live far more freely. I see it from the perspective of a dog person who thinks all dogs deserve more than a life of muzzles, leashes or potential euthansia. I don't get why people who "love" big cats want to keep them in small cages in their back yards. I dont understand why someone would want to keep a restricted breed in suburbia where it can never run off leash outside its backyard without the risk of impoundment. I can appeciate what people see in ABPTs. I was blown away by the first one I met (at an obedience trial). But sorry, its no life for a dog. Move to the ACT if you're a responsible and passionate APBT owner. Your dog can live the life he or she deserves. If you don't want to do the right thing by your dog and your community, then don't get one and dont' come here please. Edited January 21, 2009 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rhapsodical78 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Don't know what makes you think i don't know what its like to be passionate about something I am passionate about not getting a dog thats bound to end up seized and dead because i broke the law instead of looking a bit harder for a breeder who bred the qualities i wanted in a dog. Not all registered breeders show? So they are not all breeding for conformation in the ring. And what makes you think you'll get the qualities you want in a dog from a BYB of APBT's? How do you 'know what you're getting' with a BYB pit? Nobody dies if i choose to cheer a certain football team- the same cannot be said for me choosing to own an APBT in many states. And I'm passionate about preventing the eradication of an entire breed. The breed needs to be kept alive in this country, whether that offends your good-girl sensibilities or not. I'm also passionate about getting some sleep. Goodnight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhou Xuanyao Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 they have been answered you are just not listening because you think you already know better. the poodle owner who is apparently a pitbull expert. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) I don't think breaking the law is the way to do it- nor do i think its fair on the dogs. And i'm entitled to that opinion just as you are yours. I understand your passion, i don't agree with BSl either- but choosing to condem a dog to a life as a restricted dog, or flying under the radar until the dog is seized/ euthed is not something i agree with. Have a nice sleep : ) Edited January 21, 2009 by Cosmolo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) they have been answered you are just not listening because you think you already know better. the poodle owner who is apparently a pitbull expert. Im the poodle owner who coined the term "BSL targets the wrong end of the leash" and the person who'll be in the front line if they even suggest the introduction of BSL here Calsonic. It's most unlikely and has no support from Domestic Animal Services or the RSPCA. But keep up the insults and the chimp comments - its pretty standard form for APBT fanciers when debate arises about any aspect of their breed. Don't offend my intelligence with the "we're all in this together" line though. I've seen what passes for "solidarity" in anti-BSL arguments before. I don't pretend to be an expert. I also don't pretend to understand why a person would willingly subject the breed they love to a less than ideal life. Its a question that remains unanswered in this thread. Edited January 21, 2009 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhou Xuanyao Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) pf i dont want to fight with you but you have been acting like a know it all, your not listening, and then saying well just get another breed all the temperments are alike. ease up on bieng so offended and consider that some of the stuff you are saying is also not only annoying but offensive to other people. Edited January 21, 2009 by calsonic350z 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) pf i dont want to fight with you but you have been acting like a know it? your not listening, and then saying well just get another breed all the temperments are alike. ease up on bieng so offended and consider that some of the stuff you are saying is also not only annoying but offensive to other people. Being repeatedly asked the same question would be annoying I suppose. Pity that rather than responding with accusations and insults, you don't try answering it. BTW: I have NEVER suggested all breed temperaments are alike. I did say that many breeds were capable of fitting Rhaps definition of a 'working dog'. Edited January 21, 2009 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 But cal- i have heard many APBT owners and enthusiasts say that the AST is the same dog different name? So is it really another breed in reality? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tybrax Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 There has never being new blood introduced, same genetics. tybrax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Many people want actual working dogs. Not ones that are just bred to look pretty. No, True.. the pigs don't care what a dog looks like poor pitties.. blessed with schwarzenegger muscles and a solid temperament means they can be used /abused willy nilly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amstaffchick Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Try asking a Collingwood supporter to go for Carlton. They both play football, right? These little comparisons are great Rhaps but as yet you have still neglected to outline EXACTLY what it is you feel an APBT can offer you that a GOOD LOOKING AST cant??? Are you looking for a dog who can take down a bull? is that much call for that sorta thing in the burbs? or anywhere else these days? All im getting here is that you dont want a " pretty dog"? Sure i can concede that there are a few who breed over sized very bully type AST'S that are a far cry from the ancestors and a few even look as if they would find a 2 km jog being logged under the " too hard" pile, but if you have a good look around there are some very nice examples of the breed out there too... I just dont understand what it is you feel the APBT can do that an AST cant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wobbly Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 (edited) I don't often come into this forum. It saddens me that I am pretty much a criminal because I went to the pound & fell in love with a dog without papers. It's depressing that there is so much fighting in this forum, often it seems to me this forum makes us enemies of each other & when of all issues BSL should be the one to unite all dog lovers. I just have this to say: Please stop fighting. They've come for the APBT, they're going for the Staffies & Rottis, the media is looking to victimise mastiffs too now. Please support all of us whose dogs are jeopardised due to an unjust law. We really need all the help we can get at the moment. Divided we fall, united we might just stand a hope in hell. Edited January 21, 2009 by Wobbly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 You could always go and request an NOI from your council, have your dog breed assessed, that way you wouldn't have to feel like a criminal for having a dog without papers, you'd have a slip of paper that says you're not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ownedbyamstaff Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Hi all, Sorry I know this is off topic but I'm still learning all the bits & pieces of BSL. Just a question, if a dog has 1/4 amstaff in it is it still on the restricted list, or if a dog is 1/2 amstaff & can prove it is Amstaff is it also restricted?? Sorry again but I thought this may be the best place to find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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