Keeshond First Seizure

[persephone]

Well- at least you now know what's happening, and can work on that .

*fingers crossed for your girl *

[dogbesotted]

damnation! sounds nasty from a lot of different point of view.

Sending many positive healing thoughts your way and prayers for a good outcome..

Helen

[Lynlovesdogs]

Aw, thank you guys so much.

Went in to see her before work this morning. She seemed almost like her usual self. When she saw us, she was barking in the cage as if to say "let me out!"

then we kinda just walked around, she seemed keen to want to go home.

Her ECG isn't quite normal as yet. but its better than before. and she seems pretty stable so.. *fingers crossed* she may be able to come home tonight.

Thanks all..

after this, we have to consider whether we want to do an MRI and then a liver surgery....

*kicking myself for not getting insurance*

[Rysup]

Hi Lyn,

I only just found this post.

I cannot comment on the heart condition, as I have no experience with dodgy hearts.

If the seizures continue and are not linked to the heart problem, and her blood panel comes back clean, then you have to consider idiopathic epilepsy as the cause. Epilepsy is present in the breed. Do you know her pedigree? I can have a look and see if I think she is likely to have a hereditary problem in there if you wanted.

Also worth mentioning to the vet that Keeshonds are known for PHPT - Primary Hyperparathyroid - which can have a range of symptoms. There is now a DNA test available for this disease, so we test for it before breeding now.

Sending lots of healing vibes to Hazel. Feel free to PM me if you want.

Hugs

[Lynlovesdogs]

Hi Rysup,

That's great information. as I know u breed keeshonds. I'm at work now, so i'll email you more when I get home. but i'll try and get some results and stuff so i can be more specific with me when i get home.

perhaps u can tell me whether I have anythign to worry about.

I'm afraid I don't know her pedigree. is there anyway to find out? I only got her 2 years ago and she's about 7 now.

[Lynlovesdogs]

Hi all,

not much news but yes hazel is home. she's still just tired and witrh the weather, it doesn't help...

so the nes isn't that much better except that just keep giving her her medication.. her heart sorta seems better but still abnormal... so.. not good..

she's almost not as completely back to herself as she was before... and i'm just overworreid i guess....

the funy thing is her bum is kinda itchy cos its shaved and it's the shaved bit of her tail is tickling the shaved part of her bum

its quite funny.. she'll just suddnely get up and go to another spot.

[TerraNik]

Glad to hear that she is home. Hoping she recovers quickly and they work out the cause.

My kees, Jedi just got desexed and he has a shaved belly/bum - he haaaaates it!!

[Rysup]

Hope Hazel is feeling better.

Has she had her calcium levels checked?

Do you know who bred her? Anything I could use to try and chase up her pedigree?

[Lynlovesdogs]

Thank you all for all your support. She's as good as she can be.. just a little overprotective and worried about her now while I'm at work. but will be checking on her every few hours.

Rysup: not sure about her calcium levels< but if i look at the blood test, she did test for Calcium which was 2.62mmol/L and the levels are (1.9-2.9)?

no idea about her breeding at all. I couldn't even find the last vet she used to go to ...

[Rysup]

I was not sure what the calcium levels should be but did a bit of reading and came up with this below, so assuming the measure is the same, then Hazel's calcium levels sound like they are low.

What are the signs of PHPT?

PHPT can manifest itself in many ways. The primary symptom is hypercalcemia, or an increase in blood calcium. Currently the normal range for adults is considered to be 8.9-11.4. A blood calcium above this is a warning sign. If this is the case, a second blood test for Parathyroid Hormone (PTH) can be taken. The ONLY lab in the U.S. that currently runs this test is at Michigan State Univ. It takes about 10 days to get the results, which are usually conclusive.

Another sign of PHPT is loose teeth and brittle bones, both due to calcium loss from bones. When these signs are present, the disease is probably well-advanced and there is probably irreversible kidney damage.

The four parathyroid glands are situated on the thyroid itself, and the role of

parathyroid hormone is to restore calcium levels when they drop. Calcium is also

activated by Vitamin D, and 99% of it is stored in the skeleton.

Only six canine diseases lead to high calcium, and PHPT is the second most common,

after malignant tumors. The relatively simple diagnosis makes the condition easier to

identify than more complex diseases like hip dysplasia. However, the average onset at

11 years of age makes genetic testing more challenging than with diseases that appear in

younger dogs.

A further challenge is that PHPT symptoms like weakness, trembling, and bladder or

kidney stones may be missed, or attributed to a dog’s age. The condition is almost

always linked to a single, non-malignant tumor, and the resulting hormonal shifts can

lead to kidney damage when unattended. With early diagnosis, PHPT is cured in 90% of

cases.

Edited January 21, 2009 by Rysup

[Rysup]

I found this which I thought was interesting reading. Just some ideas you might be able to throw at your vet.....I realise that PHPT normally presents with HIGH calcium rather than low, but these things dont read the rule books. I just think it would be a good thing to rule out. This is from here http://www.vetinfo4dogs.com/dhypocalcemia.html

Low blood calcium levels (hypocalcemia) can be indicative of a number

of conditions so there are other possibilities. In addition, calcium is

one of the lab values that seems to have a high error rate in lab testing.

Finally, calcium is bound to albumin (a form of protein) in the blood

stream and if albumin levels are low, total calcium levels will be low

but ionized calcium (the active form) are normal. In this case, the

hypocalcemia is a false finding even though the lab is correctly

reporting the measured calcium levels.

To correct for calcium levels to compensate for albumin levels, using a

formula. One example of this is: Adjusted calcium = (Measured Calcium

- albumin) + 4.

To give you some idea of how this works, if the calcium level is 6.5,

but the albumin level is 1.4, then the adjusted calcium level is: (6.5 -

1.4) + 4 = 5.1 + 4= 9.1

The most common causes of protein levels falling low enough to cause

low total calcium levels are intestinal disease in which protein is not

absorbed or leaks back out of the intestines, glomerulonephritis in

which protein leaks out of the kidneys and liver failure in which proteins

aren't manufactured from amino acids by the liver. In German shepherds,

protein losing enteropathies have to be considered as a possible cause of the

symptoms seen in Omar.

Assuming that the calcium level was actually low, though, these are

some of the possible diagnoses:

Hypoparathyroidism, acute pancreatitis, kidney failure in which no

urine production is occurring, nutritional secondary hyperparathyroidism, and

renal (kidney origin) secondary hyperparathyroidism, rapidly growing

bone tumors (can also cause increases in calcium), deficiency of Vitamin D

and thyroid gland tumors (sometimes produce calcitonin, a hormone that

causes drops in calcium levels).

I would consider acute pancreatitis among the differential diagnoses in

Omar's case, because it can lead to a sudden loss of appetite and then

increased drinking and urinating if an intestinal obstruction or

absorption of toxins from the GI tract occurs.

Hypoparathyroidism is also possible. When hypoparathyroidism occurs,

the albumin level is usually normal, the blood urea nitrogen and creatinine

are usually normal, lipase and amylase are usually normal (helps to rule

out pancreatitis), phosphorous is usually increased, parathormone (requires

special testing) is usually decreased and there is usually not a tumor

of the parathyroid gland but a degenerative process,

lymphocytic/plasmacytic atrophy, that is thought to be an immune mediated disorder. The

clinical signs of hypoparathyroidism include seizures, muscle tremors,

difficulty walking, excessive panting, sometimes increases in drinking and

urinating and sometimes restlessness.

Primary hyperparathyroidism is often caused by cancer of the

parathyroid glands but in this disorder there is usually an increase in calcium

levels rather than a decrease. The symptoms are about the same as for

hypoparathyroidism, though. These include seizures, loss of appetite,

muscular weakness, apathy, stiff gait, shivering or tremoring and

increased drinking and urinating that is probably at least partially due to the

high blood calcium levels.

It is not really possible to tell you which of these conditions was

most likely. I am not sure what to make of the urine color as a clinical

sign. This may mean something that is escaping me at the present time, too.

The only causes I know of for green urine are increases in bilirubin, which

should have shown up in the blood work, too, and administration of

methylene blue dye, which doesn't seem likely at all.

The most likely problems would seem to be low albumin levels from

kidney disease or intestinal disease leading to low total calcium level, acute

pancreatitis (usually the patient seems really sick with this illness)

and hypoparathyroidism, but that is still a pretty long list, especially

since some of the other problems are definitely possible, too.

Edited January 21, 2009 by Rysup

[TerraNik]

Thank you all for all your support. She's as good as she can be.. just a little overprotective and worried about her now while I'm at work. but will be checking on her every few hours.

Rysup: not sure about her calcium levels< but if i look at the blood test, she did test for Calcium which was 2.62mmol/L and the levels are (1.9-2.9)?

no idea about her breeding at all. I couldn't even find the last vet she used to go to ...

If the blood test said: 2.62mmol/L (1.9-2.9) usually the normal levels (what you would expect for her) are the ones in the brackets. At least they are for human tests...

[Rysup]

So going by that you would say her levels are in the normal range?

[TerraNik]

So going by that you would say her levels are in the normal range?

Yeah going by what Lynlovesdogs wrote up... But I'm no vet, I could be wrong!

[Lynlovesdogs]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for all the info rysup.

I think so as well for the in range values.

maybe if i could compare the units of the one u posted?