Golden Rules Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 So I am about to get a 6 month old Norwich girl......and she will be spayed of course, sooner rather than later but...... The breeder suggested letting her have her first season before spaying her whereas I was talking to my vet last night (who has 25 years of experience and has been wonderful with my boy) - she recommended getting Floss desexed before her first season as it almost 100% reduces the risk of mammary cancer apparently. Can anyone tell me what is the benefit of letting a bitch have her first season before being spayed? Is it a myth like letting them have a litter of puppies first, sort of thing? Or is it common practice? I have only ever had males who have all been desexed as soon as they came to me if not before. That was so easy to deal with! I will likely follow the breeders recommendations (as she is family) but I want to make sure I am indeed doing the best thing for my new little dog, and I am interested in the thoughts and ideas about when is the best time to spay a bitch. Thanking you in advance. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest belgian.blue Posted December 17, 2008 Share Posted December 17, 2008 I heard from Ivy breeder that it's best to get them done before their first season. Then you've got to deal with a leaky red female. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Hmm ArtyFarty - I have been battling this dilemma at the moment and still haven't got my 8 month old BC girl desexed (although she will be). There are some people recommending that performance dogs only be spayed once they have fully matured so they have the hormones available to close of the growth plates appropriately. So I think the recommendation is around 14 months. She hasn't had a season yet but I know its only a matter of time before she might come in. Her mother apparently came in at 9 months but a half sister didn't come in till 11.5 months. My girls breeder usually recommends spaying at 8 months to bitches she puts into pet homes but has said if I can look after her properly there is no reason why I couldn't have her done after 1 season if I wished. She recommends any boys are desexed between 14-16 months. So at the moment I am leaning towards letting her have 1 season but that might change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest belgian.blue Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 How long do they normally bleed for I'm wondering? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leema Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 If you can keep her safe from pregnancy, then there is no need to get her desexed, ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Apart from the convenience factor Leema . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted December 18, 2008 Author Share Posted December 18, 2008 If you can keep her safe from pregnancy, then there is no need to get her desexed, ever. No, she will be desexed absolutely. My dogs get free play at our local park, river and beach. She would be far too popular if I didn't have her desexed I'm a firm believer that the dogs fit into my lifestyle, not me with theirs (even though they have certainly adapted my lifesyle! ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flaves Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 see i dont agree with thtat Leema, unless you are a breeder there is no reason to have an entire animal. it causes inconvenience and accidents can happen Arty, with my girls i have always done them just before their first seasons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted December 18, 2008 Author Share Posted December 18, 2008 Arty, with my girls i have always done them just before their first seasons Thanks i has flava. Why did you get then done so early and not wait until after their first season? Was it for convenience sake? Were you advised to do it that way by anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowenhart Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Mammary cancers are quite uncommon. I'd really like to see the studies of % of entire bitches who end up with them, I am sure the other hundreds of kinds of cancer win out. Seasons are messy and inconvienient, especially first ones! If she looks like she could be coming in, spay just before - the hormones have spiked up so she's finished growing. Dogs need the hormones to trigger a number of important developmental things (like closing of growth plates). For me I don't mind people to spay after the first season or just before. I am however not a fan of early desexing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 (edited) Lowenhart thats what my girl's breeder said about mammery cancer. She said she had never had a problem with any of her entire bitches that she has owned. Edited December 18, 2008 by ness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 (edited) There is no "best" time that suits everyone. What you've got to do is weigh up the various risk factors and make an informed decision. No 1 risk is an unwanted mating/pregnancy. If you have no capacity to safely manage an entire bitch in season then desex her sooner rather than later. If you have kids that will leave doors and gates open and anything less than a very secure run or pen to keep her in when you aren't open, then don't risk it. After that you're balancing the risks of mammary cancer (higher in undesexed bitches) and pyometra against spay incontinence and effects on growth. Were you toying at all with the idea of showing her? You won't be able to compete for her championship points if she is desexed. Edited December 18, 2008 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted December 18, 2008 Author Share Posted December 18, 2008 Lowenhart thats what my girl's breeder said about mammery cancer. She said she had never had a problem with any of her entire bitches that she has owned. That's good. This is the sort of info I need to know. The vet I was talking to last night has 25 years experience in America, South Africa and Australia, and currently lectures at Murdoch Uni. She said she has operated on so many dreadful cases of mammary cancer and assured me I would want to do everything I could to avoid it. So it's great to hear that it seems relatively uncommon here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puggy_puggy Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 For me the supposed side effects of desexing when they are still young, ie around 6 months, are far out weighed by the risk of waiting. And I don't believe that dogs that are pet only should be kept entire. It is said that if you desex before the mature you will get a taller ganglier dog. From looking at my two pugs my taller ganglier one is my male that I actually didn't get desexed untill he was nearly two and my little tank girl was done when she was 6 months. I don't know the exact stats but it I think it is something like 99% of bitches spayed before their first season will not get mamary cancer. I'm not sure what the percentage of mamary cancer in unspayed bitches is. If you desex you don't have to ever worry about your bitch being stolen to be used as a puppy making factory. Accidents do happen no matter how carefull you try to be. Having to put change pads and put doggy undies on and off your bitch every times she goes in or outside is a bloody pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puggy_puggy Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 How long do they normally bleed for I'm wondering? 3 to 4 weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Shepherd~ Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 There is no "best" time that suits everyone.What you've got to do is weigh up the various risk factors and make an informed decision. No 1 risk is an unwanted mating/pregnancy. If you have no capacity to safely manage an entire bitch in season then desex her sooner rather than later. If you have kids that will leave doors and gates open and anything less than a very secure run or pen to keep her in when you aren't open, then don't risk it. After that you're balancing the risks of mammary cancer (higher in undesexed bitches) and pyometra against spay incontinence and effects on growth. Were you toying at all with the idea of showing her? You won't be able to compete for her championship points if she is desexed. was thinking the same thing. I want to see farts hang with the showies I shouldnt be too smart, it could be me in a few years. ..................yeah, I hear ya farts. shush it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted December 18, 2008 Author Share Posted December 18, 2008 After that you're balancing the risks of mammary cancer (higher in undesexed bitches) and pyometra against spay incontinence and effects on growth.Were you toying at all with the idea of showing her? You won't be able to compete for her championship points if she is desexed. Missed this before. The bolded bit I suspect is everything I was asking in a nutshell, thank you The breeder said to me she would be keen to to have a Champion Norwich here in Australia - I said I don't know anything about showing, but would have a think about it. Outcome a few days later: She will be a beautiful show quality pet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted December 18, 2008 Author Share Posted December 18, 2008 was thinking the same thing. I want to see farts hang with the showies I shouldnt be too smart, it could be me in a few years. ..................yeah, I hear ya farts. shush it. OK, I'll say no more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Shepherd~ Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 I heard from Ivy breeder that it's best to get them done before their first season. Then you've got to deal with a leaky red female. I think she would base it on each particular dog? Most breeders do dont they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Do No Harm Posted December 18, 2008 Share Posted December 18, 2008 Can anyone tell me what is the benefit of letting a bitch have her first season before being spayed? Is it a myth like letting them have a litter of puppies first, sort of thing? Or is it common practice? My vet advised to have my puppy bitch spayed mid way between her first and second season adding it's not something that would be recommended to an owner who was not responsible and/or couldn't manage the dog whilst in season. The first season is nature's way of letting us know the animal is now mature. I would never spay or neuter a dog which is immature. Managing the bitch during this time involved some thought and care, but we should all be doing that throughout their lives in my opinion. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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