puakenikeni Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 I was at the vet today and thought i would do some eyeballing of their products. I noticed they are now stocking Royal Canin [which is what i feed Kiara "sometimes"]. Thing is i also got the impression that it was made by Waltham - same company that is pushing the new Optimum dog food because the packaging had a massive "Waltham" logo on it. Interesting since i was thinking of buying Kiara either the supercoat or the optimum when this lot of kibble runs out but i had a look at their label and they didnt tell me much. The label for her royal canin food is extensive and she seems to like it when i give it to her so im not sure now if i will switch her. I dont have an issue in feeding her Royal Canin for the rest of her life if thats whats "healthier" for her [kibble wise]. I will probably eventually barf her when she's older because at least then i know exactly what she's being fed and besides, i have an issue with dog food companies touting their products as containing all this "fibre" etc.. and you find out their definition of fibre are peanut shells. I guess my question is - does anyone here have a better idea of whats in optimum and supercoat coz their label doesnt say much at all.. Im thinking of emailing the optimum and supercoat people and asking them to send me a comprehensive list of whats in their kibble but thought i would ask here because im sure [and hoping] someone will know and be gracious enough to advise me.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cordelia Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 I am using Optimum to feed my pups now and they LOVE it. Getting good poos from the pups, gaining weight, looking good and I think that Optimum is actually a really good feed. Supercoat........ I'm not fond of at all. The pups in particular get the trots so badly on it and it takes days for their bowel to get used it. The poo at least double the amount when on supercaot and it stinks. They also don't like as much as other brands I've tried in the past. If I could afford to feel all mine on Optimum........... I would. (and it smells divine). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 I've heard of Optimum but not seen it. How much does it cost and where can you get it? Zoe is on Supercoat at the moment, doing well but occasionally a bit runny poos, they are fairly big ones. Never had a problem with her eating it - she will eat anything! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puakenikeni Posted October 16, 2004 Author Share Posted October 16, 2004 Lia, I saw some Optimum at Woolies out where i live so im assuming that they're one of the stockists. You'd find it [i presume] at most supermarkets and pet supply places. Its pretty inexpensive too - costs around the same as the Supercoat [i saw a medium sized bag for around $10]. Cordelia: Thanks for that. I will bear the "bigger poos=Supercoat" in mind. I was going to buy Kiara a little bag of Supercoat but now i think i will see if she will take to Optimum coz its easier for me to get than Royan Canin. All of the vets around here stock Hills Science Diet and ive read some pretty poor reviews on their food so i ended up going halfway across town to find the right Royan Canin for her which ended up being around $25 for a 3 kilo bag. Will still check though on the exact ingredients in the Optimum and post it here for you all to have a look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barly Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 I've seen the optium in the shops quite good for price $8 - 9 for 3kg bag. I've used it and had ok results so far, puppies are healthy and happy. Also I have used the pedigree advanced which is about $26 for a 3 kg bag which is also made by "waltham". My puppies did well on it. I have used supercoat in the past it was fantastic about 5/6 years ago but now it's horrible. I will never touch it again. On my older saints I found the Bonnie working Dog to be great. They thrive on it and look great. I show my 7 1/2 year old saint and he looks about 3 or 4yrs. And judges don't believe me about his age until they open his mouth. I have never had a problem with bonnie at all and it's about $38 for 20kg - good value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Riayn Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 From what I understand Royal Canin brought out Waltham's premium/veterinary diet range. All of our old Waltham vet care range is now Royal Canin. Waltham's seems to have moved into the inexpensive grocery dog food market with their new Optium brand. I haven't had a look at it to see if it is any good or not. I would stick to the foods you buy at your vets. Simply because they are from the Premium dog food range (or should be). They use a better quality of ingredients and a fixed food formula unlike supermarket brands which use whatever meat is cheaper this week. Yes, it is more expensive, but you need to feed less of it than you would using an supermarket brannd, so therefore it works out per meal to be the same price or sometimes even cheaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadia Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 Optimum is Principal with a packaging revamp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rappie Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 Yes there was a Waltham / Royal Canin merger - has anyone feeding the veterinary diets noticed a difference in palatability? Just a question of curiosity as I've heard a couple of our clients mention that their cats don't like the low pH diet anymore (despite eating it for the last 3 years) and that the turned up noses coincided with the new bags of food? Personally, although I know the pet food spiels backwards (and am taking part in the big companies nutrition programs) I think the most sensible advice is to feed the best quality food that you can afford and that will provide complete and balanced nutrition to your dog. Obviously there will be differences in ingredients and quality but even most of the supermarket brands meet the AAFCO nutritional guidelines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ANNODAM Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 (edited) . Edited May 17, 2008 by ANNODAM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuppetMan Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 optimum is just the new name for principal - youll notice that disappear from the supermarket shelves i would feed the new types of supercoat over that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Niska Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 I would not use any of these. Royal Canin/Waltham is the only food company still using BHA-BHT preservative/antioxidant in its food. They use the safe level set by AAFCO. But every other food company has changed away from BHA/BHT because it is well documented that the higher the level, the higher the case of cancer in lab rats. Not for me. Now the additive everybody is using is Mixed tocopherol. Which is broken down into alpha, beta, gamma. and delta. The only natural tocopherol is alpha tocopherol. The advantages of alpha tocopherol over mixed is about 300% better. A article I found that helped with my decision http://www.dvmnewsmagazine.com/dvm/article...il.jsp?id=85782 I recommend Nutro for this very reason. Comes with a money back palatability guarantee and guaranteed to improve skin and coat for dogs with a food allergy or dermatitis etc. They also claim to use human grade chemical free chicken and I sent them an E-mail asking if that meant growth hormone as well and the response was YES it has no growth hormones. Their vet range is also the normal Retail range and every bag meets the vet required profiles. Its not well know in Australia as it has only been here 2 years and started in QLD. But the company is now about 76 years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
office bitch Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 Hi Niska, I have never heard of Nutro, do you mean Nutrience? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD19 Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 (edited) Royal Canin/Waltham/Pedigree are all owned or produced by Masterfoods USA. Royal Canin was just purchased by them not more than a year ago. Waltham in the US is only available as a prescription from a vet. Royal Canin is ranked among the premium/super premium brands of dog foods here in the US. Edited November 12, 2004 by JD19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarmons Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Waltham aka PAL, Uncle Bens, Optimum, Principal etc bought out a section of Royal Canin late last year. One of the conditions of purchase was that the formula of Royal Canin remain unchanged. There are no GM ingredients in Royal Canin. It is the best dried food on the market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogsfevr Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Yes thas true walthams brought out royal canin but royal canin do not answer to walthams at all. Royal canin is produced in france & the head office is in france & any problems with the product is directed soley to royal canin, was actually speaking with a rep on wednesday. My setter is on euk plus raw because its suits him but for a good budget biscuit you certainly cant go past Bonnie working dog we use it alot & the dogs luv & are in great condition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puakenikeni Posted November 12, 2004 Author Share Posted November 12, 2004 Royal Canin/Waltham is the only food company still using BHA-BHT preservative/antioxidant in its food. Do you have a source for this info? Ive looked around and didnt find anything anywhere about it. I have been told though that the formula for Royal Canin can vary in different countries and with that being the case - BHA/BHT may be found in some of their food in some parts of the world. Yes i agree - BHA/BHT's are known to cause cancer but they are also found in all sorts of food and cosmetics too. The only natural tocopherol is alpha tocopherol. Tocopherol is Vitamin E and from what i know the only reason why alpha tocopherol is more popular is because it has a higher profile? It is also only one form of Vitamin E no? The advantages of alpha tocopherol over mixed is about 300% better. Hmmmmm.... do u have any other info to substantiate this?A article I found that helped with my decision http://www.dvmnewsmagazine.com/dvm/article...il.jsp?id=85782 You know i read through that article and it didnt seem to finger out alpha tocopherol as being far superior to mixedtocopherol [iMHO] I may have missed something though [its Friday afternoon so you will forgive me. ] You're right though - Nutro is a good food. As is Eagle Pack Holistic, Innova etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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