Rough Play With A Much Larger Dog?

[Pailin]

My pup is approximately 5-6months old at the moment and I sometimes go and visit my sister and take her with so that she can have a play with my sister's dog. I figure the more socialisation she gets with other dogs, and especially family dogs that she will be around in the future, the better BUT....

My sister's dog is a Neopolitan Mastiff and is about 4yrs old. She is a beautiful big girl but obviously quite a bit larger than Lolly and they play REALLY rough. Lolly enjoys it the whole time and there has been only one incident where Lolly has yelped and Suede (the mastiff) backed of immediately only to have Lolly launch straight back in. There has never been any blood shed nor growling that wasn't play orientated and the only injury that has ever come of it is a slight bald patch on the side of Lolly's neck from where it appears one of Suede's claws has caught her. It only removed the hair though...the skin was not broken at all. Lolly is the main perpetrator in the whole thing though and if Suede stops and lays down for a rest then Lolly will jump on her and get it started again... Lolly doesn't bite at all and majority of the play is just jumping all over one another and wrestling- a lot of paws flying etc...

If Lolly is enjoying it should I just let them have fun and play? Will any of the described effect Lolly in a negative way?

TIA

[Miranda]

Be careful, you have two bitches playing roughly on one dog's territory and although the neo is tolerant of your girl at the moment she may change as your bitch starts to mature, extremely rough play can easily escalate into something more serious. They may always be fine together but I'd be very vigilant and never leave them unsupervised I would also be worried about damage to your puppy's growing bones and ligaments.

[Dogsfevr]

My young boy doesnt get unsupervised play.He is a very social boy who will happily play rough without thinking.

It is still very important they have intereaction BUT you must learn when it right for the play to end.

Your girl also needs to learn her boundries & when the line is crossed.

I have a very beautiful older setter here who just dots on our small breed BUt our littles are taught the rules as are my big kids & you must always play it safe .

As miranda said growing joints also are a big factor

[poodlefan]

I see a couple of difficulties with very rough play:

1. Not all dogs will learn that rough play with one dog doesn't mean you play that way with all dogs. Your pup may get some very harsh receptions if that style of play becomes the norm, especially after maturity.

2. Big size differences between dogs can lead to the younger dog suffering from the interaction, especially from a chiropractic point of view. That may have long term implications.

My view would be to allow some play to occur but to step in when you think its been for long enough or if its getting over the top.

[fifi]

Be careful, you have two bitches playing roughly on one dog's territory and although the neo is tolerant of your girl at the moment she may change as your bitch starts to mature, extremely rough play can easily escalate into something more serious. They may always be fine together but I'd be very vigilant and never leave them unsupervised I would also be worried about damage to your puppy's growing bones and ligaments.

exactley as Miranda said. I started to type a response but realised Miranda had covered it well already.

people in the yard supervised play for a little while is okay, but as soon as it gets rough, time to call time out and separate them.

fifi

[Pailin]

See that is the thing though....it starts and stays rough with those two. The moment they see one another they get started. It doesn't slowly escalate so it is either full on or not at all.

Lolly does seem to differentiate between different dogs and different play....She doesn't harrass my Mum's old mini foxy at all (he's grumpy) and she leaves him well enough alone. She is also very submissive and gentle in playing with my Mum's Staffy bitch who is very dominant.

Oh and it is always supervised.

So I would be better off not socialising them? Or controlling it more (as in both leashed)? Any other suggestions?

Edited November 14, 2008 by Pailin

[fifi]

We usually walk a gentle oldie with our pups, but sounds like Suede (great name) is still very much a big puppy.

Perhaps you & Sued's owner could take them on a lead walk together, so their initial meeting is more controlled, they have the edge taken off with a little walk, and then a little play in the yard. If it's still too rough, remove one.

take you puppy to classes & other socialising events as well so that Lolly learns that not all meetings with other dogs are straight away rough & tumble.

Teach her that when she is on lead is walk, stand or sit quietly time.

the Training forum on here will be able to help you more.

fifi

[Miranda]

Look I'm a real party pooper, I don't allow rough play full stop, there's just too much potential for injury (especially if there's a size difference or if one or both of the dogs are puppies) or for the playing to escalate into something much more serious. If I were you I wouldn't allow the two dogs to play like they do, I'd prefer to take them both on an on leash walk or something like that.

I do realise that some breeds play much more roughly than others, but I think some people let this sort of thing go too far and I prefer to be safe than sorry. JMO

[Dogsfevr]

You have to realize that free for all playing isnt educating.Dogs learn form what is considered normal behaviour by there owners(just like kids)

Whilst its socializing your youngster needs to learn the on/off button

"Lolly is the main perpetrator in the whole thing though and if Suede stops and lays down for a rest then Lolly will jump on her and get it started again."

This is where you need to do something.This is not teaching her manners & allowing her to annoy the other dog just encourages her "behaviour" as such.This is when you need to place her onleash & allow her to learn where the line is drawn

As i say i have a 7 month old here who would dearly luv to play with my other to boys BUT he is growing & i dont want any damage but he also needs to learn that dog doesnt equate to play.Dog equates to civilized behaviour unless told otherwise.

He is around my other boys,sleeps with my other boys & interacts in the house with our littlies(onleash) as hes learning who to behave .Its important that he socializes correctly.

He is a gem at the shows & just loves life but he respects me & whislt being a doofas is his thing when excited around dogs he will listen to me when asked ,my word means way more

Maybe its from the show point of view that i dont want my dogs to automatically presume that if it has 4 legs its play time.I want mine to listen to me & they can play on my terms & finish on my terms.

He will be a powerful boy so i dont want my arms ripped out do to his presumptions just as theres nothng worse than another dog owner whos dog is going retarded because its doesnt understand lead etiquette or time out behaviour.

When he first arrived my oldie was his teacher but now hes growing up he gets supervised plays with my oldie/My other setter & him would play till the end .

I think what you need to understand its a bit like going to kindy where you have the children who have manners & do things nicely & you enjoy being around & then there is the feral child with no boundries or manners that after awhile drives you insane.

Dogs can be the same & what they learn as puppies often moulds them for life.

It sounds like they get on well which is super but i personally think you need to read the older dogs body langauage & when its had enough that means its enough for both