RoxyNHemi Posted September 21, 2008 Share Posted September 21, 2008 Hello all, As you may, or may not know, I bought home a Westie pup just over a week ago. I am having issues in teaching him to go toilet, where he should. Whenever he does it in the wrong spot, i growl at him and put him on the newpaper in the house, or outside.. He doesnt get the point that he should be going on the paper/outside and pees wherever he feels, in particular on our running mats, or the pillows on the floor for them to lay on. The other thing is, when we put him to bed at night, we walk them out the back for 15-20 minutes first, he never does anything, then we put him in his crate, which has a bed one corner, newpaper over half, and food/water in the other corner, and he walks straight onto his bed an wees on it. I blamed myself during the week, as we only spent two full days with him, before returning to work, but I thought he may have got the point as he has been corrected in the evenings, as well as we spent all weekend with him this weekend. The very rare occasion that he has gone outside/on the paper he has been praised VERY highly, but the point doesnt seem to of got accross. He is now at the point that when he heres me growl, he runs.. Any suggestions of what i am doing wrong / right and how to help this come along quicker Sarah - who is fed up with washing pillows, floors, running mats... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domestic Dreamer Posted September 21, 2008 Share Posted September 21, 2008 (edited) How old is your pup and how often are you bringing him outside to toilet? Don't growl at him. ETA: Just saw your pics in the other puppy thread. He's only a small wee thing. Constant vigilance is really needed at the beginning and they can't hold on for very long. When I got Sasha at 12 weeks I took her out almost every half to one hour. As soon as she woke, after a play, about 10-20 mins after eating, and sometimes if it just seemed she hadn't been in awhile. I also took her out 2-3 times a night. Her crate was in my bedroom and she let me know when she woke up and needed to go. It was a small crate with only room for her bed, no newspaper. It was EXHAUSTING but paid off as she's never had an accident indoors. We never did newspapers, she learned that the toilet was outside from day dot. I also used a cue word when I wanted her to go and praised praised praised when she did. She pees on command now. If you growl at him he'll just be scared of you and try to be sneaky about it. Just take him out more regularly. He doesn't know how to hold it yet, and won't be able to give you signals that he needs to go until he's older. Edited September 21, 2008 by Maiko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionaC Posted September 21, 2008 Share Posted September 21, 2008 The other thing is, when we put him to bed at night, we walk them out the back for 15-20 minutes first, he never does anything, then we put him in his crate, which has a bed one corner, newpaper over half, and food/water in the other corner, and he walks straight onto his bed an wees on it. Hi Sarah (your pup is adorable BTW) - I would suggest making the crate only with bedding. I have an 11 week old pup here at home and although we bought the larger sized crate it is only his bed ... we partitioned it off so that he had enough room to stand up, turn around and lie down ... as he has grown we have increased the size of the accessible section of the crate ... this way there is no confusion for him - crate = bed only... food, drink and toilet happen elsewhere .... Are you also cleaning his "mistakes" up with a proper cleaner? - I found that the normal carpet cleaners just weren't working - he was always having accidents in the same place - last weekend we bought some "Urine off" and sprayed the area - since the spray we have had no mistakes at all ... if there is even the smallest amount of scent in that area he will be able to smell it and think thats his toilet area ... To get Mort to pee on command (which he almost has gotten down pat) we took him outside after every drink, every bit of food, every big play session, we watched him constantly for the nose down sniffing and running in circles behaviour and got him outside as soon as that started ... when he did a wee outside we stood there saying "do wee's" over and over again, when he did one he got a treat (high reward level kind of treat which for Mort is a piece of cabanossi) .. we kept doing this and now we can take him outside and its only 10-30 seconds before he will do a wee ...... We also chose not to go the newspaper path cause of any possibility with confusion, what we did though (cause Mort is inside whilst we are at work) is to buy a length of fake grass - we put that in the corner of the puppy room on a sheet of plastic and he goes there during the day when we are not home ... when we are home he goes outside - obviously there is a difference between fake and real grass but it was closer than what I thought between newspaper and grass .... Oh and more pictures please! he is soooo sweet! - oh and whats the little one's name? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Fox 001 Posted September 21, 2008 Share Posted September 21, 2008 I'm doing the same as Fiona and it is working a treat with our boy. His crate is only for sleeping, no food, water and just enough room to move around and lay down full stretched out. We have been moving the barrier, but he is growing so fast will have to remove it all together this weekend coming I reckon. We have also been taking him outside from the first day, no newspaper or grass inside. Apart from the first day when we had two mistakes, which were of course my fault as I missed the signs, we haven't had another one since (I've got the hang of it now ) During the day, now that I have to go to work, he is in the yard with access to his kennel and run and so far (touchwood) he hasn't even gone in the kennel. Was wondering when we could expect him to show us some sign of wanting to go out though? Not to hijack your thread Sarah but you might want to know for later also. At the moment we probably don't give him the chance to ask as we're so onto taking him out every hour, after sleeping, after eating, after big playtime etc to make sure he doesn't make a mistake. He is only 11 weeks so think we will continue this for a while longer before we expect him to ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
je33ie Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 As you may, or may not know, I bought home a Westie pup just over a week ago. I am having issues in teaching him to go toilet, where he should.Whenever he does it in the wrong spot, i growl at him and put him on the newpaper in the house, or outside.. He doesnt get the point that he should be going on the paper/outside and pees wherever he feels, in particular on our running mats, or the pillows on the floor for them to lay on. The other thing is, when we put him to bed at night, we walk them out the back for 15-20 minutes first, he never does anything, then we put him in his crate, which has a bed one corner, newpaper over half, and food/water in the other corner, and he walks straight onto his bed an wees on it. I blamed myself during the week, as we only spent two full days with him, before returning to work, but I thought he may have got the point as he has been corrected in the evenings, as well as we spent all weekend with him this weekend. The very rare occasion that he has gone outside/on the paper he has been praised VERY highly, but the point doesnt seem to of got accross. He is now at the point that when he heres me growl, he runs.. Any suggestions of what i am doing wrong / right and how to help this come along quicker Sarah - who is fed up with washing pillows, floors, running mats... Hi Sarah, Your puppy is still very young and expect accidents for many weeks yet. Geordie's 16 weeks tomorrow and she still has accidents. A few things we did (other than what Fiona mentions above are: 1. Clean up any spill with 1 part white vinegar, 3 parts water. Don't use soap, disinfectant or any other usual cleaners as apparently dogs are attracted to these and will probably go in the same spot again. Geordie's never gone in the same spot twice so the vinegar does work. Also, when you wash his bedding, don't use washing powder, just throw in some vinegar. But be warned - don't let the dog lap up the vinegar because Geordie did this once and she didn't like it one bit!! 2. When you take him out for his final wee before bed, make sure he does one. Even if you have to stay out there for half an hour be patient. Also, when he does wee, praise him, give him a treat, but don't take him inside right away. Try waiting another 60 seconds or so and play with him. If you bring him in right away he'll soon learn that wee time means bedtime and he'll hold off as long as he can. 3. When you catch him weeing (and only when you catch him, if you find a wee a few minutes later it's too late for correction) interrupt him by clapping or something (don't growl as this will only make him afraid) and call him outside with a treat. When he's at the door, give him a treat, when he's out on the grass give him another treat. This will teach him to walk to the door himself when he needs to go. 4. Take him outside every 10 minutes! Until Geordie was about 11 weeks she did wees every 10 minutes while she was awke. It used to worry me but now I know it was simply what puppies do. Also remember that puppies may wee 4 or 5 times when you take them out, so make sure you wait about 5 minutes each time or he'll come right in and do another wee. 5. And last of all - remember it's your fault if he wees inside. Don't ever blame the dog or think that he's not getting it, because it's actually you who needs to learn the "I need to do a wee now" signs of your puppy. I feel bad when Geordie wees in the house, because I know it's my fault she wasn't outside when she needed to go. I almost feel like apologising to her!! Also, be happy that he's doing wees in front of you and not trying to hide them. If he's starting to run away when you growl then you need to stop this right away, or you'll end up with a puppy that's nervous about weeing in front of you (maybe this is why he's not going when you take him out before bed?). Next time he does a wee in front of you, see it as a good thing - because he's actually trying to show you that he needs to go, and next time you might just catch him as he's squatting and coax him to the door in time. Good luck!! You will get it, just be patient and persistent. And expect accidents throughout their whole life... it's just a part of being a dog owner! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoxyNHemi Posted September 22, 2008 Author Share Posted September 22, 2008 Thank you all for your suggestions, and I think I was expecting too much too quickly (especially as me and my partner both work fulltime) I have next week off work, so definately can work on it then. Cruise didnt mess in the house this morning, he was loose for about an hour I was sooo proud. He seriously doesnt give off any hints about about to wee, he just does it. I will try the vinigar solution or urine off, because yes, he keeps on going in the same spots, (I mustnt be cleaning very well) Will let you know any further progress. Sarah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionaC Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 (edited) I will try the vinigar solution or urine off, because yes, he keeps on going in the same spots, (I mustnt be cleaning very well) I'm sure you are cleaning it very well - its just that you're probably not using the right tools for the job .... most commercial cleaners don't remove the scent and until you do that then it will always be there..... ermmmmm.......... we are almost at the end of the page and there has been a definite absence of photographs of this lovely pup! Edited September 22, 2008 by FionaC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoxyNHemi Posted September 22, 2008 Author Share Posted September 22, 2008 I'm sure you are cleaning it very well - its just that you're probably not using the right tools for the job .... most commercial cleaners don't remove the scent and until you do that then it will always be there.....ermmmmm.......... we are almost at the end of the page and there has been a definite absence of photographs of this lovely pup! As requested Sarah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
je33ie Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 He's so cute!!!! The vinegar should work... you can scrub all you like with other cleaners but dogs' noses are so powerful they'll still smell the wee there. Good luck and let us know how you go! Geordie just woke up one morning and decided not to wee in the house anymore, but I'm still finding it hard to get her to tell me she needs to go out. I've heard that you can put a bell at the door and everytime you go out you ring it, then the dog can start ringing the bell when he needs to go out. I might start trying that with Geordie soon. Enjoy your week off with your pup! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionaC Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Much better - tooo cute! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domestic Dreamer Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Was wondering when we could expect him to show us some sign of wanting to go out though? Not to hijack your thread Sarah but you might want to know for later also. We got a doggy door so most of the time she didn't need to. It didn't take her long to work out the flap, then she'd take herself outside whenever she needed to. On the occasions that the kitchen door was closed and she couldn't get out she'd bark at intervals while waiting at the door for us to open it. She's changed her tactic now, and will jump up and paw me instead. I guess every dog is different and you just have to work out their "language". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VJB Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Toilet training..... when your going through it, somehow feels like it will never end, but it does. We have only had Heidi for 6 weeks. She is now nearly 16 weeks old. I basically did not take my eyes off her when she was inside, and this meant following her and watching her every move, literally. One of the biggest hurdles for me was getting the rest of the household to abide by this. For every accident that happens inside, it is a missed opportunity for you to do the praising for them getting it right by going outside. Taking her up the backyard constantly..... every 10-15 mins. I know this can become very boring, I felt like my whole life was pacing the yard and not much else. Every time she did "wee wee's", I praised like crazy, even bleary eyes at 2am in morning. If they attempt to go inside, clap hands and try to distract, while calling them outside quickily saying "wee wee's. I found this to be the big break for us (getting her to go up the yard by herself, rather that me carrying her up there). We are now 2 weeks wee free in the house, and she just goes outside by herself. Gee, it makes such a difference to everything now that she can self toilet in the right area. Much less stress. Also, like others have said, PREDICTING when they usually go is another bonus for getting it worked out faster. Oh, and my bottle of Urine Off has finally arrived after problems with the posting....of course I really needed this a few weeks back. FIONA C, did you get a blacklight with yours? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoxyNHemi Posted September 22, 2008 Author Share Posted September 22, 2008 Thank you everyone for their wise words... I definately am expecting too much, considering I work Full time, so the only time we can work on this is in the morning / evening and weekends.. I hope to progress a little next week, when I am home from work. I think Cruise is a wise little man, and is just being a stubborn kid, as I can walk and walk him outside and he just wants to play. We leave the back door open ajar when we are home, and the weather permits... Here he is debating weather to go out or not to stalk the kitty Sarah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristin_e102 Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Hi Sarah, I had huge problems with my lab pup weeing in his crate and I ended up taking all his bedding out so he was just lying on black tray. He only peed there once and he has NEVER done it again. After about 2 weeks, when I deemed him reliable did I then put a thin sheet back in the crate. Now he has full bedding and has never been comfier and cries at about 5.30am to go out to the toilet - I have never had a problem since! Although, he still is having accidents inside (he is 17 weeks) he has gotten so so much better. Its just patience and vigilance I think.... And every pup is trained differently... Hope this helps! Kristin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
je33ie Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Another thing you can try when you take him out is to completely ignore him. Stand still with your arms crossed until he goes, then when he does go give him lots and lots of cuddles and attention and play. This way he'll learn that to have fun he has to do his wees first. That pic at the back door's so cute! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monah Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Awww. He is SOOOOOO adorable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Everyone has given fantastic advice. Nothing new to add really, just that he is really gorgeous!!! It really boils down to persistence. You have to catch him before he goes. When we toilet train, I keep the trainee in one room, say if we are watching TV. well in there with us, and we WATCH constantly, even if the dog starts to sniff or look uncomfortable it is whipped outside quickly, then we say DO WEES, until the dog goes, even if it takes 20 mins., then as soon as it starts to go say YES!!!! good boy!!! Yay. so they really get the point. This can take 2 weeks or 3 months!! depending on the dog. With smaller dogs it can take longer, I'm guessing because of such small bladders they cannot 'hold' at all esp. when puppies. Eventually he should at least get to the door that he goes out of to go to toilet, and this will show he is getting the idea. Even if he has already gone, immediately get him out the door so he may make a connection with getting outside. all dogs seem to be different with training, you just have to find what works for him. There really is no point at all telling off after the event, the pup has NO idea what you are talking about at all, just quietly clean up and try to be more vigilant next time. Also, son't expect him to go just because he's outside, he may think he's out there to have fun, get indoors and then he goes. Just stay and watch him UNTIL he does something, then praise.Good luck, he is so lovely, what a cutie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionaC Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 Oh, and my bottle of Urine Off has finally arrived after problems with the posting....of course I really needed this a few weeks back. FIONA C, did you get a blacklight with yours? no just the bottle - I think I'm a little scared of what I might see if I use a blacklight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoxyNHemi Posted September 23, 2008 Author Share Posted September 23, 2008 where do you get urine off?? I havent had a chance to get out and look for it yet Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FionaC Posted September 23, 2008 Share Posted September 23, 2008 I just bought it at the local Pet Stock store ..... it was in the section with the shampoo's, conditioners and coat enhancing products Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoxyNHemi Posted September 23, 2008 Author Share Posted September 23, 2008 A picture after our first bath yesterday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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