Scratching/biting Door

[Leema]

Our foster dog has been here approximately 6 weeks, now. She digs at our back door at night and has recently started chewing on it, as well. She actually moves between the two back doors - scratching and biting at one, then moving and scratching and biting at the other. One night she did this the entire night, from 9:30pm to 6am.

I want her to be used to sleeping outside/the laundry (as now) in case her new home wants these sleeping arrangements.

We have a very set routine. I take dogs out for a wee, everyone comes back inside, Dorrie (foster dog) is taken outside with a biscuit. She is then not allowed back inside until morning. It has been this way since day dot. We have never responded to her scratching or whining at the door (so she has never been rewarded for it).

My guess is that Dorrie doesn't want to be separated from everyone. She does not seem to do the scratching/biting at the door during the day, when she is outside with the other dogs. (Judging from the damage on the door.)

Not only is the damage to the door a problem, but she is obviously stressed to be performing this neurotic behaviour, and we don't want her to do this in a new home. And it is loud and prevents us from sleeping.

The solutions, as I see them, are:

1) Move her to a different area to hopefully break the habit (we do have an area that is appropriate)

2) Accliamtisie her to a crate (she seems to like it until she is locked in, and then she scratches at the crate door obsessively and I worry about her damaging her nails)

3) Make her like company less!! Which would be the best option, but I don't know how to go about it.

What are your suggestions?

[prodigybxr]

Sorry- but can you really blame her??

Obviously she is happy and content in the company of others. Why can't she be rehomed on the condition that she be allowed to sleep inside?

I know there is no way in hell I would knowingly rehome a rescue of mine that is made to sleep outside.

[cavNrott]

Sorry- but can you really blame her??

Obviously she is happy and content in the company of others. Why can't she be rehomed on the condition that she be allowed to sleep inside?

I know there is no way in hell I would knowingly rehome a rescue of mine that is made to sleep outside.

I agree. Poor thing is lonely, unhappy and miserable outside on her own. I won't rehome to people who want outside dogs either.

[Tonymc]

Folks lets not start to waffle on about outside and inside dogs.Leema has asked for advice not some judgement that is way off the real issue.

Leema,what other behaviour do's this Dog exibit?Sounds awfully like separation anxiety to me.Can you get a knowledgeable trainer to asess the situation. Tony

[Leema]

I would rehome to a home that allows her inside, but I don't have a problem with a dog sleeping outside if they have inside time. Dorrie is inside all day that we are home, but outside when we're not home, and outside when we go to bed.

Tony, Dorrie does not do any other anxiety behaviours as far as I can tell. She whines a little, but does not bark... She doesn't really do anything except sleep... except when WE want to sleep! (She's a pretty boring dog.)

If she did sleep inside, she would scratch at the door to get into our bedroom. If she did sleep in our bedroom in a crate, she'd scratch at the crate door.

Edited August 14, 2008 by Leema

[skip]

I understand why you think that keping her outside is a good idea. Not everybody will keep dogs like we may and you don't want to spoil her. A new owner may have dogs outside.

But in this case everybody else is in and she is the only one out. This must be really tuff, I have no idea what experienced dog people would advise.

I have a dog that a condition on adopting him was that I had another dog due to seperation issues. I was fine with this although I was a little surprised as to the extent of his anxiety and as some know, another dog is not really the cure all. I loved him on 1st sight on the rescue site and he has changed into a lovely little dog. But although his behaviour is improved massively he has had times when he reverts to past patterns of behaviour such as a recent house move.

Did she dig at the door the whole 6 weekes? Is she a smallish dog? If the dog is not re-homed to a home where dogs are allowed inside wouldn't this behaviour be a problem anyway.

Good luck on getting the advice you need. I love my boy and I hope somebody falls in love with your dog too. ( One where she is allowed in )

[Just Midol]

Letting a dog inside to combat this problem is a stupid solution imo.

What if the new owner has to lock the dog outside for a few days or few hours and the dog destroys the door?

Whether or not she rehomes to a family who want an indoor or outside dog the dog needs to be taught that scratching at the door is not acceptable...

JMO of course.

I have no real advice on the issue. Axle used to do this, we simply ignored it and he figured out that he did not achieve the desired result so the behaviour ended. I assume you give her no attention when she does it (IE, none at all.)

[Leema]

We give her no attention at all while she's scratching. We lay in bed and wait for her to stop. She normally stops after an hour or so (I fall to sleep easily, my OH is awake waiting for her to stop to sleep) and doesn't resume again (so when we let her in in the morning, she isn't scratching then).

This behaviour has gotten worse. In the last two days she has started biting the door as well as scratching it... Previously it was just scratching it. She has gotten more persistent with it and is scratching for longer periods of time. I guess it was about a week before she started scratching at the door.

I theorise that she has gotten attached to me but I ignore her except on my terms... Insist on sits for pats, cancel pats on my terms or when she misbehaves, etc. I have pretty clear guidelines for contact between us.

Ultimately, I would like her to go to a home when she's inside 24/7 or with other dog company. But considering I have close to no interest over 6 weeks, I can hardly be choosey.

For those that insist she comes inside, tell me how I can do it without her scratching at the door to the bedroom or scratching at the door of the crate. No, she is not going to sleep on our bed. It is crowded enough with 4 of us.

As Midol said, it's problematic regardless of whether she is inside at night or not.

[Just Midol]

It can get worse before it gets better - an extinction burst or something.

I can only offer very basic advice, as in, my advice is all used up Someone like Erny should come in soon.

[Leema]

Bump...

[skip]

Sorry, didn't realise that it is not just about being inside.

I would go with 2. As long as she is given a chance to get used to the crate. If ??she damages her nails I would try to find a way to protect them.

She is inside, you have gone to bed, she is comfy in her crate, I would sleep easy. Hopefully the crate is where you cannot hear her. Hope that doesn't sound

heartless but that is what I would do? I would think she should accept this and give up the scratching. And wouldn't rewarding sitting quietly in the crate be like rewarding correct behavior like no barking or sitting quietly.

I am not experienced but my dogs now accept being carted all over the place and they sleep where ever I put them.

Good luck, hope you get help soon!

[iltby]

I would highly recommended crate training - from my experience dogs adapt to them very fast and hard ones can take a fair bit of damage without being destroyed if she protests to being in one initially - I can't imagine she could do any damage to her nails if they're kept short? Have you tried covering up the crate when she makes a huge fuss after being put in it? I've found it really settles them down and stops any whining. Crate training's very easy, if you're unsure of how to go about it I'm sure I or a lot of other members could post something explaining it.

Good luck with it - as Michael said the only other way to really remedy it is to continue ignoring the behaviour until it ceases, though I'm not sure how effective that is with full blown separation anxiety (provided that's what the problem is).

Edited August 15, 2008 by iltby

[Leema]

I have the whole day today, so I'm going to do some training with the crate and with outside. I'll let you know how we go.

In regard to her nails - they are very short. I have not had to cut them since I got her desexed, because scratching at the doors has filed them down.

[grumpette]

Leema

Do not give up now. As Midol said what you are experiencing is an extinction burst, which means that the behaviour increases in intensity and frequency before it dissappears. Keep ignoring the scratching and biting of the door and the behaviour will soon stop.

If you let the dog in now the dog will learn that to get let in at night time it has to scratching longer and harder, which will mean that it will take longer and the door will be totally destroyed, next time an owner tries to teach the dog not to scratch at the door to come in.

[Leema]

She will never be let inside for scratching at the door.

The problem is, this behaviour has got worse, and seems to be getting worse. When she arrived here she did not scratch at door. She has never been let in as a result of scratching at the door (or given any attention) yet this behaviour continues and has got worse. I feel that something I have done has elicited the scratching behaviour in her, and this is not a behaviour she already knew.

[iltby]

I just had another thought, have you ever given her Rescue Remedy to help with how stressed/anxious she gets? You could try giving her a few drops every night before she's put out for good. We started giving it to Chelsea, our Husky, before we went out for long periods of time and it's really helped. She would completely destroy her crate if we left her for a few hours and that's basically stopped now. That's just another option to try if you're not keen on crating her.

If you really don't think continuing to ignore the behaviour is helping, though, I'd give the crating a shot - it can't hurt and I'd be confident that it would be more effective, particularly because you can cover it up. As I said on the first page, covering it with a blanket seems to be very effective as it settles them down, plus it's less stressful for you.

Edited August 16, 2008 by iltby

[Just Midol]

This is the way I see it:

1) You are experiencing the extinction burst, tough it out. It'll get better eventually.

2) Somehow the dog has been rewarded. You said you give it no attention (this includes telling it off) so you can rule this out.

3) It is an issue like sep anxiety which requires a behaviourist.

[Leema]

I tried moving her to a different area of the yard. She is better here - she scratches at the gate to that yard but also barks a little which is not good at night.

I will try with the crate because she does seem to like it (she often goes in of her own will).

[Leema]

Update:

I don't want to shove her in a crate and let her bark/scratch it out. We've tried that with outside and it hasn't worked. We've tried it with the kennel yard and it hasn't worked. So we're going about introducing the crate slowly.

I have contacted a trainer who hopefully will be coming to see us on Saturday. I don't know what I am doing wrong at all, so I'm looking forward to being told.