First Time Puppy Owner Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 I only have a basic answer but I am sure someone else can help further. The type of protein is related to allergies - i.e. if protein is only from beef and itching occurs but not when only protein source is chicken dog ia actually allergic to beef not protein as such. Also red meats are not metabolised by the body as easily as chicken, turkey or pork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 The advice going around right now is to feed low protein so that the long bones (legs) don't grow too quickly that may cause hip or growth plate problems down the track. Obviously though, a BARF diet is not low protein so there is argument there with people or breeders who successfully feed BARF to their pups and would report that they grow no quicker than their kibble fed counterparts! He would only be scratching if he was actually allergic to the protein used in the food. Perhaps that he is *not* scratching now is an indication that he was allergic to something else in the other premium diets you have tried i.e. grain or preservatives. It will be very interesting to see if all these skin dogs really are affected by the carbs rather than large proteins in dog food as we get more grain free stuff over here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poochmad Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) We were feeding him Advance and switched over to Orijien as he was continuously scratching and had lots of soft stools. Now he scratches the normal amount, i.e. every now and again and his stools are nice and firm. So it sounds like a diet high in protein is ok - as he also gets 2 x chicken wings a day? Edited September 2, 2008 by poochmad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poochmad Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 Sorry is he scratching anymore? Not like he was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 Well it's still the same protein base (chicken) so obviously there was something else in the previous food that was not agreeing with him. Mel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted September 2, 2008 Author Share Posted September 2, 2008 All vet advice I have been given is that a high protein diet is not bad in itself - it is when it is combined with high fat that the problems arise. The need to feed a lower protein food is mainly in relation to large/ giant breed puppies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AML Posted September 2, 2008 Share Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) The tuna treats are the treat de jour at our house too AML My pups would do backflips for them if I asked them to Hehe schnauzer_luv. I know what you mean. Angee adores them too and nearly turns herself inside out with excitement when she sees them. In regards to the poo department. I've already noticed a big difference in how many times Angee goes a day (much less) and she's only been on Orijen since last Friday. Edited September 2, 2008 by AML Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chocolate Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 The tuna treats are the treat de jour at our house too AML My pups would do backflips for them if I asked them to Hehe schnauzer_luv. I know what you mean. Angee adores them too and nearly turns herself inside out with excitement when she sees them. In regards to the poo department. I've already noticed a big difference in how many times Angee goes a day (much less) and she's only been on Orijen since last Friday. Interesting as I've found the opposite. My dogs poos are much larger and very black I notice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poochmad Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 Interesting as I've found the opposite. My dogs poos are much larger and very black I notice. Agree. Henschke's are a lot bigger (sometimes they make you wonder how a small dog can do something so large! ) and they are black as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poochmad Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 All vet advice I have been given is that a high protein diet is not bad in itself - it is when it is combined with high fat that the problems arise. The need to feed a lower protein food is mainly in relation to large/ giant breed puppies. Danois, what would be a high fat diet? (He's fed Orijien mixed with half a sardine and given 2 x chicken wings a day.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormie Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 All vet advice I have been given is that a high protein diet is not bad in itself - it is when it is combined with high fat that the problems arise. The need to feed a lower protein food is mainly in relation to large/ giant breed puppies. Danois, what would be a high fat diet? (He's fed Orijien mixed with half a sardine and given 2 x chicken wings a day.) My understand is that is isn't the protein that's an issue with growth acceleration, but rather a diet too high in calories (ie fat). Any food that is balanced for either regular puppies or large breed puppies should be balanced. The general rule for pups is to keep them lean and not overweight. So if you are feeding extras like chicken wings and sardines, just remember to feed a little less of the dry food than you otherwise would if you were just feeding dry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poochmad Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 (edited) All vet advice I have been given is that a high protein diet is not bad in itself - it is when it is combined with high fat that the problems arise. The need to feed a lower protein food is mainly in relation to large/ giant breed puppies. Danois, what would be a high fat diet? (He's fed Orijien mixed with half a sardine and given 2 x chicken wings a day.) My understand is that is isn't the protein that's an issue with growth acceleration, but rather a diet too high in calories (ie fat). Any food that is balanced for either regular puppies or large breed puppies should be balanced. The general rule for pups is to keep them lean and not overweight. So if you are feeding extras like chicken wings and sardines, just remember to feed a little less of the dry food than you otherwise would if you were just feeding dry. Thanks! He is nice and lean, so there doesn't seem to be a problem there. He's not a guts; he stops when he is full which is good. I just realised that I'm feeding him too much. He's supposed to get 1 cup each meal, but I should reduce this if he's also getting chicken necks, etc. Edited September 3, 2008 by poochmad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blues and Boots Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 The advice going around right now is to feed low protein so that the long bones (legs) don't grow too quickly that may cause hip or growth plate problems down the track. Obviously though, a BARF diet is not low protein so there is argument there with people or breeders who successfully feed BARF to their pups and would report that they grow no quicker than their kibble fed counterparts! Hi, don't think that feeding low protein diets to large breed puppies is the advice going around 'right now'. I thought that was more like the old advice. All the recent journal articles I can find say it's more to do with calcium/phorphorus ratios and calorie intake. On another note my two dogs have been on Orijen for a while and they absolutely love it but it's not all good things I'm seeing. There stools are too soft half the time and they are now both farting machines since switching to it. On the other hand their coats are absolutely beautiful on it. My puppy is such a guts hey I've never seen such an eating machine except for our family's bull terrier growing up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harold Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 our Wei has been on Orijen for about 3 weeks now and we have noticed a HUGE improvement in his skin and stools he gets oil capsules and antihistamines daily as well, but the change to a non-grain food (plus raw chicken daily) has worked for him we will try to ween him off the additives over the coming months just one question - we get our Orijen at $110 per 13.6kg bag which I believe is the RRP why do so many stores have the same bag at $120? MORE than the RRP ????? That's just greedy i think....would you see two different car dealers showing different prices....of course....but would one of them be offering cars at MORE THAN the RRP? I think not.... Don't ever pay more than RRP - take your money elsewhere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarian Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 It was great to hear that your boy is responding well (so far, so good!) to Orijen. Keep in mind with the price that some add GST, some don't, which may explain some differences. While it does pay to shop around, my experience has always been that if you are happy with how you are looked after, how knowledgeable the people you deal with are, and how genuine you judge them to be, that you can't really go wrong. Looking forward to following your progress. Sags Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harold Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Sags I believe that GST is added by every store. If they didn't they would be breaking the law. I leave it to the purchaser to decide..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony mazzeri Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 our Wei has been on Orijen for about 3 weeks now and we have noticed a HUGE improvement in his skin and stoolshe gets oil capsules and antihistamines daily as well, but the change to a non-grain food (plus raw chicken daily) has worked for him That's great to hear. Good stuff. PS. If you'd like to update your original thread with your positive results, it might help other people with the same problem in the future when doing a search of the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarian Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Well, call it a different view of pricing then, Harold. :p GST is already paid to the wholesaler, and of course GST is always paid to the government, so how the final cost is reached then becomes an in store decision. I can tell you that many products do not have a recommended retail price (Supercoat, worming products, flea treatments, most beds, many toys, collars etc), so the retailer is certainly not doing anything illegal there by working out their own margin. Regardless, it is great to hear that the product is helping your dog, and at the end of the day, that is all that really matters. Sags Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted September 5, 2008 Author Share Posted September 5, 2008 Exactly Sags - its all about each seller's own oncosts which they need to factor into the selling price. One of the drugs I have for Angs - there is a $30 difference between 2 vets for the same drug and the same amount. Therefore, as I have the choice, I buy it from Vet 1 who is also my usual vet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted September 6, 2008 Share Posted September 6, 2008 Interesting as I've found the opposite. My dogs poos are much larger and very black I notice. Agree. Henschke's are a lot bigger (sometimes they make you wonder how a small dog can do something so large! ) and they are black as well. I believe black poo is indicative of a high protein diet - so you can literally see you are getting your monies worth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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