Ocd / Joint Problems

[Paws4Thought]

My 5 month old pup was recently "diagnosed" (I use the term loosely because there have been no confirming x-rays as yet) with OCD in his front left elbow joint. He's had 3 of his 4 Cartrofen injections, and seems to be doing ok. He's also having Sashas Blend added to his breakfast in the mornings.

Does anybody here have experience with OCD in puppies? Was it diagnosed without x-rays and later confirmed? Did you undertake any physical therapy? Was surgery requried?

I'd love to hear what other people have experienced.

[mikelli]

My experience was not a happy one. However let me say that to have a proper diagnosis (spelling?) you really need to have xrays done. Some puppies can be very lame and it can be nothing more than growing pains. I have seen this often in larger breed dogs. I have heard that some cases can be treated successfully without surgery, others need to be operated on, it depends on the severity of the case. If your puppy is on cartrofen have you got him crated, this is necessary to let the cartrofen do its job. I believe sashas blend is good. Glucosamine is also good, but I believe it does much the same as cartrofen. Please keep your puppy as quiet as you can (I know this can be very hard) but if it is going to improve I believe this is necessary, you have to be cruel to be kind sometimes. Vitamin C in the form of Ester C is also a great help I believe. I am certainly no expert, but am just sharing some of my experiences.

[Bully]

"What breed is your puppy?"

Some larger breed puppies ( in particular GSD's) suffer from panosteitis sometimes called "growing pains" Panosteitis

Has this been ruled out?

Good luck with your puppy.

[kamuzz]

What sort of dog is he?

Has the vet ruled out pano?

ETA: snap with Bully

Edited July 3, 2008 by kamuzz

[Guest magnum]

Maybe a little young for Pano, xray the elbow to see what you are dealing with however the puppy is the right age for this condition sadly. Good luck

[DeltaCharlie]

My sister's pup was diagnosed (with xrays) at about 11months. She had been holding the leg up for a few weeks before they took her to a vet, thinking she had just sprained it The vet started the injections immediately as apparently after about 12months they are even less effective (I think its only 30% success to start with). She had sasha's blend every night and she immediately started using the leg.

She is almost 4 now and doesn't have any sort of a limp, she runs around all day with my other sister's amstaff and she is great. The only time I have noticed it since the initial injections was when I took her to the million paws walk last year. I had completely forgotten about her leg to tell you the truth, thats how long it had been since she had any problem. After 5km of walking up and down hills in the mountains she was starting to limp though.

She starts to get snappy after a long walk so my sister makes sure she doesn't do too much in one go. I would never do agility or anything with her as it would be too much stress on her joints. Other than that she leads a perfectly normal life and my sister doesn't give her anything extra (after the sashas blend ran out they stopped giving it to her).

Oh and she is a boxer x border collie x something bigger than both breeds

[Miranda]

You need to have x-rays done so that you know what you're dealing with, if it turns out to be something like UAP the dog may need surgery. I would get the dog x-rayed as soon as possible.

[Amerykus]

yeah I agree.... X-ray so you KNOW what your dealing with...

It MIGHT just be a part of growing up..

also what type of food are you feeding???

[Paws4Thought]

Thanks for all the responses!

To answer some questions, he is a Rhodesian Ridgeback X Rottweiler. He is being fed Eukanuba puppy large breed, though the amount has been reduced at the vet's recommendation. He now gets 1 and 3/4 scoops morning and night, along with some Sashas Blend (well, at least he was, until the other dog decided Sashas blend smelled like crack for dogs and stole the container so he could lick it clean!). Must get some more!

He's being isolated to the laundry during the day (its a bit larger than most, but is practical for cleaning), and gets a little bit of time to spend with my other dog in the evening before being put in his crate for the night.

The vet has only mentioned one other condition she thought it would be but there wasn't a shortened version and I can't remember how to pronounce, let alone spell that one. I have a vet friend who said she'd have taken the same course of action with my pup which is good, but I hadn't heard any stories about other people's experience.

He seems to be improving but then its hard to be certain. After his fourth injection next week I might ask for X-Rays if he limps again.

The vet said it might be genetic, or just developmental in nature. I tend to agree, it would be nice to have X-Rays to confirm.

[~Archie~]

If your other dog is going to pinch the sasha's blend then you should use joint guard.

It doesnt have a fishy smell!!

joint guard is more purified that sasha's blend, its got glucosamine & chondroitin in it which is better for joint products than using a raw product like sasha's

joint guard doesnt have shark cartilage in it either!!

www.jointguard.com.au

[possum86]

I agree with Boston Girl. I had a Lab x that had hip dysplasia, elbow dysplasia and had 2 cruciates repaired. I spoke to specialists and none of them like sashas blend as a product. The dosage rates are incorrect and you actully need to feed 4x the recommended dose to get any benifits. There has also been research done to suggest the gut cannot adequatly digest sasha blend. I would use joint guard or cosequin ds. They are both the same just different brands. I would also get xrays done and get them analysed by a specialist as this is really a specialist field and they may be able to offer better solutions than your everyday vet. I also found physiotherapy to be very effective. I would also suggest you combine the joint guard/cosequin ds with cartrophen injections as they work better together. Cartrophen injections should also be monthly after the initial 4 week course. Hope this is helpful. Goodluck

[Paws4Thought]

Thanks for the feedback - I'll look into the joint guard (anything that is less likely to get stolen is ok with me!).

I didn't know the Cartofen should be administered on an ongoing basis - I'll keep that in mind, thank you

[Paws4Thought]

Ok it's been five weeks since I took my pup to the vet, and he's had four Cartrophen injections.

He's been pretty good. He spent two weeks locked in the laundry during the day, with energy building! It didn't seem to make much difference, he still limped from time to time (only to have him stop limping within an hour at most). But generally he was doing well. No real exercise or training, but definitely some improvement. His diet was reduced, too.

Last Friday we let him out and he is now allowed to spend all day with our other dog. He is much happier for it (as is the other dog!), has much less pent up energy, and most importantly has not limped in the last five days!

Now, the vet has suggested we should do another four injections at a rate of one per week, since he seems to have responded best since the last injection. I've still not had x-rays, but she believes the changes of it not being bone related are minimal. Also, she says x-rays at this point in time might not show much. But she's still happy to have them done, and is encouraging it.

What are your thoughts, DOL-ers? Would you x-ray now? It will cost me around $400 - $450. Would you wait longer, or would you x-ray now and run the chance of having to x-ray again later?

I'll also be reviewing diet and exercise with the vet this week, but at the moment we're planning to do 5-10 minutes just wandering around the pathways near the house to keep him stimulated.

Your advice would be most welcome!

BTW - he is having boisterious play with the other dog and seems fine. I keep it very short and keep an eye on them when I'm home, and if it flares up he'll be back on a restricted accommodation plan!!