Luke W Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Hi All I'm in St Kilda, (inner bayside Melbourne) and I've got a 3 month old cocker spaniel. I've started training him myself with the aid of books, the internet, DVDs and DOL. I'm using mostly reward based, clicker training. I'm interested in starting obedience training with him at either a club or a private school. I'd like to achieve an advanced level of training/obedience. I also suspect I'll want to compete in obedience trials and compete in agility in the future. I'd like training to be enjoyable for both of us. I'm looking for recommendations for training facilities. I'm not sure whether I should consider a private school (ADT in Hawthorn or Oakleigh for example) or a club (Southern Obedience in Bangholm, Moorabbin Obedience, etc). I'd prefer not to have to travel TOO far. I've heard good things about ADT and Southern Obedience. I've heard less than favorable comments about Moorabbin. So - I'd like as many recommendations as possible, ideally with some commentary on training styles, atmosphere etc. I'm hope I'm not asking too much! Fire away. Many, many thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 (edited) I have trained at both ADT and Southern, and if you want to trial you really need to go to a trialling club Southern are a little old fashioned in their methods but they are very much a trailling club, with lots of people who are out trialling and also judges who are there too and will help ADT arent VCA affiliated and they do not aim for trialling standards they really aim towards pet manners and general obedience for the most part PM me if you like Edited June 2, 2008 by shoemonster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tess32 Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 I've been to Southern and I don't think you'll like it if you prefer clicker type training. They are very traditional. Moorabbin is the same I think. Unfortunately it seems that the trialling clubs are traditional and the clubs that use clicker only do pet obedience! Hastings does clicker and is into trialling but it'd be pretty far for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Going to a trialling old fashioned method club doesnt mean you have to use those methods, but they are a good way to see what the dogs need to be working like to be in the ring I use many different methods, food, clicker, correction, toys, and have had my issues with a few different clubs that I have trained at, all for different reasons, I dont think there is a perfect club, but if you take take things from the clubs and use them and modify them to your own needs then you will get enough from them I think Luckydog here trains at moorabbin, he can let us know what its like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 My club doesn't actively promote clickers etc (though they do promote food and toys) but have no problems with people doing it or other strange and wonderful ideas (like spitting food ). I also use a range of things including clickers, food, toys, corrections, depending on what we are doing. Interesting though that most of the triallers I know use check chains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Have to say that i didn't find Southern to helpful as soon as you didn't do things exactly the way they did- they were extremely critical. I would use a trialling club for the ring practice but not the clsses as i find they are a 1 hour heeling pattern that even my adult dogs would get bored with, let alone a puppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 (edited) The puppy classes at southern are also run very differently than the adult classes, they are food based and very positive ETA I actually went to other clubs after starting at southern because I cracked it with the way a few of the people there were, but I have found myself back there as I get more out of it, now I am more clear on what I want, and how I want to do it Edited June 2, 2008 by shoemonster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpley Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 (edited) I train at ADT, Southern and Rotty club. All train differently and I find all of them enjoyable in there own ways, and they all have things I don't agree with. ADT - I joined to gain some manners for my male stafford. Yeah he could heel, sit, stay etc, but he would nearly knock someone down when he saw them due to excitement. ADT have helped me work on these skills and also have given me other methods to improve the 'trialling' side of things, even though they don't teach trialling. Southern - Well I have had good days and bad days with them. Yep, I have left in tears I will admit that. Not because of the methods, more because of specific trainers. Yes they are traditional (use correction collars), and once above the beginner classes they tend to frown on food (not all of the instructors). Thing is, nothing is outlawed and if you want to use it, they aren't going to chuck you out of class for it. My girl has trained there and she would turn to water if she was corrected, and is purely trained using food and positive praise. My boy, however can use the occasional 'correction' but is mostly food and positive praise aswell. I have learnt to stand by the choices I have made when it comes to training there, and I have learnt alot from majority of the instructors re trialling, but wouldn't let them tell me how I can't train my dog. Rotty Club (RCV) - I have to admit that I find this the most enjoyable of them all. They are very much focused on making sure the dogs enjoy there training, and you really understand how to train in a way that is both enjoyable for yourself and for your dog. They are very big on the reward based training, be it food, favourite toy etc. And always make sure that the dogs are set up to succeed not fail. Yep correction collars are used on most of the dogs, and corrections are taught in class. So regardless of whether it is a 'old style' school or a new type school or a mix of all different methods, it is ultimately your dog, and your decision as to how you train and use these methods. I don't think any one club will make you 100% happy, you have to take a piece from all and learn as you go. Edited June 2, 2008 by isiss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Agreed Rotty club is awesome too! It's done wonders for my boy's confidence going there I was trying to figure out why I didnt mention rotty club, but realised it was cos its not close enough for the OP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prodigybxr Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 (edited) Where/when do the Rotty club train? Does it have a trial class? As you guys have Staffords- I assume they accept all breeds? Thanks! Edited June 2, 2008 by prodigybxr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpley Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 They train wednesday nights at KCC - and yep they go up to trialling. Shoemonster has just gotten her CCD and quite a few members trial. And yes, they take all breeds. http://www.rottweilerclubofvictoria.com/site/index.php?id=32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Wed nights at KCC Yep all breeds accepted, and the top class is mainly aimed at trialling, and sometimes gets split between those who are trialling and those who arent Even so all excercises are done with trialling in mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpley Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Jinx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 hehehe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prodigybxr Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 They train wednesday nights at KCC - and yep they go up to trialling. Shoemonster has just gotten her CCD and quite a few members trial. And yes, they take all breeds.http://www.rottweilerclubofvictoria.com/site/index.php?id=32 Great, thanks! One more question- sorry! Is it indoors only? Or do they train outdoors too, in OK weather? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoemonster Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 In good weather we train outside but in cold or wet we train in the pavillion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prodigybxr Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 In good weather we train outside but in cold or wet we train in the pavillion Cool, thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke W Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 Thanks for all the information guys. Much appreciated. Looks like I've got some decisions to make. Unfortunately, it seems my ideal club doesn't exist. A predominantly reward based (whatever works for the dog), clicker training club, close to St Kilda It seems the Rotty club is the best fit. It's a shame it'd take me at least an hour to get there. Not to mention I would feel a little strange taking my cocker spaniel to a rotty club though - I'm sure we'd get some strange looks. It's a shame is so far away It's also a big shame that Southern and Moorabbin are refered to as 'traditional'...I assume this means correction collars, leash corrections, no food, no rewards, no clickers...Forgive my ignorance (and my bias against correction collars and leash corrections). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tess32 Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 Traditional basically means limited food (sometimes none), no clicker and usually correction collars and compulsion methods. Depends on the club. It's true no club is perfect but you do PAY to go so you should find the closest match to what you want rather than one way out from what you want (like Southern). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke W Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 Traditional basically means limited food (sometimes none), no clicker and usually correction collars and compulsion methods. Depends on the club.It's true no club is perfect but you do PAY to go so you should find the closest match to what you want rather than one way out from what you want (like Southern). Thanks Tess. Any thoughts on why these 'traditional' method clubs seem to predominate? Is it the same with the private schools? I went to see a private school running some classes at a local park. Not a clicker or any food in sight. Dogs in a line and lots of 'Stay, Stay, Stay, Staaaaaaaay" With my (admittedly limited) experience and reading, clicker training, food luring and reward based positive training methods are currently accepted best practice. At least with animal behaviourists and most professional animal trainers. Am I wrong? It it simpy a matter of new methods not filtering down to clubs and the unwillingness of people to change, coupled with the fact that correction collars and punishment training works?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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