Demodex-whats Right & Whats Wrong

[centitout]

why is everything these days hereditary? i think people should look more at environmental factors,feed,vaccinations than constantly looking for an excuse to "blame it on genetics".i had a sharpei bitch years ago(unrelated lines) that had demodex,the kids had a chi that developed demodex at 4 mths unrelated as well.compromised immune systems are now hereditary-what next?

[Sivvy]

why is everything these days hereditary? i think people should look more at environmental factors,feed,vaccinations than constantly looking for an excuse to "blame it on genetics".i had a sharpei bitch years ago(unrelated lines) that had demodex,the kids had a chi that developed demodex at 4 mths unrelated as well.compromised immune systems are now hereditary-what next?

Great minds think alike Great post.

[~Anne~]

why is everything these days hereditary? i think people should look more at environmental factors,feed,vaccinations than constantly looking for an excuse to "blame it on genetics".i had a sharpei bitch years ago(unrelated lines) that had demodex,the kids had a chi that developed demodex at 4 mths unrelated as well.compromised immune systems are now hereditary-what next?

I don't think people neccessarily want to 'blame it on genetics'. I would think that people are simply better educated and more aware of genetic issues and so what used to fly under the radar is now picked up on. I don't think of it as a negative thing. It can only help breeders produce good specimens can't it.

I think we are also becoming more aware of environmental factors.

In fact this thread disucsses several reasons why a pup may develop demodex. The genetic reason is usually coupled with the words 'possible' becuase the link had never been established and proven.

[Shepherd Lover]

My experience with my own dogs and demodex is that it is not hereditary, but caused by stress. It may be hereditary, but it also can be caused by other factors, and not be hereditary.

I absolutely agree with that comment. I brought in a puppy at the age of 13 weeks and couldn't house her with another puppy I had due to the fact that the puppy I already had was limping and couldn't stand the rough play. So I housed the two puppies not far from one another. But the pup I brought in was stressed because she had lived with other puppies where she came from. Months went past and I couldn't clear up the demodex, it became worse and her face was already bald, she had patches under the chin and some on the front legs and it started to crop up on her hindquarters and trunk. It was becoming systemic. I was treating her for demodex with everything I could, and in the end she was put onto daily Ivomec (which I hated). I still couldn't control it, it went on for months.

It wasn't until I removed the stress of being isolated from where she wanted to be that she started to clear up the demodex and is now completely free. I brought her inside and slept her right by my bed at night, she lived in the house and had been removed from the stress which was unbeknown to us causing her problem.

Do not underestimate the role stress can play in demodex cases.

[Turkey Trip]

Having had several run-ins with Demodex dating back to the 1980's when all we had was toxic Amitraz dips which nearly vapourised us as well as the patient and its Demodex mites.. maybe I can share a little of what we learnt the hard way.

To cut to the chase, while stress (hormonal or environmental) can play a role and certain nutrition can aid recovery, perfectly nourished, apparently healthy and unstressed pups can develop demodicosis. From my experience, I do believe there is a genetically inherited susceptibility. Unfortunately to give full reasons and all data would take an article not an email therefore this response will be a little truncated.

First, as a breeder I would not breed from any parent that had shown any sign of demodex, apart from at the most, a tiny patch of facial hair missing for less than 2 weeks and resolving spontaneously and without any treatment. Unless the dog was truly outstanding, even a small and temporary patch would put it out of consideration.

Next, I firmly believe it is transmissible from dog to dog. I would not allow a dog with demodex patches anywhere near any of my dogs and in particular, do not allow an infected dog to mouth or lick the face of another, as I theorise that the mites must have some way of transferring via the mucous membranes and saliva.

I have had demodex patches appear on the face of a pup which was delivered by caesarian section, straight out of the uterus and onto the towel and hot water bottles - the dam reacted catastrophically to that particular anaesthetic and died on the operating table and there was NEVER any contact between dam and pup after it was removed from her uterus. All pups were hand-raised and fed with bottle/formula and had no contact with any other dog prior to 6 weeks of age.

At about the age of 3 months this pup played with a visiting pup of another breed aged 7 months, the latter had very small demodex patches around its lips and eye. It was after this contact that demodex patches appeared around the eyes and muzzle of the caesarian birth pup.

I keep reading that demodex mites can only be transferred between dam and nursing pups in the first days of life - NOT true! In 2008 have found the following links documenting transfer between dog-dog and dog-human. Notice the human example has lesions on her face = exactly where a friendly dog would lick.

http://www.thepetcenter.com/exa/dem.html

(transmission to humans)

http://www.marvistavet.com/html/demodectic_mange.html

(transmission between dogs)

Lastly, IMO the best and only treatment to use is weekly Dectomax (Doramectin) injections and the usual course is for 8weeks. You can also kick-start recovery by washing the lesions with an over-the-counter wash available at the chemist for skin conditions -sorry forget the name and would need to check. (This flushes out the hair follicles.) Supplement with Vit C and E. Feed a good quality food with minimal grain content and also, the dog will require a course of antibiotics at the start of treatment as the bacteria, yeast and mites work symbiotically together. From memory I think the drug of choice was Cephalexin. The mites can colonise all parts of the dog's body, even internally and they themselves, will act to suppress the immune system.

That's certainly not all but will have to do.

[nellybly10]

I agree that Demodex may be caused by stress, may be hereditary, and may be transferable (although this is the first I have heard of this, sarcoptic is definitely though).

I have had two very different experiences with Demodectic mange. First was many years ago with a Staffy pup I bought from an aquaintence when we were looking for a companion dog (not a registered breeder - have since learnt my lesson). She had lumps on her head at only 4 weeks of age, lost most of the hair on her head by 9 weeks, and was completely bald (her entire body was hairless) by 3 months. We couldnt start ivermectin until 3 months of age as it is toxic to developing livers and kidneys, so the poor thing had no treatment until then and it was awful. Ivermec cleared it up by 6 months and then she was desexed. This was definitely transferred by mum and all pups in the litter had it. Poor breeding I would assume as later it came out mum had it too so agree hereditary in this case.

Second case is my current British Bulldog bitch. Her breeding is impecable, grandsire was World Bulldog of the Year and British Bulldog of the Year in the UK, her half-sisters have both won the same title. At 6 months of age I noticed a small patch of hair missing on her hind leg, it took us a few weeks to figure out what it was as it never grew more than about 5cm in diameter. I tried a new natural treatment (an ointment of natural oils from India) which cleared it up in 2 weeks, and it has never come back. We had recently changed her diet and put it down to this "stress" as I contacted the breeder and of course no evidence of mange in her lines.

So I have experienced both. Needless to say I think the ointment was our miracle cream in our BB bitch and have given it to others who agree and I am now soon to launch it onto the Australian market, as it is natural and can be used in pups from birth. I just wish I had known of it when we had our staffy, it is such a devastating condition.