Changing My Dog's Diet - Need To Work Out Something Healthy

[Liza]

I apologize in advance for the length of this post.

Up until now my mom has been buying my dog's food. She is fed twice a day - a cup of dry food in the morning and a sausage-thing you have to cut off at night - 400g (400 is what is recommended on the package itself)

The thing is, my dog is gaining weight. She is an Australian Cattle Dog, Kelpie, and Beagle a mix - closest to the size of the beagle, but a tiny bit larger. I read that beagles gain weight easily and she seems to fit this description. It isn't just the food - my mom feeds my dog leftovers behind my back even though I constantly tell her not to do so. She used to feed her 500g and after lengthy arguments, agreed to put it down to 400. Keeda lost some weight after this, but now she's gaining AGAIN and I've caught my mom feeding her all kinds of things off of the table when she thinks I'm not in the room. She isn't actually OBESE as of yet, but even her vet said that she could stand to lose several pounds. Her waist is becoming nonexistent

We got into yet another argument - my mom says that I have no right to tell her how to feed my dog because SHE pays for the food. She has a point, even though the dog is registered with the council in my name - so I told her that I would be buying her food from now on and my mom would not be allowed to feed my dog at all.

So now I'm trying to come up with a good diet for Keeda before the current food that my mom has already bought runs out. I suspect that my mom will keep feeding her leftovers behind my back, but will cut down if I'm the one paying for the actual food.

The problem is money. I can afford to spend no more than about $20-$25 per week on Keeda's food, and $25 is stretching it

I am a full time TAFE student and my study schedule is getting busier and busier. Because of this, I can spend only about 45mins to 1 hour per day walking her outside. Also, as I am having problems with her bolting at other dogs to play (and a bit of aggression toward smaller dogs), I have started to walk her on a 5 meter lead to perfect her recall. I let her off of the lead when she gets a chance to politely approach and play with another dog, but otherwise she will be staying on the lead during our walks until she learns to ignore other dogs when we're out unless allowed to approach. I attempt to keep her busy and active on the lead - playing with soccer ball, practicing commands, running up hills, etc., but nevertheless, she is getting LESS actual exercise than she was before I purchased the lead.

Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I can improve her diet? What are some brands that aren't too expensive, but can be trusted? Should I keep feeding her dry food in the morning and sausage-type food or canned food at night, or are there better options?

Thanks for your help

Liza & Keeda

[persephone]

Hi

Your dog does seem to be getting a lot of food , mothers are like that...feed,feed...

anyway..briefly..have a read here! http://www.dolforums.com.au/index.php?show...351&hl=BARF

There are lots of ways to feed..but a lot feed raw food, which can be made ahead, and is VERY healthy for your dog.

I don't know personally what the cost would be..but wouldn't think it waay expensive.

best of luck

[Guest Tess32]

I feed raw and it would only work out to about $10 a week minimum, $20 max.

[Gomez the Norfolk]

The sausage type roll is full of fillers and fat and water, even if you just fed her dry twice a day, that would be better -

Have a look at the raw, if you don't want to do that, try and get the best dry food you can afford, the one with the least fillers and most natural ingredients, and then feed less than what the bag says - if you want to add some other food you can always cook up some minced turkey and add that to the dry food (I just bought 1kg for $5, so not too expensive)

The good thing about feeding a higher quality dry food (i.e. not a supermarket brand) is that they are more densely packed with nutrients and less fillers, so you end up feeding less anyway, so the higher cost is off-set

You can mix in some cooked pumpkin so that she fills up but not with many calories, and excercise as much as possible

Portion control is going to be the key here - explain to your mum that she coulb be putting your dog's life at risk by overfeeding

For an idea of what really good dry foods are, have a look through these forums, there is a lot of good information, also have a look here:

http://www.dogfoodproject.com/

Edited April 11, 2008 by Gomez the Norfolk

[Gayle.]

My local Coles supermarket have just got chicken frames in stock for the first time and one is enough for a meal for a small/medium dog....they would work out to be less than $1.00 each. Feed a whole frame raw and that takes care of the bone/calcium/clean teeth portion of the diet.

Other raw chicken parts are cheap....necks especially. And excellent for the dogs health. Raw grated or pulverised veges (carrots, choy, zucchini, cauliflower and whatever the greengrocer is getting rid of cheap. Not onions though.) The occasional raw egg, some grated cheese, some homebrand sardines.

Supplement with a good quality kibble.....you will feed a lot less of a premium brand than you will a cheap supermarket brand. Look out for a 2 for 1 offer in pet supply places or any specials that are happening.

That should work out to be way less than $20 a week.

[Liza]

Thanks for all of your help. I don't think I could start feeding Keeda raw food based on the prey model. If I'm understanding it correctly, the prey model involves feeding whole animals and such, am I right? I have nothing against other owners doing this, but I simply don't think I could bring myself to do this! Apologies if I totally misunderstood the whole idea. I could see myself feeding her actual raw meat with no fur/guts/heads involved and perhaps vegetables. Is this what BARF is or am I, again, misunderstanding? I'll look up some info about the barf diet.

Edit: I'm reading over a sample amount of meat/veggies/vitamins to feed on a web site and am definitely feeling overwhelmed. This looks like it would cost way more than kibble Tomorrow or the day after I'm going to go into the local supermarket and see how much some of these things cost.

Edited April 11, 2008 by Liza

[Caesars mum]

Liza

I feed my three chicken carcus from the butcher 1 for breakfast each 4 in a bag for a $1 or lamb flaps cut into portions $1.80kg, for dinner they get dry (best you can afford) and some ground chicken mince from the butcher or chicken shop $1.20 a kilo and mine all over 35 kg each get about 200 grams a night with the cup of kibble. I have 2 giant breed bitches and a boxer and I manage to feed them on less then $50 a week with top quality dry foods.

[poodlefan]

Liza, I think no matter what diet you settle on, the first thing you need to be feeding is LESS.

Canned food and those rolls are probably about the most expensive way to feed a dog - you are paying for mostly water. They are also pretty crap from a quality perspective. I'd ditch them.

You could switch to a decent kibble (best you can afford) and supplement with chicken frames, wings or drumsticks and other raw meaty bones.

You could also make your own "dog food" based on a BARF recipe and supplement with bones.

You don't need to feed an adult dog twice a day but if you want to, make the meals smaller. If your Mum is going to continue to feed scraps, then ask her to put them in a bowl and that becomes part of the meal (you remove any really fatty stuff) not an addition to it.

[Liza]

Caesars mum, thanks for your explanation. I certainly want to look into feeding Keeda raw food and I see now that it should be pretty affordable for me. The site I'm on basically gave an example of the daily intake of food for a golden retriever and gave 3 more explanations for smaller dogs. Out of the other 3, Keeda's size seems to be closest to the Cocker Spaniel breed. It said to basically feed the Cocker Spaniel sized dog 1/4 of the retriever meal, with some specifications. If any of you have time, could you please tell me if this sounds about right?

2 chicken wings

1/2 egg

1/4 teaspoon of yeast, kelp, alfalfa powder

90mg vitamin C and E

1/4 teaspoon of vegetable or olive oil

2 vegetable meals per week. It recommended carrots, turnip, parsnip, green beans, yellow squash, zucchini, dark green lettuces, celery, mixed and matched, not all fed at the same time.

--------

My mom is going to absolutely freak if I start feeding Keeda 2 chicken wings per day instead of her precious chunk of fake meat Poodlefan, I've secretly started cutting down on the sausage type stuff, even giving her only 200g instead of 400g and yet she's not getting any smaller!

I'm worried that if I allow my mom to add things in during mealtime, she'll just add it into the bowl and then give her more when I'm not there. What really gets to her is the idea of Keeda going all day without 'snacks'. I've tried telling her that she can cause serious damage to my dog's health, but my mom refuses to even read any of the material or explanations I've presented her with. She just brushes it all off saying that those trainers, breeders, etc. etc. don't know anything and are being too strict >.< Heck, every time I make Keeda heel when we're on our way to the park she makes sure to add in a "it's like the poor dog's in prison" comment.

Edited April 11, 2008 by Liza

[Dogsfevr]

I would do a deal with your mum you buy the food she can pay the vet bills due to what she feeds.

Okay so your in perth .

You can go to better pets & gardens & buy raw mutton 1kg for $3.95.They also have beef,roo,kennel mix & chicken That would be a min of 4 meals for a dog of your size.They also sell chicken neck/.wings(not sure of price).There mutton mince is excellent quality

You can buy lamb flaps.Tuna,yoghurt.

They do sell the barf patties at $19.95 which would last your dog about 2 weeks added to the dry.

Dry food is great but often better to buy a big bag that will last longer

Edited April 11, 2008 by settrlvr

[Liza]

settrlvr, I definitely like that idea and I'll be sure to tell her that she will be responsible for any issues that were caused by my mom's feeding habits. But I also heard that vets don't like the idea of raw food - so if something does happen to Keeda and we take her to the vet after I've started feeding raw, would the vet not be more likely to blame the raw diet on the issue?

I'm in Western Australia

Thanks for your reply!

[Dogsfevr]

What is she being feed now??

Every vet will have a differing opinion of diet .

What your mum needs to remember is dogs are just as prone to health issues as humans & via the kennels monthly we are boarding diabetic dogs due to what the dogs have been feed,Increased numbers of dogs with heart problems.

With there obesity early arthritis.

Pancreatitis due to the fatty of cuts & when a dog gets this its for life & causes devasting pain for the dog

All issues that often man made & very costly to maintain & lowering the life span.

Feeding a good basic diet isnt that expensive but there is no point feeding quality if iits always getting junk food

[Guest Tess32]

Hey Liza,

If it helps, here is my weekly diet for my youngest dog. It really doesn't cost much at all.

Monday:

Breakfast: Vegetables, 100grams of liver, 1 chicken wing

Dinner: Lamb Neck

Tuesday:

Breakfast:Vegetables, beef, yoghurt

Dinner: Duck or chicken frames

Wednesday

Breakfast: Vegetables, salmon or sardines

Dinner: Maryland, Goat ribs or or turkey wings

Thursday:

Breakfast: Vegetables, 100 grams offal (kidney, pancreas), one chicken wing

Dinner: Lamb Neck

Friday

Breakfast: Vegetables, heart and tongue

Dinner: Duck frames, one egg

Saturday

Breakfast: Vegetables, chicken wing

Dinner: Maryland, turkey or goat

Sunday

Breakfast: Vegetables, beef tongue or heart

Dinner: Chicken frames

[*MURRAY*]

Hello Liza

I feed Murray (a gold retriever) a whole chicken frame each morning and in the evening he gets 1 cup of Bonnie Lite dry food. He will get a couple of bones each week, plus sardines and eggs when I remember.

You can get large chicken frames for 50cents each sometimes, depends where you shop, and pays to shop around until you find a good supplier. Sometimes it's cheaper if you buy a lot at one time and feeze them.

Bonnie Lite dry food is available at City Farmers and costs less than $40 for 20kilos - that would last you months for a beagle size dog - especially if you feed veges, bones, frames etc as one meal and dry food as the other meal ( or mix it).

It's not the best quality dry food, but it's far from the worst and is very affordable.

[Jaxx'sBuddy]

i use frozen green beans (thawed out) added to the dogs meal as a "filler" when i want dogs to loose weight. they like them, it fills them up and has very little calories.

i suggest that you tell your Mum that if she wants to give the dog "treats" then she should give it thawed green beans. that way your mum can feed as much as she wants but with no weight gain for the dog.

[Liza]

settrlvr, here's what she is being fed now:

Up until now my mom has been buying my dog's food. She is fed twice a day - a cup of dry food in the morning and a sausage-thing you have to cut off at night - 400g (400 is what is recommended on the package itself)

I don't know where Better Pets & Gardens is in Perth, but will look it up right now. If I can get there by public transport I can do it

Tess32, thanks so much for the breakdown. I'd love to feed Keeda barf, but I don't think I can bring myself to feed her raw heart and other such things! I'm on my way to becoming vegetarian and while I realize that my ethics shouldn't dictate my dog's diet, I think I literally would feel sick handling all of these parts of dead animals Slabs of meat, wings, and other such things I'm fine with, but actual organs and such, I couldn't do it.

*MURRAY*, thanks for the advice! I never knew you could get chicken frames for 50 cents Then again, I haven't often shopped for raw chicken before. We have a couple of butcher shops and kiosks at the nearby shopping center and I'll check out their prices, as well as looking at the other places suggested in this thread.

Jaxx'sBuddy, I never knew dogs liked green beans. I know Keeda likes to chew on carrots, but have never tried green beans. Maybe I'll give it a go! Thanks a lot

[ShesaLikeableBiBear]

Liza, can you explain to your Mum that an overweight dog could in the future have heart problems, perhaps by doing so she will understand that feeding scraps and treats is not a good idea.

[Gayle.]

My dogs training treats and "snacks" are Nutrience or Eagle Pack kibble, which is then removed from their daily allowance of meal food.

Benson doesn't usually like kibble in a bowl all that much but he'll eat it all day if I feed him one piece at a time from my hand! But keep in mind that the snacks have to be deducted from the overall daily food allowance, so if you're allowing 400g of food per day and doggie gets 100g of snacks, she then only gets 300g in her bowl.

[Dogsfevr]

Liza i meant what brands(should have said) It will give an idea of what diet she has now & what could be adjusted to make it more affordable.

For example if you like the roll idea then i highly recommend the Tuckertime rolls,Far superior to the supermarket brands

[laffi]

I think we can help you more if you can answer these questions:

- do you want to feed dry or raw food?

- what is more acceptable for you and your mum?