New Puppy Dilemas

[leftover-eidos]

Hey, Im new to the forums and am having acouple of troubles with my puppy. As expected with any new dog

Charlie, My Pomeranian, is the cutest little fluff ball, but he is becoming a nightmare. I have two main troubles with him.

We have a 3 level house, in which me and my partner and his son (not mine) rent the upstairs 2 levels two and my sister and my mother live downstairs in their own self contained areas. we have given charlie full reign of the house, and at 8 weeks old he has learnt to climb up and down the stairs, (soo cute, looks like a little bunny) and get into every nook and cranny, and also poop and wee everywhere too.

After a week of cleaning up his waste, we decided that toilet training him this way was not going to work. We've done a bit of research and know that crate training or confining the puppy to an area is a good way to start. So my partner bought a Puppy Play Pen, and lets just say... Charlie hates it.

He cries when he is in it, tries o climb up the walls (doesnt work) and does anything to get us to take him out. Its heart breaking to listen to. So i tried desentitising him to it. I left the door open and make sure all activities revolve around the play pen. His food, water, toys and bed (although he doesnt use his bed) are all in there. Last night at dinner time i put his food in there and he would take a chunk out of his bowl, walk out eat it on the lounge room floor, then go back into the play pen grab another bit and then exit the play pen eat it and then so on.

I dont know if Im doing the right thing, by keeping the door open for him to exit and enter it as he pleases for a week and then leave him in it except for play and cuddle times, until he is toilet trained, or should i be going about this another way.

We are using puppy training pads btw... kinda working.

My other problem is with his biting. He loves to chew on hands. and if you pick him up which he is in one of this play moods he goes physco makes this gnarling hissing kinda noise and moves his head from side to side trying to get at your hands, teeth bared and everything. I try to do this alpha dog exercise i was told to on this ebook i bought online, where hold his head, look straight into his eyes and stroke the bridge of his nose, between his eyes while saying "good dog" and is he moves or tries to resist you growl at him.

Its a bit of a nightmare and i dont want him to think biting is ok... we have a 6yr old in the house and i dont want him hurting Will (the 6yr old).

He is otherwise a good dog, very friendly, active and knows his own name and to sit after a week with us.

I know this is a long post but i would really appreciate some help.

[lucknow]

I feel pretty bad for you, there is nothing like bringing home a cute fluff ball and then having these types of problems...

Honestly I am no expert but it sounds to me like he is running all over you and needs firm hand and clear boundaries to stop this behaviour. Contact a dog trainer in your area, hopefully someone can jump in with recommendations if you say where you are as it is important to get a good one otherwise you could end up in even more trouble. A good trainer will help you sort out what is happening now and teach you how to train for the future also.

Best of luck!

Edited March 25, 2008 by lucknow

[Guest Tess32]

The first rule of house training is to not allow them (as much as you can) to ever make the mistake in the first place. It's about management. If they are not house trained, don't give them full freedom.

You'll have to start taking him out whenever you think (based on his own patterns) the pup is going to pee or poo. Stay out there until he does it, no matter what and praise like a crazy person.

My pup also hated being confined. He would scream from the time he was 6 weeks old. He now is happily crated and confined whenever I like. Within reason, let them cry it out. Yes it's horrible, but they also have to learn to do things they don't always love. When you get a moment of quiet or calm in the puppy pen, let him out. Never ever let him out when crying as it only reinforces it.

Puppies need rules, not lots of choices.

Now with the biting, ditch that 'alpha' move. Challenging a dog gets you nowhere and he's only a baby anyway. If his mouthing hurts you, yelp loudly, stand up and completely ignore him. If he's having one of those crazy puppy moments, do not pick him up and give him attention as you are reinforcing it. Refuse all attention. At first it may take a while as they will have a puppy tantrum.

There are plenty of ways to combat biting but this is the most basic. You'll have to figure out what suits your pup.

The alpha move you are using makes no sense - at the time you are doing it he is probably tense from what you are doing, but you are praising him (good dog) so reinforcing his state of mind. Unfortunately some books out there just suck

Remember to praise ALL good behaviour - calm behaviour, sitting quietly and so on. Do not praise him when he's hyper or excited.

For some pups a "no!" and a time out in the bathroom etc for a minute works, for others it makes no difference at all - so as I said you'll have to figure out what works on your puppy

Nat

Hey, Im new to the forums and am having acouple of troubles with my puppy. As expected with any new dog

Charlie, My Pomeranian, is the cutest little fluff ball, but he is becoming a nightmare. I have two main troubles with him.

We have a 3 level house, in which me and my partner and his son (not mine) rent the upstairs 2 levels two and my sister and my mother live downstairs in their own self contained areas. we have given charlie full reign of the house, and at 8 weeks old he has learnt to climb up and down the stairs, (soo cute, looks like a little bunny) and get into every nook and cranny, and also poop and wee everywhere too.

After a week of cleaning up his waste, we decided that toilet training him this way was not going to work. We've done a bit of research and know that crate training or confining the puppy to an area is a good way to start. So my partner bought a Puppy Play Pen, and lets just say... Charlie hates it.

He cries when he is in it, tries o climb up the walls (doesnt work) and does anything to get us to take him out. Its heart breaking to listen to. So i tried desentitising him to it. I left the door open and make sure all activities revolve around the play pen. His food, water, toys and bed (although he doesnt use his bed) are all in there. Last night at dinner time i put his food in there and he would take a chunk out of his bowl, walk out eat it on the lounge room floor, then go back into the play pen grab another bit and then exit the play pen eat it and then so on.

I dont know if Im doing the right thing, by keeping the door open for him to exit and enter it as he pleases for a week and then leave him in it except for play and cuddle times, until he is toilet trained, or should i be going about this another way.

We are using puppy training pads btw... kinda working.

My other problem is with his biting. He loves to chew on hands. and if you pick him up which he is in one of this play moods he goes physco makes this gnarling hissing kinda noise and moves his head from side to side trying to get at your hands, teeth bared and everything. I try to do this alpha dog exercise i was told to on this ebook i bought online, where hold his head, look straight into his eyes and stroke the bridge of his nose, between his eyes while saying "good dog" and is he moves or tries to resist you growl at him.

Its a bit of a nightmare and i dont want him to think biting is ok... we have a 6yr old in the house and i dont want him hurting Will (the 6yr old).

He is otherwise a good dog, very friendly, active and knows his own name and to sit after a week with us.

I know this is a long post but i would really appreciate some help.

[LostBoy]

I'm new to this puppy world too, but I think there are some similarities with yours and my issues.

When I got Hiro and put in in his pen, he would screamed, cried, pushed the pen, even bit the pen which ended up with a bruise on his nose.

IMHO, you might want to put him in his pen most of the time with you in the room (so he won't feel left out/ deserted), ignore the whining and screaming. Again, I'm no expert in this but this is what I did with my pup.

With biting, I found a very useful trick I saw from TV. Fill a plastic bottle with pebbles inside and close the lid. Everytime your pup's biting you or trying to chew on something you don't want him to chew, you shake the bottle and say the cue word "leave it". The pebble sound somehow scares the dog and it works like a charm for me For example when we are playing tug war, I would say "leave it" and he would let go of whatever toy he's biting.

[Guest Tess32]

I would be careful with that bottle shaking idea sorry You could inadvertedly make your puppy noise-phobic or just sensitive to loud noises. You don't want a dog scared of any noise.

[Dogsfevr]

Okay first your pom needs to be treated with same respect as any other breed whether it be a GSD,lab or cocker.Cute & fluffy doesnt mean allowed to do what it wants.

Toilet training is all about human effort & for the first week pup has had no idea what is unacceptable or what is desired.Your pup can have free range providing all the humans are diligent with the training & that means taking it outside every hr & encourahing the use of a doggy door.

If the dog doesnt have outside access or it isnt an option then you need to set up an area in the house that will be its spot for permant toileting but even then teaching it to go outside is the best option from day 1.

It sounds like with the nipping that its starts as a game because the actions it does arent from normal nothing actions

So either the pup is being over picked up & fussed or someone is blowing in its face/razzing it up & then its no longer fun or its a reaction to the aplha thing.

Eye balling any dog will not win a battle & its not required

For starters if hes in one of his play moods dont pick the pup up,only pick pup up when its calm.

Poms arent stupid but the problem is many people treat them like little fifi dogs & set no rules .

As for the puppy pen used correctly it will be a great toy but you are the one settings the boundries not the dog.

Like we say to people you wouldnt accept this behaviour from children yet people allow there dogs to get away with murder.

You dont have to be firm or over the top just simple consisatnt rules that apply to commensense behaviour.

[leftover-eidos]

thanks guys for your help, definatly wont pick him up when he's in a playful mood anymore. he's doing better in the play pen already, ive assosicated it with treats, and funnily enough when will is around (my bf's son who tends to be a little too demanding and sometimes rough with the dog) he is happy to stay in his little area, it actually took me some convincing with treats to get him out today when i wanted to do a bit of training. i'll do the yipping thing, and walk away as he hates this... but i dont know whether to put him in his pen if he bites too hard or to just walk away... i dont want the pen being thought of as a place for punishment...

[NoodleNut]

thanks guys for your help, definatly wont pick him up when he's in a playful mood anymore. he's doing better in the play pen already, ive assosicated it with treats, and funnily enough when will is around (my bf's son who tends to be a little too demanding and sometimes rough with the dog) he is happy to stay in his little area, it actually took me some convincing with treats to get him out today when i wanted to do a bit of training. i'll do the yipping thing, and walk away as he hates this... but i dont know whether to put him in his pen if he bites too hard or to just walk away... i dont want the pen being thought of as a place for punishment...

Hi! We are also new to this but if it is any encouragement to you.... we persisted with the crate training ... at 16 weeks our pup now sleeps in the crate in the kitchen ... we have just been camping in a tent for 4 days and she slept like a baby in the crate every night at the end of the tent. We also took her pen and put it up outside and she would go in there after our long outings to the beach for 'quiet time'/'time out' and snooze. She was a much happier puppy when she came out .. no nipping/mouthing. We have found if she is very tired or first thing in the morning she is worse with the mouthing .. needs to either get rid of the excess energy with a game of fetch or have time out on her own.

Our pup was like yours in that she disliked the pen, wanted to be with us 24/7. But persistence as the other DOL members have said is well worth it. A screaming crying pup now means that in a couple of days you will have one that is more pleasant to be with, happy to be in his space .. portable in that you can move him around in the crate and he feels safe.... no poop or wee on the carpet!! That is a bonus in itself I am sure.

Set the ground rules now. Ours does not, and never has had, access to the house in the 8 weeks we have had her. When she is not out playing, walking, sleeping or eating she is tethered on a long lead in the kitchen (easy to clean up the floor and to monitor her for toileting purposes .. important in those early weeks) as that is where we spend most of our time and the computer is there. We do not trust her off the leash inside. She comes off occassionally if it is only one of us up at night (like now ) and can keep an eye on her. Too many things for her to wreck/chew/swallow etc. We also have parquetry and she knows not to go on that already. She is also not allowed on the rug in the lounge .. I let her on it twice in the early days and both times she wee'd on it .. I think she thinks it is grass!! ) We also had the pen in the kitchen from 8 weeks of age until 13 weeks of age .. she also had an absorbant pad for mostly at night when I couldn't get to her fast enough to get her outside. She has now graduated to the crate only at night and the door is shut with a bowl of water.

We didn't/and don't put our pup in the pen when she mouths .. we just stear clear of her. Both of the children, 5yrs and 9 years only have to take one step back out of her space to be out of range .. she is learning fast that 4 paws on the ground and a mouth that is shut gets her attention. We all do the 'turn our backs, look at the ceiling and cross our arms and ignore' .. sometimes walking off completely and coming back a few minutes later to try again. If we are outside when she does it we come inside.

Hang in there. You have a gorgeous little pup!

[Whitecherry]

Gosh, I know what you're going through... I'm in the same boat as you and Noodlenut.. A new puppy with an attitude! I crate mine at night, he screamed & carried on for a few nights and then settled in so we could all have a good nights sleep. During the day, I'll tether him on his lead near to where I'm working so I can see him and know where he is & what he's doing.. (toileting is still a big issue, see the thread on Poo Eating if you want to know more ! lol... ) and I found this worked better as he still had some movement and didn't feel so confined, and I know he's not running all over the house toileting where he pleases.

It's hard, you bring a puppy home and you're so excited, only to find it's like having a baby!

Good Luck!

ShelleyLee

[♪♫LMBC♫♪]

It's hard, you bring a puppy home and you're so excited, only to find it's like having a baby!

Yay! Sleepless nights and cleaning up poop! I have soo much too look forward too

[Affie]

Its been three weeks and im still sleepless.

My fist afghan pup learnt after 4 nights of screaming he was either going to be ignored or roused on so he shut up.

I dont know how to stop my new little girl tho, i have tried ignoring she will scream for 3 hrs straight without a break.

I have tried rousing in person and through the door, I have tried the calming settle her back down to sleep and leave which is the most reliable but then im awake too

She got really frantic in her crate biting the metal bars and hyperventillating so i have moved her to a puppy pen but this morning she was trying to jump out of it and she can almost succeed

She only lasts asleep til about 5am.

My boy lasts til i get up which during week will be 7.30 and on weekends can be 10.30

Really really tired and out of idea's

it does take the joy out of a new puppy and make you very cranky with them

Edited April 3, 2008 by Affie

[Cockerlover]

These are all the joys of puppy ownership!!! first & formost you must let the puppy know you are the boss ;they are creatures of habit!! be it good or bad!! liken them to babies; they know no better than you teach them!!you must be consistant with your training & sleepless nights are all a part of it;do not keep going to the crying baby in hopes it will stop ;it Wont; just ignore it!!oryou will inforce the idear that if it crys it will get attention. same with tiolet training ;take the baby to its toilet spot regulary ;stay with it till it performes ;then praise like crazy; stick with it it will be worth it in the long run; only praise good behavior & ignore tantrums!Enjoy your success!

[persephone]

May I add a very important thing...

If your pup throws a tantrum lasting 3 hours.......THEN you go and either chastise or comfort...

Guess what?

NEXT tantrum will last 3 hours and longer.... cos they know that if they persevere someone will EVENTUALLY come

Receiving attention is such a powerful reward..............

[Pixie's mum]

We have a 16 month old female and a 12 week old male. Initially we had difficulty toilet training our female to use the pads as she is locked inside while we are at work. We bought a pet loo which she took to straight away. Our male at 8 weeks would struggle to climb on the loo however he never got the hang of the pads. We thought he would need the pads as he was too tiny to use the loo which is about 15cm off the ground (frightening as he would leap off if you weren't watching) however he decided the pet loo is the only way to go. They are expensive although we would have spent far more in the last year or so if we were using disposables as our dogs are still inside while we are at work. I can't recommend them enough.

Good Luck

[NoodleNut]

Its been three weeks and im still sleepless.

My fist afghan pup learnt after 4 nights of screaming he was either going to be ignored or roused on so he shut up.

I dont know how to stop my new little girl tho, i have tried ignoring she will scream for 3 hrs straight without a break.

I have tried rousing in person and through the door, I have tried the calming settle her back down to sleep and leave which is the most reliable but then im awake too

She got really frantic in her crate biting the metal bars and hyperventillating so i have moved her to a puppy pen but this morning she was trying to jump out of it and she can almost succeed

She only lasts asleep til about 5am.

My boy lasts til i get up which during week will be 7.30 and on weekends can be 10.30

Really really tired and out of idea's

it does take the joy out of a new puppy and make you very cranky with them

Hi Affie,

I am with you Affie ... it is exhausting!!

I have to agree with Persephone though .. you have to just persist ..... perhaps do what we did and crate your pup and then go out ... don't have to listen to the commotion .. I know it is frustrating and upsetting.

We would take Noodle for a big walk or lots of exercise .. this also wore her out so in the end she would sleep. Noodle was exactly as you described biting at the metals bars on the crate and panting lots .. very upset. Very hard to ignore I know ... it was only a few weeks back that we had this same thing happening.

Yes, it is tiring .. I felt like I had a newborn baby again because my other half would often sleep through everything .. grrr..... just me up and down all night toiletting and getting stressed when we shut the door on the crate. As Persephone said .. three hours of crying could increase to more if you go to your pup as they know they will eventually get attention from you. Going out is much easier on the emotions .. YOURS ....... you come home feeling much calmer and usually pup is stuffed from al the yelling but no reply that ours went to sleep much quicker (still yelled for 30 minutes but it was better than 2 hours!) Try a Friday night and go shopping/out to dinner/something for 2 hours and leave pup with something to chew (treat ball with their dinner, frozen chicken neck to make the ordeal a little more pleasant perhaps?)

How old is your new pup? Let us know how you are going and if you come up with any new ideas you could share with other members with new pups

[sas]

Its been three weeks and im still sleepless.

My fist afghan pup learnt after 4 nights of screaming he was either going to be ignored or roused on so he shut up.

I dont know how to stop my new little girl tho, i have tried ignoring she will scream for 3 hrs straight without a break.

I have tried rousing in person and through the door, I have tried the calming settle her back down to sleep and leave which is the most reliable but then im awake too

She got really frantic in her crate biting the metal bars and hyperventillating so i have moved her to a puppy pen but this morning she was trying to jump out of it and she can almost succeed

She only lasts asleep til about 5am.

My boy lasts til i get up which during week will be 7.30 and on weekends can be 10.30

Really really tired and out of idea's

it does take the joy out of a new puppy and make you very cranky with them

That doesn't sound like much fun, there are other methods which some people may be ok with and some may be totally against, I'll put them out there, you can do the research and see what you think.

I did know someone whose puppy screamed non-stop in the crate for months and months.

With a dog flipping out in a crate, some people will bang the top of the crate in a firm manner.

I think though, if your puppy is still being nutty in the crate is there a possiblity you've given it a reason to do so, when they cry, scream etc, you just have to put up with it, totally ignore it, don't rouse at them, telling them to shut up etc, don't go to them, dogs typically only carry on this type of routine when they know they're going to get some form of attention whether it be negative or positive.

I'd always say go for a crate, the crate should only be big enough to stand and turn around in, you can put a chew toy in there and a heat pad or one of those special toys with a heat pad and heart beat.

Puppy pens I would not reccomend.

I personaly reccomend that the crate should be in your bedroom with a cover over at least part of it, over time when the puppy is ok with the crate you can move it inch by inch out of your room if that's what you want.