Prong Collars - Q&a

[Erny]

If I don't have it on him and he does something wrong, I can't correct him... can I? If it's on him and he does nothing wrong then it'll never need to be used.

BTW, I don't even own a flat collar. I only own a prong for Gizmo... Why do I want him walking on a flat collar? I take the prong with me everywhere just like any one else takes their flat collar everywhere.

That's not quite what you said earlier Midol. You said that he pulls if he's in a flat collar, so it seems that you have the PPCollar on him so he won't pull. That's different to having it on him as a "in case".

Just my opinion, but I like a dog to be able to demonstrate loose lead walking training without reliance on the equipment type. If the dog has the misfortune to have to stay over at the Vet or even at a friend's place, I wouldn't be giving them a training tool to use when I don't know that they'll use it properly. I like to know therefore that the dog can be walked out on an ordinary collar, knowing that this would make it easier for both the person/s the dog was staying with (and ensuring safe, controlled exercise during my absence/inability to be with the dog) as well as for the dog.

ETA: For clarification - I don't think there is anything wrong with using a chosen training tool as a "just in case it's needed" as being prepared can enhance training. But I like to know the training tool isn't an absolute necessity all the time.

It's a choice, Midol. And if the choice is available, the above is the one I'd make. But again - only expressing my opinion and preference. It doesn't have to be yours or anyone else's .

Edited May 17, 2008 by Erny

[Just Midol]

Ohhh, back then he might have. I don't remember, at that stage I'd only had a prong for maybe a week from memory so I might not have had him fully trained. Now though he'd probably walk on a flat collar fine - I've never tried. I might try it just to see. Will have to get a flat collar though.

I guess I don't have that issue, I won't leave my dog with friends anymore - if I go somewhere he either stays with Mum or he will go into a boarding kennel.

[RL1]

I'm curious about this prong collar. It might be of use for my male Rottweiler who like's to walk me. I'd like to know what Steve from K9 Force thinks of them.

[Kavik]

Steve sells them

[RL1]

Steve sells them

Ok then, there's my answer.. I still wouldn't be convinced without seeing one being used first hand on my own dog.

[Kavik]

Not every dog needs one, and they are not suitable for every dog. But they can be very useful if you have a big strong dog that is difficult to control. Good idea to get a demo first and see how they are supposed to be used .

[RL1]

Not every dog needs one, and they are not suitable for every dog. But they can be very useful if you have a big strong dog that is difficult to control. Good idea to get a demo first and see how they are supposed to be used .

My dog fits that description perfectly. I'll ask about one when i'm at K9 Force later this year.

[Tapferhund]

Cesar Millan is a well respected dog psychologist /trainer worldwide and in his book "Be The Pack Leader" he gives the Prong Collar ,as a training tool , the thumbs up and he explains how the collar is based on nature ,that it was designed to mimic "the bite of a mother dog or dominant dog.

Erny have you read this book? It is on pages 100 to 102.......and could be useful for your report to the authorities (?) How is that going BTW?

[laneka]

Prong Collars - hmmmmm - Similar arguement that horseriders have with the use of different bits.

Generally in the horse world, the bigger the bit, the less the brain.... seems to me it would be easier to find a solution to the problem instead of adding a stronger tool.

Now guess Im going to get 'howled' down for daring to challenge.

happy howling

Hmm, I have just popped in to this thread to try to get a better understanding about the prong collars. I have a young 7 mth old Rottie bitch who can be very strong. If I walk her on my own she is very good, but if I have another dog with me being led by someone else I have a hell of a battle until half way around the block until she settles down. Not my idea of having a nice peaceful walk.

Since you have used the horse / bit as an example I am now even more set on learning about using a prong. I need to get this girl to settle on walks with other dogs. I had horses for almost 20 years. Most of them I used a soft snaffle bit, Tom thumb or an egg butt. 2 of them took me ages and heaps of money to find the right bit. I did not want to go to a hard bit as I thought it was too cruel. But the reality of it being that the horses were bloody dangerous if I could not control them properly. So I ended up going with a portmouth pelham with chain. (both straight and curbed - with and with out players) You name it I would have tried it. Exercise had nothing to do with it as my "short rides" were usually around 10 MILES, when I had time I would do anything from 10 - 40 MILES sometimes much more. I was doing trail riding in those days so everything was fit including me. The horse that caused me the most grief I kept for 15 years, he only got the message when he was getting into his golden years.

So if I am to think of a prong collar on a dog like I would with a hard bit on a horse, I am all for the prong collar used correctly, as control is vital.

Now I am going to go back through all the posts to learn more about something that I thought was not a nice tool to use on any dog. Only now I have a different understanding about how good a prong really can be when used correctly.

ED:

Ok Read it all and I am open to learn more on the prong collar if I need to use one in the future.

How about some good old fashioned obedience done at least twice a day. Prongs are illegal in Vic and for F***sake she is a baby.

[arawnhaus]

Probably been said already a dozen times.....but a training tool is only effective if that dog responds to that particular correction and what works for some may not for others.A Prong collar should be available just like the check chain, Head Halter,Harness etc etc.........All are training devices with there own + and -

All training devices are s*it if they are used in the wrong hands.E- collars attract much emotion.Yet it seems more people are ok with these.....

Me personally whatever works.........

Edited May 18, 2008 by Delkerabo

[laneka]

Prong collars are illegal to use on a dog, but not to own. I have used them in the past, I probably will again in the future if I have a real problem dog. E collars are illegal too and I agree with you, both can be a very useful tool. You can use prongs but you must have a Vet cert okaying it. But to use a prong on a 7mth old bitch who is soft in temp and with an unexperienced handler then as far as I am concerned you are asking for trouble.

[Andisa]

Prong Collars - hmmmmm - Similar arguement that horseriders have with the use of different bits.

Generally in the horse world, the bigger the bit, the less the brain.... seems to me it would be easier to find a solution to the problem instead of adding a stronger tool.

Now guess Im going to get 'howled' down for daring to challenge.

happy howling

Hmm, I have just popped in to this thread to try to get a better understanding about the prong collars. I have a young 7 mth old Rottie bitch who can be very strong. If I walk her on my own she is very good, but if I have another dog with me being led by someone else I have a hell of a battle until half way around the block until she settles down. Not my idea of having a nice peaceful walk.

Since you have used the horse / bit as an example I am now even more set on learning about using a prong. I need to get this girl to settle on walks with other dogs. I had horses for almost 20 years. Most of them I used a soft snaffle bit, Tom thumb or an egg butt. 2 of them took me ages and heaps of money to find the right bit. I did not want to go to a hard bit as I thought it was too cruel. But the reality of it being that the horses were bloody dangerous if I could not control them properly. So I ended up going with a portmouth pelham with chain. (both straight and curbed - with and with out players) You name it I would have tried it. Exercise had nothing to do with it as my "short rides" were usually around 10 MILES, when I had time I would do anything from 10 - 40 MILES sometimes much more. I was doing trail riding in those days so everything was fit including me. The horse that caused me the most grief I kept for 15 years, he only got the message when he was getting into his golden years.

So if I am to think of a prong collar on a dog like I would with a hard bit on a horse, I am all for the prong collar used correctly, as control is vital.

Now I am going to go back through all the posts to learn more about something that I thought was not a nice tool to use on any dog. Only now I have a different understanding about how good a prong really can be when used correctly.

ED:

Ok Read it all and I am open to learn more on the prong collar if I need to use one in the future.

How about some good old fashioned obedience done at least twice a day. Prongs are illegal in Vic and for F***sake she is a baby.

Perhaps you missed what I wrote, so I highlited it.

I only said that I am open to learn more about them IF I needed to use one in the future.

No where did I write that I am or are using one on this 7 month old bitch who yes is soft in temerament. Again, I only said that I am open to learn more about them. I don't even own one.

Yes this is a young bitch who still has a long way to go, I am not strong enough to fight a strong dog half way around the block until she settles down, I have injuries that she will worsen if I am not careful. I have come a long way with this girl as you know. I still have a long way to go with her as you also know.

What ever happened to educating people before attacking them. I only said that I am open to learn about something.

Edited May 18, 2008 by Lisa M

[laneka]

Have you ever asked me what to do with her? Sorry folks I own her sire. As I said she needs obedience. I also have major shoulder injuries, I go to an osteo every fortnight and still manage to handle 50+kg Rottweilers. It is all about training and more training. Rip on average goes to obedience at least once a week, my OH also trains him in the backyard, he is taken on walks with other dogs, not just ours, he has been socialised with other dogs since he was 14 weeks old. He can still annoy other dogs but he has learnt when we say no we mean it. So lock the others up and do at least two training sessions a day in your back yard and use this when you are walking her. Yes she is strong but she is not uncontrolable. She just needs to be taught.

[Andisa]

Have you ever asked me what to do with her? Sorry folks I own her sire. As I said she needs obedience. I also have major shoulder injuries, I go to an osteo every fortnight and still manage to handle 50+kg Rottweilers. It is all about training and more training. Rip on average goes to obedience at least once a week, my OH also trains him in the backyard, he is taken on walks with other dogs, not just ours, he has been socialised with other dogs since he was 14 weeks old. He can still annoy other dogs but he has learnt when we say no we mean it. So lock the others up and do at least two training sessions a day in your back yard and use this when you are walking her. Yes she is strong but she is not uncontrolable. She just needs to be taught.

Why the need for this on a public forum.

I only said that I was open to learn about something.

[laneka]

Then why ask about an illegal training tool on a public forum, why not ask people who have been in the breed for years.

[Andisa]

Then why ask about an illegal training tool on a public forum, why not ask people who have been in the breed for years.

I did not ask about using one on my 7 month old baby, I only said that I am open to learn more about them if I need to use one in the future.

I did not start this post, it was started by someone else wanting to vent about people being rude while he was trying to sell one.

I have talked to others about them in the past. But not with you. We have talked about other types of training methods though.

Like any training tool there are pros and cons about them. I was simply trying to learning more about this type of collar as the topic was here.

[laneka]

Well Lisa, when you are enquiring about the use of a prong collar and you talk about your hard to walk 7mth old pup, in the same post, it does not take much to put the two together.

That bitch needs more hands on by strangers and a heap more obedience. You do not need a prong collar, just obedience.

[arawnhaus]

Off Immediate topic but on somewhat..

Perhaps people wanting further Information on training tools could go directly to this site.

http://www.k9force.net/prong.html

[Andisa]

Deleted. This has nothing to do with the original post so I am withdrawing it.

I am not interested in where this is going.

Edited May 18, 2008 by Lisa M