An Idea; "the Ultimate Dol Raw/prey Diet Information" Thread

[Amstaff Shane]

Gday,

Whilst using the search function to find information from actual members regarding raw feed/prey diets, I have found that information is scattered all over the place (many websites, many different threads and many groups).

Seeing as there are almost 13,000 members on this forum, and thousands of members have their dogs on a raw/prey diet, I was pondering why there isn't a sticky thread which is basically an "Ultimate DOL Raw/Prey Diet Information" thread in which all of our experienced members can continously add/edit/update information for novices/advanced owners that would like to feed their companions a raw/prey food diet.

I am just starting my girl Meike this week on a raw/prey diet, and although I have read a few ebooks, many websites and signed up to yahoo listings for my own benefit (seems like too much work and could have been made craploads easier), it hasn't been the easiest thing to do, due to having questions I haven't been able to find an answer for. Due to the fact we have such a large forum here, I think it would be beneficial to not only new people but also those that are experienced may learn a few things and find all the information they need, in one place, on this great forum.

The sort of thread I was pondering would be one that has not only what meats to feed, but also information on the quantities to feed depending on ideal weight of ALL dogs (both daily and weekly amounts), published in an EASY to read, no nonsense guide with links on how to find dogs ideal weight, a percentage calculator, do's and dont's, etc. Basically, EVERYTHING needed at your fingertips to get you up and running (including a simple visit to the butcher) without having to search dozens of websites/groups for information.

I know that there are available resources published by other people (books, etc), however there are many contradictions and I believe that we, as thousands of dog owner members, could basically re-compile a more beneficial resource on this very forum.

Perhaps we could use *this* current thread as a discussion thread in which we can take information that we, as members, discuss/debate/agree and then compile an "Ultimate DOL Raw/Prey Diet Information" thread in which can be accessed as a "click and voila" complete resource for the novice and experienced raw/prey feeder.

It would also mean alot more coming from experienced Australian owners who are living proof that the diet is the best thing for your dog.

Would any of you be interested in working with each other to compile such a thread on here? Would Moderators allow us to continously update a 'Continous Sticky' with the name of "DOL Ultimate Raw/Prey Feed" thread? (Similar to the General Health Information sticky, however only specific users have access to edit the information)

I think this is a pretty serious thing to have, especially for those that may join the forum and have no clue what wet, commercially made canned food does to their companion. This would give them an alternative, without the hassle of looking elsewhere. Something we can call our own.

Any Takers?

Edited February 19, 2008 by Amstaff Shane

[Guest Tess32]

Are you including BARF and modified BARF diets? Because that seems to be what most people are feeding. The prey model diet would be in the minority here..

[Amstaff Shane]

Are you including BARF and modified BARF diets? Because that seems to be what most people are feeding. The prey model diet would be in the minority here..

Some say that BARF is different due to the fact it includes fruits/vegetables, and some who discard those types of foods from the BARF diet are feeding raw/prey with a mixture of kibble or other foods (modified BARF in that respect), and then there's others who say they are on a BARF diet which is effectively a complete raw/prey diet.

In *my* opinion, BARF is different, so I would say that raw/prey doesn't include BARF, however I'm open to discuss that with everyone who wants to contribute. healthy debate is definitely good.

Edited February 19, 2008 by Amstaff Shane

[Guest Tess32]

I agree they are quite different, I just think there probably aren't enough people here feeding prey model to get enough discussion going. I think it would end up more beneficial to include info on ALL raw diets and people can weigh up the pros/cons using the info in this thread :rolleyes:

[Joypod]

I agree they are quite different, I just think there probably aren't enough people here feeding prey model to get enough discussion going. I think it would end up more beneficial to include info on ALL raw diets and people can weigh up the pros/cons using the info in this thread :rolleyes:

I wouldn't be sure about that. Let's find out shall we? I for one am feeding Gus a raw/prey diet. Why can't we have two Raw Feeders threads? One for prey model feeders and one for modified raw (which would include Barf, raw + some kibble, etc)?

[Amstaff Shane]

I agree they are quite different, I just think there probably aren't enough people here feeding prey model to get enough discussion going. I think it would end up more beneficial to include info on ALL raw diets and people can weigh up the pros/cons using the info in this thread :rolleyes:

I guess what I was moreso wanting was a non-BARF thread that really focused on a complete raw/prey diet (BARF is not completely raw/prey really). Those who chose to go down this path have an "Ultimate Raw/Prey" thread, and if those that are on BARF want to make one for "BARF" then they can do so for those who prefer that method.

Ultimately, I want a thread that has the information minus the discussion inbetween (so basically there will be two threads, this one we are using to discuss and the one we create that has the information only - e.g the "Ultimate")

[Miss Monster]

Sounds great - It would make it easier. After working out I spend about $50/week on dry food for my 2 ridgy's I'm looking for something cheaper! Looked into the Barf patties but it would be even more expensive and I'm totally confused about supplements etc to do it myself. I've been interested in prey/raw but don't quite know where to start.

[Amstaff Shane]

Sounds great - It would make it easier. After working out I spend about $50/week on dry food for my 2 ridgy's I'm looking for something cheaper! Looked into the Barf patties but it would be even more expensive and I'm totally confused about supplements etc to do it myself. I've been interested in prey/raw but don't quite know where to start.

It seems there are many that want to *start*, but they are either scared or do not know HOW to start without the hassle of not knowing what to do. This is the sole reason I want to make an Ultimate Raw/Prey Food thread, for people like yourself that want to know the ins and outs without having to take rubbish out of the bin, so to speak :rolleyes:

[Joypod]

I agree they are quite different, I just think there probably aren't enough people here feeding prey model to get enough discussion going. I think it would end up more beneficial to include info on ALL raw diets and people can weigh up the pros/cons using the info in this thread

I guess what I was moreso wanting was a non-BARF thread that really focused on a complete raw/prey diet (BARF is not completely raw/prey really). Those who chose to go down this path have an "Ultimate Raw/Prey" thread, and if those that are on BARF want to make one for "BARF" then they can do so for those who prefer that method.

Ultimately, I want a thread that has the information minus the discussion inbetween (so basically there will be two threads, this one we are using to discuss and the one we create that has the information only - e.g the "Ultimate")

Yep, I'm more than happy to support this. It'd be great to have a purely information based discussion thread about prey model feeding without trying to argue a case for it at the same time. Excellent idea IMO. :rolleyes:

[Clyde]

:rolleyes: I'm really confused. Admittedly not into diet in hard core way like some - but I always thought that BARF was raw feeding. What am I missing? Also what is the difference between raw and prey model?

[Joypod]

Clyde, BARF is raw feeding, just a different sort to a prey model. BARF feeders feed fruit and veggies with the meat and raw meaty bones. Prey model feeders feed whole animals in various forms like raw meaty bones, offal, whole fish, whole eggs, etc. No veggies, no fruit.

Basically BARF feeders feed based on the notion that dogs are omnivores and prey model feeders feed based on the notion that they're carnivores. :rolleyes:

Both are raw diets.

[poodlefan]

:rolleyes: I'm really confused. Admittedly not into diet in hard core way like some - but I always thought that BARF was raw feeding. What am I missing? Also what is the difference between raw and prey model?

BARF is raw feeding. If you are feeding any kind of cooked processed food including kibble you are not feeding a BARF diet, no matter what you might call it. Do I sound rather passionate about that.

From what I can see Clyde, BARFers feed more vegetable material than prey diet feeders. Some BARFers might still include some grain in the diet that would be pretty unusual these days and and I sure ain't one of them.

Weights and percentages for feeding are difficult Shane. I have two dogs here within 200g of each other in weight and the younger one eats 50% more than the other. You can get some guidelines but so much depends on your dog and how much exercise it gets.

Ask away. I think sometimes you'll get a better result if you ask things specific to your queries. No one diet suits all dogs so it's sometimes easier to deal with your dog specifically. I'm happy to contribute to a sticky thread though.

ETA: Snap Joypod!

Edited February 19, 2008 by poodlefan

[Golden Rules]

I think this is a great idea :rolleyes:

I tend to feed mostly raw /prey model diet but occasionally wander off to the BARF side when I have the time and resources. And othertimes my boys might get kibble (I whispered that bit )

Even a discussion thread would bring about some great ideas that can be copied into the "Ultimate" thread - definitely a good way to go

I do agree with Poodlefan tho that it's really hard to stipulate quantities for dogs by weight as age and exercise play such a big part, still a general guide might be able to be worked out.......

OK, so here's another supporter

[Guest Pandii]

I do a bit of everything

Tonight they got dry food, tomorrow they get whole rabbits minus the head, but with fur, guts ect.

What would you call that sort of feeding?

[aranyoz]

Another raw feeder here, raw meaty bones style, prey model I guess.

[B-Q]

one of the things thats alwayus made me wonder why people feed 100% meat is the same thing that will keep all my dogs having some vegies in their diet.

When presented with a field of grass... they all graze. Heads down like cattle, so I'll keep vegies in their diet.

SO Buster gets bikkies and pumpkin in the morning and night time is meat. Every few days I'll cook up mince and vegies.

Plus Buster isn't mad on meat as it is, so he does well with other things in his diet.

[Amstaff Shane]

one of the things thats alwayus made me wonder why people feed 100% meat is the same thing that will keep all my dogs having some vegies in their diet.

When presented with a field of grass... they all graze. Heads down like cattle, so I'll keep vegies in their diet.

SO Buster gets bikkies and pumpkin in the morning and night time is meat. Every few days I'll cook up mince and vegies.

Plus Buster isn't mad on meat as it is, so he does well with other things in his diet.

I'm sure I speak on behalf of many, when I say that I have no problem with people giving their dogs vegies as long as they are the vegies that *matter*. At the end of the day, this thread is not to discuss with people what they can and cannot feed their dog(s), but for those who WANT to put their dog(s) on a complete raw/prey diet, at least the information will be accessible once the actual "Ultimate" thread is compiled and updated with solid, healthy information that anyone can understand regarding raw/prey diets.

If other people who are serious about the actual BARF diet want to create an "Ultimate" thread regarding that, then I think that may be a good idea so that people can differentiate between the two models and choose which one they (and their dogs) prefer the most.

So, with that out the way, where do we start when it comes to the raw/prey model? Shall we start at the actual ingredients (e.g is beef/chicken/kangaroo mince Ok to use, is it best to use chunks of meat, etc)

Decent discussion and debate is what it's all about. If you experience with types of meat intake, etc, please don't hold back! Good, healthy discussion is what we want! :rolleyes:

Edited February 19, 2008 by Amstaff Shane

[Golden Rules]

OK, well I'm a fan of whole chicken carcasses - and regardless of their weight (one is 34 kilos and one is 29 kilos) they will each get a whole one every morning. Often these are quite large.

I will also feed sheeps necks, lamb bones and offcuts and occasionally I'll feed marrow bones.

If I have left over fruit and veges they get those as well, but it's more of a useful thing for me to get rid if them that way, rather than throwing them away, I don't see it as being essential in their diet.

I would love to know where I can get whole rabbits to feed my boys. I'm in Perth - anyone have any idea?

[Guest Tess32]

My main question is - I know the prey model diet is based on species appropriate food (again based on the Wolf or other similar carnivores). Dogs differ from wild animals in that A) most are less active and B) They get daily food rather than having to gorge and then recover for a few days. With relation to this, does this effect how dogs would cope with the huge amount of protein?

Also I'd be interested to hear from anyone who has raised a puppy purely on prey model and what was fed.

[poodlefan]

My main question is - I know the prey model diet is based on species appropriate food (again based on the Wolf or other similar carnivores). Dogs differ from wild animals in that A) most are less active and B) They get daily food rather than having to gorge and then recover for a few days. With relation to this, does this effect how dogs would cope with the huge amount of protein?

Also I'd be interested to hear from anyone who has raised a puppy purely on prey model and what was fed.

Darcy was raised from the day I got him on a raw diet (BARF) Tess - is that what you wanted or someone who's weaned pups onto raw. Steve does.

ETA: Oops Steve and I are BARFers. You want prey modellers.

Edited February 19, 2008 by poodlefan