Advice On New Staffy Pup

[Jim20186]

Hey everyone. I would like some advice on my new 7 week old (American male) Staffordshire Bull Terrier.

I just recently bought him last week, and after viewing the parents I was impressed how good natured they were.

The catch is, that I have another Staffy (also male, de-sexed) who is 4 years old. He is an English. Very lovely dog, well natured, but also very territorial. He is a big sook deep down though, like most staffy's. Doesnt like to get in trouble, very highly strung but also dominant (which is a weird mix). He hates birds, possums or anything in his backyard, as it's a shame because there have been a few dead birds and possums over the years.

Since I've brought the pup in, I have managed to get the pup used to the older dog and the older dog is slightly coming around (he isnt snapping at the pup as much as he first did)

My concerns do not lie with the older dog though, I know he will come around. What concerns me is the puppy. I'm already seeing a dominant nature from him, he already runs around thinking he rules the roost and as the pack leader (myself), I've been doing all the normal things that I've done with Tyson (older dog) when he was a pup (which worked well)

Unfortunately, this little guy has a mind of his own. Everytime i say no, he snarls, barks and even growls at me. I know that's pretty normal, as he is trying to establish himself in the pack, but I'm a little concerned at the "growling". Especially at his age (7 weeks)

Not only that, he is a royal pain in the backside to tyson who is copping it without biting, or now getting aggressive back towards him. Tyson is pretty much taking everything the pup throws at him which concerns me as tyson is usually very dominant (i really don't want the pup thinking he has it over Tyson). For some reason he is taking himself off to the laundry all day (he usually doesnt sleep in there at all) and wants to seperate himself from the pup because of the annoyance.

The Pup is obsessed with biting feet (really obsessed), sometimes even drawing blood at times.

I've tried multiple methods of stopping this, from deep NO's (and believe me, I'm a big bloke with a deep voice so I can throw down a pretty intimidating NO) to coins in soda cans (that rattle loud) to rolled up news paper as a tap on the hand (I'd never hit the pup with it).

Nothing seems to work, he just has too much of a mind of his own.

Earlier today he started biting me on the feet, i quickly nudged him off and said no and for the first time I heard him growl and snarl. This worried me the most, and he has continued it since.

I work long hours, thus i wanted to bring in a little mate for Tyson so that he doesnt get too bored during the day. But I have been a little concerned with this young pup, he is already trying to dominate the pack and so far, nothing is working to show him who the leader is, and who the dominant dog is.

Feel free to give me as much advice as possible, the more the merrier as he is a cute little fella, just very naughty. This is new for me, mixing two dogs together thus the more advice the better.

Jim

Brisbane

Edited December 23, 2007 by Jim20186

[Nevafollo]

im hoping u got papers for ur amstaff but as hes only 7 weeks old im doubting he came from a registered breeder (which would mean no papers), the thing is with amstaffs u really need their papers so when or if the council come knocking on ur door u can prove he isnt a pitty!!! but whats done is done, ur just going to have to SUPER careful and avoid the council!!! u say u are from brissy? its really not a great place to own and unpapered amstaff, QLD is one of the worst states for BSL....i'd suggest u research BSL (breed specific legislation)

alot of his issues would stem from being taken away from his litter mates early, between 6 and 8 weeks they are learning their boundaries, litter mates and ther mum are putting them in there place at this age.

i'd suggest u keep the boys seperated when ever u arnt home, if and when they fight its going to end badly amstaffs stem from pittys and have a fighting instinct, every heard the saying when it comes to bull breeds, he or she may not start it but they WILL finish it?!?!?!?

Edited December 23, 2007 by sammy_ballerina

[Jim20186]

im hoping u got papers for ur amstaff but as hes only 7 weeks old im doubting he came from a registered breeder (which would mean no papers), the thing is with amstaffs u really need their papers so when or if the council come knocking on ur door u can prove he isnt a pitty!!! but whats done is done, ur just going to have to SUPER careful and avoid the council!!! u say u are from brissy? its really not a great place to own and unpapered amstaff, QLD is one of the worst states for BSL....i'd suggest u research BSL (breed specific legislation)

alot of his issues would stem from being taken away from his litter mates early, between 6 and 8 weeks they are learning their boundaries, litter mates and ther mum are putting them in there place at this age.

i'd suggest u keep the boys seperated when ever u arnt home, if and when they fight its going to end badly amstaffs stem from pittys and have a fighting instinct, every heard the sayiong when it comes to bull breeds, he or she may not start it but they WILL finish it?!?!?!?

Thanks for the concern. Unfortunately no, I do not have papers. He is not a full american, after viewing his parents his father was the american and his mother was an english.

By the look of it, he does not look like a pitbull. He's got to develop more, but his parents were nowhere near pitbulls.

[Nevafollo]

im hoping u got papers for ur amstaff but as hes only 7 weeks old im doubting he came from a registered breeder (which would mean no papers), the thing is with amstaffs u really need their papers so when or if the council come knocking on ur door u can prove he isnt a pitty!!! but whats done is done, ur just going to have to SUPER careful and avoid the council!!! u say u are from brissy? its really not a great place to own and unpapered amstaff, QLD is one of the worst states for BSL....i'd suggest u research BSL (breed specific legislation)

alot of his issues would stem from being taken away from his litter mates early, between 6 and 8 weeks they are learning their boundaries, litter mates and ther mum are putting them in there place at this age.

i'd suggest u keep the boys seperated when ever u arnt home, if and when they fight its going to end badly amstaffs stem from pittys and have a fighting instinct, every heard the sayiong when it comes to bull breeds, he or she may not start it but they WILL finish it?!?!?!?

Thanks for the concern. Unfortunately no, I do not have papers. He is not a full american, after viewing his parents his father was the american and his mother was an english.

By the look of it, he does not look like a pitbull. He's got to develop more, but his parents were nowhere near pitbulls.

seriously do a search on BSL and u will soon see that many staffys, staffy cross's ect are considered a pitbull TYPE dog

[Jim20186]

im hoping u got papers for ur amstaff but as hes only 7 weeks old im doubting he came from a registered breeder (which would mean no papers), the thing is with amstaffs u really need their papers so when or if the council come knocking on ur door u can prove he isnt a pitty!!! but whats done is done, ur just going to have to SUPER careful and avoid the council!!! u say u are from brissy? its really not a great place to own and unpapered amstaff, QLD is one of the worst states for BSL....i'd suggest u research BSL (breed specific legislation)

alot of his issues would stem from being taken away from his litter mates early, between 6 and 8 weeks they are learning their boundaries, litter mates and ther mum are putting them in there place at this age.

i'd suggest u keep the boys seperated when ever u arnt home, if and when they fight its going to end badly amstaffs stem from pittys and have a fighting instinct, every heard the sayiong when it comes to bull breeds, he or she may not start it but they WILL finish it?!?!?!?

Thanks for the concern. Unfortunately no, I do not have papers. He is not a full american, after viewing his parents his father was the american and his mother was an english.

By the look of it, he does not look like a pitbull. He's got to develop more, but his parents were nowhere near pitbulls.

Thanks again Sammy, but at present time my concern is not with BSL. If that were a problem then I'd look further into that down the future, but right now it's the least of my concerns as I know he is not a pitbull.

Right now, the concern is based around the pup growing up with my other boy and how they react together, as well as his current behaviour.

[Teebs]

Look into BSL NOW - Know your rights before you get a knock on the door, you could loose both dogs because they are bull breeds.

Keep the dogs apart from each other when you are not around, i would never trust two males together.

what did the breeder say when you told them what the dog was doing? What advice did they give you?

I am sure someone will come along and give you some info that may help, but until then do a search of DOL and see what you come up with. Also visit the EDBA and the BSL forums.

[Nelli]

Im not going to say anything regarding BYB or BSL as you no doubt will

find out in your own time in this forum.

Try yelping/squeling really loud - high pitched when he tries to bite you - hurting or not.

That generally how pups learns by their litter mates when they overstep the boundaries.

[Nevafollo]

im hoping u got papers for ur amstaff but as hes only 7 weeks old im doubting he came from a registered breeder (which would mean no papers), the thing is with amstaffs u really need their papers so when or if the council come knocking on ur door u can prove he isnt a pitty!!! but whats done is done, ur just going to have to SUPER careful and avoid the council!!! u say u are from brissy? its really not a great place to own and unpapered amstaff, QLD is one of the worst states for BSL....i'd suggest u research BSL (breed specific legislation)

alot of his issues would stem from being taken away from his litter mates early, between 6 and 8 weeks they are learning their boundaries, litter mates and ther mum are putting them in there place at this age.

i'd suggest u keep the boys seperated when ever u arnt home, if and when they fight its going to end badly amstaffs stem from pittys and have a fighting instinct, every heard the sayiong when it comes to bull breeds, he or she may not start it but they WILL finish it?!?!?!?

Thanks for the concern. Unfortunately no, I do not have papers. He is not a full american, after viewing his parents his father was the american and his mother was an english.

By the look of it, he does not look like a pitbull. He's got to develop more, but his parents were nowhere near pitbulls.

Thanks again Sammy, but at present time my concern is not with BSL. If that were a problem then I'd look further into that down the future, but right now it's the least of my concerns as I know he is not a pitbull.

Right now, the concern is based around the pup growing up with my other boy and how they react together, as well as his current behaviour.

well thats pretty sad, you dogs could be taken from u at ANY minute due to these laws and its not ur concern?

i get that ur after help about his behaviour, but right now u need to research BSL and see what ur in for if the council come knocking!!!

and seriously KEEP them seperate if u arnt home, or u could come home to a hurt or dead dog its a simple fact with bull breeds!!!

[Nevafollo]

in regard to the biting i'd ignore it if he does it give him a oy to do it to instead if he doesnt stop he needs a time out somewhere like a crate....

the yelping ect works for getting the to realise how hard is too hard to bite...

meh i cant help much one of the smart training types will be along soon to help

[BrunoBella]

Welcome to the forum Jim.

With a biting puppy I would either: turn your back, stand still and ignore him. As soon as he is quiet and relaxed, turn back and reward him.

or separate him from the pack when he's rowdy by using a crate/laundry - particularly as he's going after your feet which is painfull. I would leave him locked up without looking at him or talking to him. Whereever you put him should be small enough that he has no room to keep up the mischief. Let him out only when he's calm and give him a huge reward. You may need to repeat this many times the first day but they soon get the hang of it.

This has worked wonders for mine - both mine started off as Psycho Puppies and are now fantastic dogs.

You may have tried these things before - they certainly work for me.

I agree with a previous post of keeping them separated when you're not there. Also agree the puppy being taken from it's parents at less than 8 weeks old often have problems with behaviour.

I have Gsps, not Staffy's and I'm sure one of the Staffy people will be able to help you further.

Good luck and enjoy the forum

BellasPerson

[Cosmolo]

I would be looking at getting a trainer to assist you in learning how to give this pup an effective, well timed correction. I wouldn't ignore the mouthing, growling etc as you need to teach him now whats acceptable and whats not. He needs to understand that putting his mouth around a person is never acceptable.

[Kalevi]

Hey Jim,

Our new puppy is now 10 weeks and she was/is biting everyone. I did a bit of research here and found the following in terms of how to stop it:

1/ try howl, high pitch, growl, say no etc - so vocal (if that stops working, which it did for us - then try)

2/ ignore, and move away (ha - she just kept chasing us and biting along the way)

3/ hold her muzzle for 20 sec or so and say no - bad dog etc (this is working great, have only had a very few nips since using this two days ago)

4/ if she is really badly biting we also do the number 3 but roll her onto her back, hold her muzzle and dominate her as well - a little eye contact seems to work also.

Also, we've had to reestablish where we are in the pack. So no one is lying on the ground watching tv (at dogs level) until we've got this sorted.

We also praise her when she chooses toys over biting us.

These techniques combined are working really well, she now comes up mostly for licks, very cute. I'm hoping I've got my lovely little puppy back (and the satan doggie is well gone - for now, ha!)

Good luck

S.

[Paganman]

4/ if she is really badly biting we also do the number 3 but roll her onto her back, hold her muzzle and dominate her as well - a little eye contact seems to work also.

From what Ive read from all the pro trainers on this forum this isnt something thats reccomended, I think this is called an alpha roll and is a very outmoded thing to do, used to be done in the old days but thought to be very old school and dangerous now.

Im no expert but Ive been researching buying a staffy when one of my oldies passes away and Ive talked to a lot of breeders and they all said I should get a different sex to the one Ive got at home as a lot of the bull breeds can be (Please dont flame me but most breeders said this) aggressives to members of the same sex and you can get some really bad fights. Also none of them sell pups until 8 weeks so maybe you got yours a bit to young.

As I said im no expert just going by what I was told.

[Animal House]

I would not be advising anyone to Alpha roll a pup, (let alone a Bull breed) unless you are very proficient at training, and/or have had the pup assessed by a trainer and advised to do so.

Good luck Jim, but I think you (will) have these problems because the puppy was taken away too soon from his litter.

I would advise getting a qualified trainer/behaviouralist in your area to come and assess the puppy and advise you on best how to handle the situation, sooner rather than later, as they are learning very quickly at this age.

[Kalevi]

I should add that my girl spends most of her time on her back, so this is her calm place - we just do a nice quite settle after the muzzle hold and you can just see the bounce reduce in her.

Different dog, different breed, different techniques - this one is the only thing that's worked for me.

Good luck Jim!

[Erny]

Since I've brought the pup in, I have managed to get the pup used to the older dog and the older dog is slightly coming around (he isnt snapping at the pup as much as he first did)

My concerns do not lie with the older dog though ....

Mine would. Your pup is inside the "critical period". Experiences inside this period are permanent. If your older dog's reactions to the pup are appropriate (tolerance, but putting puppy in its place in an appropriate fashion) that's not a problem .... but if they are not (due to your older dog having an issue) then you have a real concern.

... I know he will come around.

Hopefully in time to not cause permanent damage (physically AND emotionally) to your pup.

...this little guy has a mind of his own. Everytime i say no, he snarls, barks and even growls at me. I know that's pretty normal, as he is trying to establish himself in the pack, but I'm a little concerned at the "growling". Especially at his age (7 weeks)

I would be concerned too. And no .... IMO, it is not normal and certainly not acceptable (as you're already aware).

I'd strongly recommend you get someone in to help you. You may be very surprised at what you can do but haven't been, and/or what you are doing but shouldn't be. Let a trainer/behaviourist observe your dogs and your relationship with them and assist you make adjustments to suit for the greater long term good. And I wouldn't be putting this off - the earlier and more immediate, the better.

Do you need any help with recommendations for trainer/behaviourists that would be able to help you in this situation?

K9 Force

Welcome to DOL Jim ..... there's lots of help to be had here and we're all interested in your progress. :D

Edited December 24, 2007 by Erny

[Dogsfevr]

4/ if she is really badly biting we also do the number 3 but roll her onto her back, hold her muzzle and dominate her as well - a little eye contact seems to work also

I should add that my girl spends most of her time on her back, so this is her calm place - we just do a nice quite settle after the muzzle hold and you can just see the bounce reduce in her."

How often do you have to do this to calm her??

Eye balling a dog will not win you any brownie points & you are lucky so far .You dont have to dominate a dog ,domination doesnt achieve any long term results or respect.

IPersonally for this person getting a male was a big mistake to start off with especially as you say your older males doe have issues..

Picking a dog that was better suited to your current dog would have been a better way to go but as the breeder isnt one who would have considered that the problem is now yours.

Your older dog was snapping at it to start with,have a pup with the same sort of attitude & it doesnt take much for it to learn,copy & then stand up for itself but if the pup is growling at a human then it time to take that series.,it isnt normal behaviour at all .

You do need to seek some sort of advice & most likely pre pare seperate runs oustide for when your not there as i wouldnt be trusting them alone

[Kalevi]

Folks - this was just my opinion and what is working for us - take it or leave it. I found this advice on this site, and can't thank those posters enough for giving out other techniques, when the standard ones for us were not working.

We've been using the holding the muzzle technique now for 3 days - I have not had any biting at all today, little mouthings occassionaly, but the big nips have totally stopped. The roll onto her back we've done about five/six times in the past three days, and only when she has been really going silly. Infact, we've not had to do this today at all, she is def getting the hang of things.

[sas]

Hey everyone. I would like some advice on my new 7 week old (American male) Staffordshire Bull Terrier.

I just recently bought him last week, and after viewing the parents I was impressed how good natured they were.

The catch is, that I have another Staffy (also male, de-sexed) who is 4 years old. He is an English. Very lovely dog, well natured, but also very territorial. He is a big sook deep down though, like most staffy's. Doesnt like to get in trouble, very highly strung but also dominant (which is a weird mix). He hates birds, possums or anything in his backyard, as it's a shame because there have been a few dead birds and possums over the years.

Since I've brought the pup in, I have managed to get the pup used to the older dog and the older dog is slightly coming around (he isnt snapping at the pup as much as he first did)

My concerns do not lie with the older dog though, I know he will come around. What concerns me is the puppy. I'm already seeing a dominant nature from him, he already runs around thinking he rules the roost and as the pack leader (myself), I've been doing all the normal things that I've done with Tyson (older dog) when he was a pup (which worked well)

Unfortunately, this little guy has a mind of his own. Everytime i say no, he snarls, barks and even growls at me. I know that's pretty normal, as he is trying to establish himself in the pack, but I'm a little concerned at the "growling". Especially at his age (7 weeks)

Not only that, he is a royal pain in the backside to tyson who is copping it without biting, or now getting aggressive back towards him. Tyson is pretty much taking everything the pup throws at him which concerns me as tyson is usually very dominant (i really don't want the pup thinking he has it over Tyson). For some reason he is taking himself off to the laundry all day (he usually doesnt sleep in there at all) and wants to seperate himself from the pup because of the annoyance.

The Pup is obsessed with biting feet (really obsessed), sometimes even drawing blood at times.

I've tried multiple methods of stopping this, from deep NO's (and believe me, I'm a big bloke with a deep voice so I can throw down a pretty intimidating NO) to coins in soda cans (that rattle loud) to rolled up news paper as a tap on the hand (I'd never hit the pup with it).

Nothing seems to work, he just has too much of a mind of his own.

Earlier today he started biting me on the feet, i quickly nudged him off and said no and for the first time I heard him growl and snarl. This worried me the most, and he has continued it since.

I work long hours, thus i wanted to bring in a little mate for Tyson so that he doesnt get too bored during the day. But I have been a little concerned with this young pup, he is already trying to dominate the pack and so far, nothing is working to show him who the leader is, and who the dominant dog is.

Feel free to give me as much advice as possible, the more the merrier as he is a cute little fella, just very naughty. This is new for me, mixing two dogs together thus the more advice the better.

Jim

Brisbane

Your puppy sounds exactly like Dante was when he was a youngster except for the growling/snarls/barks, however we had a terrible problem with puppy biting.

I really suggest you get help from a professional trainer now because this puppy could be naturally dominant and you want to get control before it realises its' strength that it's going to have when it matures.

My Older girl who is normally dominant with other dogs let Dante walk all over her, that makes it very hard if your older dog is not repremanding because it shows the puppy that when they annoy another dog/human enough that they give in.

With Dante, he was never left unsupervised with Leila, he had a dog run, it stayed like this until he qas 5.5 months old when he showed he could be trusted. At all other times he was on a lead so he did not harass my other dog and that he was close enough to me to repremand him.

Good Luck, it sounds like this wee puppy is going to challenge you.

[peaceful]

I wouldn't have gotten 2 males of a Bully breed in the first place. You could have real problems develop there and especially since the puppy was sold too young and has not has the opportunity to learn proper doggy manners from his dam and siblings.

You would have been much safer with a female puppy to put with your older male dog.

Does the breeder have a female pup you could swap with???

I know it would be hard to part with your pup now that you have probably bonded with him but it could save alot of heartbreak later on.