hortfurball Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 (edited) Sorry, long post. Little Ebony is having lots of puppy playdates. After she came home from the first few, she seemed to walk slightly differently and be unwilling to jump up onto the bed or couch and while aware of it, I put it down to her being tired. I decided to keep an eye on it to see if it wasn't just a tired pup in combination with my imagination. At yesterday's playdate, a very active day at the river with lots of running and jumping through soft sand, after about an hour and a half she just came to sit/lie with us humans so after about 15 minutes or so I decided we might as well go home. She seemed to hobble and lag a bit on the way back to the car. She did get into the car unassisted for the first time ever. She gets car sick so hates the car but must have finally clicked yesterday that it means we are going home. All evening she was walking very strangely, sort of favouring the back legs, and didn't want to go out. Normally when she hears the click of the key in the back security door, she's there, but this time, she walked a few steps and then just lay down. Needed heaps of encouragement to get her to go out for toileting. Her back end sort of rolls as she walks more than usual and she looks like she might be limping but I can't tell which leg. When she goes to get up, the front half is fine, but sometimes it takes her two attempts to get her back legs under her. She's a border collie x kelpie so should be highly active I would have thought, although she's always been reasonably sedate for that mix. I don't take her for a forced run or anything, basically she sets her own boundaries for how much she runs with the other dogs at her playdates. She's a pound pup so I have no idea of her nutrition or physical treatment up to the age of 14 weeks. I do think she has been hit but don't know to what extent. I put her on Advance Puppy Growth when I got her, with the odd bones, bit of meat and raw egg left over from baking, and various tasty tidbits for training from chicken and Schmackos through to polony. I'm in Perth, so no paralysis ticks here. This morning she's pretty much back to normal, but I'm pretty sure this is not just a tired puppy. Last night I had a little teary moment when after walking like an old arthritic dog to her bed, she was all cuddly and waggy when I went to see if she was ok. She's too sweet and doesn't deserve this on top of her bad start. Any ideas what this could be, and should I be getting her to a vet? Now that she's back to normal, will they be able to tell what's going on? Edited to change displasia to dysplasia in the title! Edited November 22, 2007 by hortfurball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Your Vet can certainly do some range of motion exercises and get an idea of the movement in the hips. Get some X-Rays done, it will ease your mind about it, if it's bad news, then you'll be able to put an action plan into place. Mel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Honestly Horty if you're that worried, I would be taking her to a vet to get checked out ;) Hopefully all will be well. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 (edited) With some high drive pups, its YOU that has to limit the off lead exercise or they will run themselves into the ground. After 1.5 hours of running and playing in soft sand, many an adult dog would be exhausted. What you saw may have simply been physical exhaustion and muscle stiffness or it could have been more serious. Rest her and look at her after that. If you still see things that concern you I'd be off to the vet. Until she's 12 months old, I'd be limiting play to small periods and resting in between. Edited November 4, 2007 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hortfurball Posted November 4, 2007 Author Share Posted November 4, 2007 Thanks for your responses. Poodlefan, I did wonder if a pup could be overexercised. Given what others have said about working dog mixes I thought she was pretty quiet as a general rule. I've heard stories of other pups that are a lot more active. My friend's lab pup of similar age (1 month older) was running with her the whole time and no such troubles for the labbie pup. I hope that's all it is, but I may ask the vet just to make certain. I think maybe I just got all over-emotional last night because I was thinking how unfair it would be for her if she had some physical issue on top of a questionable start to life. Was also wondering if poor nutrition may have played a part but might be self-fixing now she's on decent food. But I've had her 2 1/2 months so would have thought it would have been fixed by now if that was the case. I don't really know much about the effects of poor nutrition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Good food will help with thickening up the bones etc. but what is there - is there - genetically. Poodlefan's completely correct though, I always do the 2 x 20min exercise per day rule with my pups. ;) If she is totally over the top then it's time for training, training games and thinking toys like stuffed kongs, buster cube/treat ball, dig pits etc. Mel. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tapferhund Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Better to be safe than sorry IMO so a trip to the Vet would be the best thing to do. If her back end is 'rolling' it sounds as if it could be her hips. The other thing too.....I would be taking her off the puppy "growth" food as these foods are sometimes too high in protien causing growth to be to rapid which also can cause bone and joint problems. A good quality adult dry food is ok for pups over three to four months of age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hortfurball Posted November 4, 2007 Author Share Posted November 4, 2007 It's only an issue after her puppy playdates. At home she tends to play for a bit then rest. In fact she mostly rests. That's what I mean, she's surprisingly quiet. She's sleeping at the moment. She has lots of toys - rubber bouncy ones, ones that squeak, tug ropes to play tug with Ella and for some reason has taken to a piece of stretch velvet that she drags around and drapes over herself. We do obedience classes once a week and practice a bit at home for brain training. I will limit her activity at future playdates though, seeing as a few of you think that is an issue. Catch her after 20-30 mins and leash her for the rest of the time, or go home early. She just seemed to be having such a good time I was enjoying watching her and didn't think about that side of things. When Kuges was a pup it was different because being a large breed I knew he shouldn't be overexercised. Didn't realise it applied to small active types, silly me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hortfurball Posted November 4, 2007 Author Share Posted November 4, 2007 Better to be safe than sorry IMO so a trip to the Vet would be the best thing to do. If her back end is 'rolling' it sounds as if it could be her hips. The other thing too.....I would be taking her off the puppy "growth" food as these foods are sometimes too high in protien causing growth to be to rapid which also can cause bone and joint problems. A good quality adult dry food is ok for pups over three to four months of age. Ah, thanks, I was wondering about that. In the dane thread they often talk about too much protein. We're nearly at the end of the bag of puppy food, so I'll start mixing now for the gradual changeover. It does say on the pack up to 12 months of age but I thought I'd get a second opinion here which is why I mentioned it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlemum Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Definitely agree about the "growth" food and vigorous prolonged exercise - puppies don't realise they have limits - even when older they can run themselves ragged & be stiff & sore the next day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Rules Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 It's only an issue after her puppy playdates. I think you just answered your own question there :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 It's only an issue after her puppy playdates. I've had a few dogs like this, all diagnosed with HD.... please get her checked out... hope it's nothing serious :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poodle wrangler Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 .........Last night I had a little teary moment when after walking like an old arthritic dog to her bed, she was all cuddly and waggy when I went to see if she was ok. She's too sweet and doesn't deserve this on top of her bad start.............................. I know how you feel. Our young standard poodle (avatar) had luxating patellas about a month ago. Dislocating kneecaps. Must have been painful. Had me in tears, too :rolleyes:. I wondered about his hips, also. I took him to the vet. I was dithering but a poodle person encouraged me to get him checked out as he's so young and (hopefully) has a long life ahead of him. No treatment for now. XRays were OK. I don't take him for long walks (never have as you must not overexercise large breeds). I've not seen him dislocate for at least a fortnight. I agree with a lower protein food and limit exercise for your dog. What you describe does not sound normal. I'd take him to the vet for your peace of mind. It's clearly related to play dates- do they do zoomies, with lots of changes of direction etc.? This would be hard on joints and ligaments. My vet told me to limit this kind of play for my dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjosa Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 With her being over excersised and all the running and jumping around at her playdates, she could have put her back out as well, this can cause an unusual movement, I would definitely have a trip to the vet and Xrays done on back and hips. I agree with other posters puppy kibble too much protein, get her onto a quality adult kibble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hortfurball Posted November 4, 2007 Author Share Posted November 4, 2007 Poodle wrangler, Yes she does zoomies...even more so yesterday because they all got wet in the river! It's definitely not luxating patellas - I'd recognise that because Kuges has had both back knees operated on for it. Sorry to hear about your young one, has your vet indicated he'll need an op in the future? I've already started the changeover to adult biccies, will limit her free time on playdates, and will be taking her to the vet to make sure it is nothing more serious than a tired stiff pup. Fingers crossed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diva Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 hortfurball Happy to hear you are taking her to the vet, it does sound a bit like she could have a lower back injury. Perhaps just gently test if she can stretch her back legs out properly or has any sore to touch spots on her back. Pups don't usually have the sense not to 'zoom' just 'cause it hurts, they compensate with other muscles then pay for it later. Will be interested the hear the diagnosis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonymc Posted November 4, 2007 Share Posted November 4, 2007 Good advice from Poodlefan. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hortfurball Posted November 9, 2007 Author Share Posted November 9, 2007 She's at the vet being desexed. I got a call - they had a look at her hips, rear legs and lower back at my request and said it feels like she has 'loose hips' (ie the ball is a little free in the socket) and are doing x-rays to get an idea of exactly what's going on. It may be something that will fix itself in time (hopefully) as she still has some growing to do, or it may be more serious. Will let you know when I know. Either way, limited exercise from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Fingers crossed here for a good result HFB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loraine Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Hortie I do hope young Ebony does not have a serious problem, finger and toes and paws crossed for you both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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