Title Changed, Molly The Labrador's Thread.

[persephone]

if she growls walk away.

hi...

dumb question..

wouldn't walking away when the pup growls send her the message that her growling is having the desired effect? She growls, and is then left in peace?

[littlelabrador]

i do think its hunger related. The meal she is most likely to growl with is breakfast. Doesn't happen much at lunch, does happen at dinner. Yes, im still feeding her a lunch meal as i think hunger is part of the problem. She has a kong, which i fill with puppy kibble, and she loves that game, and i can take it off her without any growling. Also, if one of us drops food on the floor, and she gets to it first, i can take that off her too, no problem.

she is fed in the laundry, no distractions, no kids, no cats, etc, has been from the start. I stand in there talking to her and telling her she's a good girl etc. always have.

[4leggedvariety]

I don't think walking away if Molly growls at you is a good idea. If you think it is an association with the food bowl, why don't you try this.

Have all the kibble or whatever you are going to feed her with in your hand. Place her empty bowl on the floor right next to your feet. Have her sitting facing you. All food belongs to you. Let her wait for your 'OK' or whatever command you want to use, and then toss a few kibble into the bowl and she can then eat from the bowl. After that, repeat the sit and then repeat the whole process until all the food is gone. Stand there while she is eating but say nothing.

This way, she is waiting for your permission to eat, your presence near the bowl means more food could be on its way, and you are also practising the sit. Does this make sense at all?

[littlelabrador]

ok, yep, i could try that.

another question. WHY oh WHY, do they eat their own poo ???? !!!! it is disgusting.

[Poodle wrangler]

Eating own poo? No idea? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coprophagia

My pup's breeder fed all pups from the one bowl and believed it taught them good manners. She'd discipline any bad behaviour if the dam didn't.

Labs will always think they're starving- they still shouldn't be growling at you.

Have you tried Trinagle of Temptation yet?

[4leggedvariety]

Would you believe it, is quite common. It sounds like my previous lab have been reincarnated in Molly, except mine did not growl with food, but she did all the other things you have mentioned. No one really knows why they do it, I have known both male & female adults & puppies do it. I tried tobasco over the poo, she just licked off the tobasco and then help herself to it.

Mine started off eating just her own , then up the ante to eating other dogs' poo as well. So much fun taking her to dog parks. I have exhausted all options, & at the end, i just followed her around in the dog park and startle her everytime I see her taking a gulp at it. At home, I watch her do poos and pick them up immediately afterwards, otherwise, she turns around and starts eating it. Talk about automatic poo cleaning machine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

She can be choosy though, I have examined the ones she liked & is usually the big bulky ones that may be by-products of canned dog food. Don't know.

Do not have the same problems now. Had 7 dogs since then, none of them does it.

[Tehanfamily]

Hi all, I'm new here and i have a lab puppy of 10 weeks.. got him from a great breeder who really takes good care of him and very happy with him.. He has all the "good" points that all of you mentioned .. Biting, chewing everything his mouth can get on, jumping on you, chasing the kids, attacking his bed.. but he has no problem letting us touch him or the food when he's eating.. i moved it around while he is eating and he just either wait or follow his bowl.. i had 2 silkies when i was in singapore and after i moved here, wanted to bring them over so badly but it's too expensive so i have to leave them with my family whom i know can trust. I did the same to them, let them not have the habit of being possessive over their items.. (my aunt's dog was like that and it will bite anybody who just walked by the bowl)..

What i did with my lab when he tried to play rough and bit my hand.. i will apply abit of medicated oil (safe to use) or abit of tabaco sauce on my hand and do it a few times and he stopped for a few days tho.. haha.. Would like to check, do the dogs snore? My lab snores most of his naps and especially at night, he will start his dreams and move around when he sleeps, isit normal? My friend used to tell me that its because he played too much during the days.. is that true? I have not bring him to any training yet but wil do it soon as he can be abit too playful.. bit my kids a couple of times but because they play rough with him..

Anyone can share a few recipes with me on what i can give to the puppy? his meals consists of pasta, rice or dry food with carrot or cabbage, mince beef or pork (boiled), for lunch and dinner and Toast or cereal (with water instead of milk) for breakfast.. any other good suggestion? Really appreciate it.

[littlelabrador]

Well i havent had a chance yet to do the TOT, haven't been able to get any rope. So, i have tried the bit of food at a time into the bowl. Did it at lunchtime and dinner tonight, and no growling ! I make her sit first, give a handful, she tries to go for it, but i say uh uh, then 'go' and she does, then she automatically sits again. quite funny to see. Only took the lunchtime meal for her to learn she had to sit to get more. I patted her during it and she just wagged her tail more. Hope thats a good sign.-

Tehan family, i dont know, but im sure the others will advise you on the puppy's diet. I dont think the toast and cereal are good things. I dont think cereal and water for breakfast would have anywhere near the amount of nutrition the puppy needs in the right proportions, probably too much sugar, not enough protein etc. And cabbage ? wont that give him/her gas ??

[4leggedvariety]

Well Done little lab. If she is not growling, may be keep at it for the time being and may be hubby can do the dinner the same way. Provided all goes well, increase the amount of food you toss into the bowl each day so she spends more time eating from the bowl with you standing next to her. try not to change other variables yet eg. moving bowl around or sticking your hand in there.

Sounds like little Molly is a real smart cookie. Is her body language relaxed when you are standing there while she is eating? Or does she sort of eats & at the same time glance at you? You said you patted her during'it'. Do you mean while she is sitting or while she is eating?

I hope you are enjoying Molly more. Have you had a chance to contact K9 Force yet?

[persephone]

Well Done, littlelabrador

good progress!

I just use a leash for TOT..not a rope

[littlelabrador]

Again this morning, same thing, no growling. Think i will stick with this and see how she goes. Poor puppy, just keeps sitting and looking at me for more, lol. I was patting her both times, when she sat, i said 'good girl' and patted, and when she ate. Didnt growl either time. When she is eating i guess she is relaxed. She's not looking at me, shes eating, gorging should i say, and tail wagging. Then sits and waits for more. Looks at the empty bowl, looks at me expectantly.

Our only issue today, is that i started adding optimum back in with the hills food to try to switch her over. First day i added just a tablespoon, yesterday 1/4cup with 3/4 cup hills, and darn it, shes done 8-10 poos in the last 24 hours. So now i guess thats supercoat and optimum that are no-goes. Guess we are going to have to use a more expensive one, cant really afford to but looks like i will have to find the $$. Putting her back on straight hills prescription, with chicken/rice again.

omg, a leash, der. of course. silly me. ok. Ours isnt long though, probably only 120cm, so will have to get a longer one. We will use a longer one when shes older anyway.

No havent contacted K9 yet. As it would take a while to get in, i will keep going with everything we are doing so far, and wait till after christmas and see if we still need it. She has settled down. Even at night, we only had 2 jump ups, and one bark, then she stopped after being disciplined. She got swiped again by the cat, and last night when the cat came in, Molly came and sat on my feet and wouldnt budge, poor baby must have been a bit scared of the cat !

[Monah]

YAY!!!! sounds good! Gotta love the cat. They are great teachers!! Not a bad thing for her to be wary of the cat. You are doing so well, congratulations. Just want to say we did TOT too and it does really work on many levels with behaviour etc. Well worth the effort.xxxxxxxxxxxxkeep it up.Also, my friend has a dane with stomach probs a bit like yours. She tried other stuff but had to have the expensive food all the time and is fine. Experimenting wasn't worth it because every time the dog went downhill. If there is something that the dog can handle, I'd be inclined to stick with it. She uses hills too.

[Poodle wrangler]

Sounds better. You can do TOT with just a leash in the beginning.

Keep being consistent and I'm sure you'll see results.

It's similar to kids- the consistency is important, otherwise they just keep testing the limits all the time.

[littlelabrador]

I spoke to the vet nurse this morning about the diet. Obviously we are tossing out the optimum, seems like such a waste of money. Oh, would they take it at a shelter or something, or do they use specific brands ? its optimum puppy and its almost a full (small) bag.

Vet nurse recommended either the eukanbuba low residue puppy, or stick within the hills. So, i researched online, and the only common ingredient i can find in the supercoat and in the optimum is Sorghum. Sorghum is also in Iams, and in Eukanuba regular puppy food, so in that regard, i have decided to stick within the hills science diet brand, and i have bought a bag of the science diet large breed puppy. Will see what happens. Hopefully as she is on the science diet prescription she will transfer across okay. I didnt really want to go changing brands too.

Did the same feed technique at lunchtime, make her sit, a bit in her bowl, make her wait, then let her eat, pat etc. No growls again. I hope this will continue. Shes done a bit of jumping today, nothing much, gets down when told off, but its been raining for days here and i think shes a bit housebound. Not a lot they can really do inside to keep active is there?

[Ahona]

It sounds like she's doing very well indeed Littlelabrador ;)

Lab puppies are always very bouncy and rather jumpy, but that's why we love them so much too! Keep going with what you're doing and I'm sure she will learn what she's allowed to do and what not very soon indeed!

[littlelabrador]

Yeah, she is very lovable. I love how excited she is first thing in the morning, its like she hasnt seen us for a month rather than just six or so hours ;)

ah, i was going to post an updated pic, but camera battery is flat ! will try tomorrow.

[Joan of Arc]

littlelabrador

I have sent you a PM.

[littlelabrador]

here's an updated pic of our baby ! She really is a gorgeous thing, despite the problems of the last week (which are improving by the day)

[4leggedvariety]

She is gorgeous, littlelab. I like the 'big star' tag, she deserves (and you as well) a star.

With the food thing, if she is still going well tomorrow, you may want to vary it a little. Instead of having the empty bowl on the ground, sometimes hold the empty bowl in your hand at her eye level. She still has to sit, see you toss the food into the bowl, wait for your permission and let her eat with you holding bowl. Don't say too much and don't move the bowl. The idea is to teach her humans holding food bowl while she is eating is NOT a threat. You are still continuing making her earn for food by complying with your wishes first and you decide when shw can have it.

Have you considered trying the BARF diet? Raw diet, nothing artificial, no preservatives, nothing is processed.

[4leggedvariety]

OH, forgot, one more thing. When the food bowl is on the ground, just try walking a few steps backwards & forwards and see what happens? May be interesting?