What Are The Choices With Desexing?

[Ellis]

Okay I am after advice. I have read a few posts regarding desexing & people have mentioned tube tying & other things.

We don't want Lexi to have pups but we want her to grow to her full potential which I am under the understanding that if she is desexed before being fully grown this won't happen. (did that make sense?)

I really don't want to deal with a dog on heat & the risk of falling pregnant. So is there any other options than desexing? I just thought desexing was like a hysterectomy? But I think I read in another thread that it was more than a hysterectomy.

Just a bit confused. She is due to be registered at council in less than a month & of course that will be cheaper if she is desexed.

Thanks

Beth

[morgan]

Just tying tubes is useless IMO as you still get the mess, dogs being attracted and the risk of pyo.

If you search around you might be able to find a vet who is willing to do a hysterectomy while leaving a single ovary. There is also a new op being developed where some ovarian tissue is spliced under the skin after desexing is performed to allow a small amount of hormone to be developed. I haven't looked into this and know nothing of whether or not it is viable, but the vet researchers seem to think it is worth pursuing. If you can get this done you should be able to get a desexing certificate, as the bitch is incapable of having a litter, even though she is not technically desexed.

At least with these options there is no bleeding or smell and no pyo or possibility of puppies. With only one ovary you will have less hormonal behaviour to deal with and much less chance of dogs being attracted through changes in pheromones. This operation, if youcan find someone to do it, will entail more time under anaesthetic and higher costs, but less chance of spay incontinence, which is not cheap to manage.

Haven't seen any research in dogs, but with women who have a hysterectomy the blood supply to the ovaries is compromised, leading to earlier menopause in most instances, usually within 5 years. If this same thing happened to dogs there would be a gradual lessening of oestrogen being made which would reduce the risk of mammary cancer over time. Bear in mind that only about 30% of mammary cancers in dogs are malignant, the rest are not fatal.

No matter which way you go there are drawbacks and problems, just like women trying to manage their own fertility have issues to deal with no matter which option they go for. So you have to work out which risks and adverse effects you feel are most acceptable to you.

[sandgrubber]

Have I missed something? With people, I thought the work hysterectomy meant both a total (I think there's a latin name too, and ovo-something hysterectomy), in which the ovaries and uterus are removed, and a partial, in which just the uterus is removed. (I, personally, had a total a decade back.) I though a spay was the equivalent of a total hysterectomy. Are people using hysterectomy to mean what I would call a partial hysterectomy?

[Mystiqview]

Morgan,

It is not THE solution, but an option. If you want your puppy to grow to maturity before desexing her, there is the pill. It has been a very very long time since I had used it. I think it is better now. I think you have to start smack bang on day one of bleed and then go. Really talk to the vet as I know they are better than they used to be.

Manangement: If you follow the directions on the pill from the vet, your bitch should not fall pregnant. For bitches on heat here while in the house I generally buy those pull up nappies, cut a hole in the rear for the tail. This allows my bitches to come into the house and not leave spots everywhere. There are professionally made btich's pants, but found the pull up nappies if you can get a size to fit your dog, is cheaper.

If worse comes to wose there is an accidental mating, there is a abortion drug called Allezin. It is two injections 24 hours apart. I had to use it once for an accidental mating. Cost about $180 for the two injections. It is safe to give up to 45 days into pregnancy. I gave it to my bitch around day 35. My dog got to her late on day 20, given the lines it would have been very bad luck if she fell pregnant.. I was unlucky.. She was.

[MolassesLass]

Hysterectomy = uterus removal, leave ovaries

ovario hysterectomy = spay = uterus + ovary removal

[Mystiqview]

Sandgrubber,

I had to have a hysterectomy at 30. They leave the ovaries if they can for hormonal issues. IF they took the ovaries, I would have had to go onto hormanal tablets then rather than the normal time when menopause occurs.

[Kadbury]

Hi there - Morgan I was always of the opinion that the word Cancer meant Malignant - Therefore Mamory Cancer is always Malignant ....please enlighten me if I have been on the wrong road with this term.....cheers

[gareth]

Sandgrubber,

I had to have a hysterectomy at 30. They leave the ovaries if they can for hormonal issues. IF they took the ovaries, I would have had to go onto hormanal tablets then rather than the normal time when menopause occurs.

I wonder why can't dogs go on hormone tablets to allow proper development after desexing.?

[tramissa]

Kadbury, I think she meant mammary tumours, not cancers Only a small percentage of tumours are cancerous. That's my interpretation anyway

[Dog_Horse_Girl]

Racing greyhound bitches are given testosterone injections while racing to stop their heat cycle. I have no idea of the long-term affects of such a therapy and I simply hope that Lilly has no consequences as a result of being given male hormones during her racing and training life.

I would always choose to spey a bitch as early as feasible. That's my personal preference due to the management of a bitch in season - others have no issues with not allowing their animal/s off their property when in season; cleaning up the mess during the bleeding phase; dealing with the behavioural and temperament changes that many bitches exhibit when in season...never mind the risks of escape (your bitch) or intrusion (entire males getting onto your property) as she searches for a mate and males try to get to her.

Spey incontinence is generally caused due to the removal of the ovaries (which means the female hormones are no longer produced) and this is cheaply and easily rectified by hormone replacement (tablets) that cost a few dollars a year in real terms, and it's certainly much less than any other regular medication such as heartworm preventives or flea control.

[morgan]

Kadbury, I think she meant mammary tumours, not cancers Only a small percentage of tumours are cancerous. That's my interpretation anyway

Thanks, that's what I meant to say - trying to do too many things at once and not concentrating on anything properly

[morgan]

Spey incontinence is generally caused due to the removal of the ovaries (which means the female hormones are no longer produced) and this is cheaply and easily rectified by hormone replacement (tablets) that cost a few dollars a year in real terms, and it's certainly much less than any other regular medication such as heartworm preventives or flea control.

Actually, it is not always treated so cheaply or easily - some bitches don't respond to artificial hormones or other drugs, others require expensive tests etc and some simply remain incontinent no matter what and end up having to live permanently outside. Some owners can't cope with it and end up putting the dog to sleep. Before you rush in and say that this is heartless, picture an elderly person in a carpeted flat who simply cannot manage the problem and doesn't want to dump the poor animal in the pound, knowing it's chances of being rehomed are minimal - euthanasia could appear to be the kindest alternative.

[Poodle wrangler]

..........We don't want Lexi to have pups but we want her to grow to her full potential which I am under the understanding that if she is desexed before being fully grown this won't happen. (did that make sense?)

One of the reasons I choose males is due to the desexing being less complicated.

I thought that dogs desexed well before their bones have stopped growing ended up slightly taller .

Unless I planned to do agility or flyball with my dog when they were older (hard on joints), I would go ahead and desex at about 6 months.

It's about $100 extra to desex later than 6 months with my local council. I enquired about desexing later and you still have to pay the higher fee.

[Ellis]

..........We don't want Lexi to have pups but we want her to grow to her full potential which I am under the understanding that if she is desexed before being fully grown this won't happen. (did that make sense?)

One of the reasons I choose males is due to the desexing being less complicated.

I thought that dogs desexed well before their bones have stopped growing ended up slightly taller .

Unless I planned to do agility or flyball with my dog when they were older (hard on joints), I would go ahead and desex at about 6 months.

It's about $100 extra to desex later than 6 months with my local council. I enquired about desexing later and you still have to pay the higher fee.

Yes I have never had a female dog before. I was under the impression that if we had her desexed early she would stop growing?

Wasn't planning on doing agility but in the few weeks of doing obedience there has been several comments made to me by the instructors that they thought she would be good at agility.

Just looking into this as I had my male Ragdoll Cat desexed by 6mths & he is about half the size of his full potential. The reason I got a male is because I wanted a big cat.

Thanks for all the replies. I will be ringing some vets in the morning.

[Kadbury]

Thanks for that, I had an 8 year old rescue with a mammary lump (Size of two grains of rice) over the following 5 years it grew slowly and I was advised by my Vet not to put her through any type of surgery....she lived a very spoilt life....and when the time came My Vet cried with me knowing what she was like when I got her and the life she had with me. I know this is OT but thanks again.....cheers

[alanglen]

Talk to your vet and unless you want to show her, book in for desexing. all of the other drugs mentioned above have csary side effects and bone marrow suppression etc is simply not worth it. Consider her health before her looks.

PS the changes in growth plate closure are only for early age desexing, so under 8-12 weeks (depending on breed).

Several of the top agility dogs here in Victoria were desexed early and almost all in teh top levels are desexed.

[morgan]

PS the changes in growth plate closure are only for early age desexing, so under 8-12 weeks (depending on breed).

This is not the only skeletal change created by stopping hormones before growth is almost complete, as chest and head development is affected too, depending on breed.

In my breed, even desexing at 6 mths has created taller, narrow chested dogs with insufficient lung room - resulting in problems separate to increased cruciate ligament ruptures.

[centitout]

PS the changes in growth plate closure are only for early age desexing, so under 8-12 weeks (depending on breed).

This is not the only skeletal change created by stopping hormones before growth is almost complete, as chest and head development is affected too, depending on breed.

In my breed, even desexing at 6 mths has created taller, narrow chested dogs with insufficient lung room - resulting in problems separate to increased cruciate ligament ruptures.

couldnt this be due to the breeding itself and the particular dogs.in my breed there is 2 very different types-the big,solid,heavy boned type and a smaller,narrower head,deeper keel type dog that moves nicer but is still alot ligher than the breed standard.i used a lighter stud over my very heavy bitch and 1/2 the pups have the sires build,1/2 have the dams.no amount of testosterone,oestrogen is going to make their heads /chests look like the other 1/2 of the litter.i am just about to start back at my vets part time,so i will look into the possibility of leaving an ovary in if desexed etc,but for the males i still want full desexing as most new owners simply cant deal with a horny young bloodhound.

[Ellis]

Rang the vets this morning & I mentioned about leaving an ovary & she said she would talk to the vet & get back to me.

She is almost as tall as her mum but no where near as broad, vet nurse said that with girls the desexing won't affect the growth as it would with a boy.

So waiting to talk to vet now.

[BenjiMom]

Then why do some malamute breeders desex their dogs before sale?? Mals are huge when fully grown. As im buying one next year, i sure wont be buying a desexed pup.