pie Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Okay, let me set the scene: Kyzer is a 7.5 month old Tenterfield Terrier. He is a small dog, about 5kgs currently. Over the last month or two we have had issues with him being picked up. I try my very best to treat Kyzer like a dog, he doesn't get carried around, he has his own legs to walk on. Pretty much every day he gets picked up at one stage or another, usually picked up on to my lap for a pat, sometime picked up for a pat while I'm standing. Anyway, the issues we are having is quite often when people including OH & I pick him up, he growls. Once he is up, he is usually okay. When he growls we don't put him down, we continue to hold him until he is quiet, and then we let him jump off if he wants. We quite often have people over every weekend. People are allowed to call him onto their lap for a pat if they want, which he had no problems with, he will be straight up there wanting a pat, but if people put their hands on him and try to move him he growls. He knows a get down command, but sometimes people don't realise this and just pick him up to put him back down on the floor and he gets grumpy, likewise if they are picking him up to put on there lap. Sometimes he gets in such a state that he snarls, usually when there is over six or so people around, I have started crating him as soon as this happens, so that he has a bit of timeout and can feel safe, he never removes himself, he always wants to hang around no matter how grumpy he is. Now Kyzer is VERY vocal, if he is playing with toys he is very noisy and very growly, I have never known him to play with a toy in silence :rolleyes: So I have explained this issue to two obedience instructors, and both gave me very different views: Trainer one, owns BC's, Dalmatians and a Pap: Suggested that I get people, including myself, to go up to Kyzer, and put their hands on him, and under him, lifting his back or front legs off the ground, while feeding him treats. continue this and then start to pick him up and give him treats. Trainer Two, owns a Malamute, used to own GR's: Basically gave me a talking to telling me that no person ever has the right to pick up my dog, why should he get picked up, I should not do anything differently. I get what the second trainer is saying, but I don't really feel that I want to leave this unchecked to develop into something more. I don't want to risk someone, perhaps a child, picking up Kyzer and him biting them. Sure, no one has the right to pick him up but in reality he is a small dog, people will pick him up. Every meal he has to wait and he watches me, not the food, until he gets the okay to eat, I ignore him for 5 minutes or so when I get home, I don't think he has displayed any signs of challenging pack order but I am trying to prevent it happening. So I would just like to hear opinions on this - what am I doing wrong? Let me know if I have missed anything. Sorry for my long long post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 First off.. has he been vet -checked? Could he have sore ribs/back/belly? Was he an only pup or anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pie Posted October 24, 2007 Author Share Posted October 24, 2007 There were two litters on the ground at the time, 8+ pups between them. I don't think it is soreness - he doesn't do it every time, just sometimes. Maybe 40% of time (with us). Hasn't been to the vet since desexing (early Sep) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kateykateykatey Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 (edited) I understand what the second trainer is saying, but I tend to think (owning a similar sized dog ) that picking up and handling the way I imagine he's getting handled is unavoidable. As you said, it may simply be a small child, or even adults doing it, and although in theory they shouldn't, it's not inconceivable that they might try. Furthermore, he may need to be handled in situations like vet visits, etc... so I'd go with what the first trainer says. ...Not that I have any behaviourist education etc, so my advice may well be wrong... just that I now know what it's like to own a small dog that everyone wants to touch. ETA some more words. Edited October 24, 2007 by kateykateykatey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavNrott Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Maybe it depends on how he is being picked up. It may be hurting him. Wondering why your two trainers didn't mention this. I certainly wouldn't let visitors pick up my dog. Most people have no idea how to pick up a dog the correct way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pie Posted October 24, 2007 Author Share Posted October 24, 2007 I try to be careful to pick him up with a palm under his chest and a hand under his back legs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kateykateykatey Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 Oh! Is it that other people are putting their hands around his middle? I vaguely recall picking Lil up and her...not yelping...but being unhappy about how I picked her up. I wasnt deliberately rough or heavy handed, but likely had poor technique. Could this be an issue? I'm really guessing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mushaka Posted October 24, 2007 Share Posted October 24, 2007 I would go with trainer one as well. My mums Maltese does this,..SOMETIMES growls.. and then even yelps. Shes old,and its from her sore joints. I would have a vet check your dog over ..to be sure to be sure!! Then carry on with Trainer ones suggestions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pie Posted October 26, 2007 Author Share Posted October 26, 2007 Just thought I would post and let you know how this is progressing... I had always made Kyzer sit and wait for his dinner, watch me, etc, but this last week I have been making a point to ignore him when I get home from work. Just for 5 minutes or so, until he loses interst in me beong there and wanders off, then I call him to me and say hello. It has made a huge difference in him, he is nowhere near as growly, and is much more affectionate. I thought I had pack order in check but obviously I didn't. Thanks for all the suggestions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mushaka Posted October 26, 2007 Share Posted October 26, 2007 good to hear!!! excellent effort amypie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kateykateykatey Posted October 26, 2007 Share Posted October 26, 2007 Just thought I would post and let you know how this is progressing...I had always made Kyzer sit and wait for his dinner, watch me, etc, but this last week I have been making a point to ignore him when I get home from work. Just for 5 minutes or so, until he loses interst in me beong there and wanders off, then I call him to me and say hello. It has made a huge difference in him, he is nowhere near as growly, and is much more affectionate. I thought I had pack order in check but obviously I didn't. Thanks for all the suggestions That's fantastic, amypie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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