4leggedvariety Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 Has anyone read Cesar's new book ' Be the pack Leader'? Damn good reading Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heidley Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 I'll have to keep and eye out for it next time I'm at the bookshop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tiggy Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 Cool! I'll have to get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jesomil Posted October 15, 2007 Share Posted October 15, 2007 Is it available in Australia yet? I was going to buy it off Amazon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReXy Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 i had heard about it.. will look into getting it shortly, love cesar.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelpie-i Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 Jesomil, you're probably better off buying it from Amazon as it will probably end up being cheaper than ordering it through Angus & Robertson or other book store. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonymc Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 I must get myself a copy. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4leggedvariety Posted October 17, 2007 Author Share Posted October 17, 2007 Jesomil, I am the one that said you can get it from Amazon. Finished reading it already, just can't agree more with his philosophies. This man understands dogs, quite unlike a lot of positive trainers who trains dogs like they train a laboratory rat. First establish leaderhip than teach them the meaning of 'commands' with positive techniques, exactly like what John Fisher ( England) said years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purpley Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 I just ordered my copy - I can't wait to get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jesomil Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Cant wait to read it but i am still trying to work out Amazon . I have never bought from overseas and am not very computer savvy so will find someone to help me and then i will get it!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusky Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 If you are up for a bit of reading then look at this article by Jean Donaldson http://www.urbandawgs.com/divided_profession.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShellyBeggs Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 Thanks Rusky, great read! Must say I disagreed with most of it......some of it I agree with but most of it being a load of codswallop! I have never seen Ceasar Millan do anything abusive to a dog yet......he wouldn't be on air if any of the humane or animal protection groups thought he was abusive....they have a big pull over in the US. Alot of his training wouldn't suit a lot of dogs, some of it is quite confrontational and extreme....made for TV you might say.....a definite don't try this at home..........but most of it seems more like common sense and this is what most people I have spoken to about it, get from the show -the common sense bit. Everyone has their own way of training animals.....no way is 100% right and no way is 100% wrong... People need to exercise their own "fit for purpose" radar (in this case a TV show) and stop building the soap box higher and higher (like some people on that website) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusky Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 you read all of it? including all the link articles? you read educated expert opinions and disagreed with most of what they said? ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jesomil Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 I think anyone with a theory about dog training is very game to tell the world about it because they will always get hammered by a whole lot of people. No one will ever agree on dog training and behaviour as there are so many methods and people generally only speak from their own experiences. I think alot of that article has been dramatised. They are basically saying that anyone who is not purely positive uses violent practises it also mentions aversive, abusive practises. It sounds like some extremely positive people who are very anti anything negative. I respect their methods of training but not the way they slam anyone who chooses another method. Cesars tv shows are generally dealing with extreme cases. But the underlying message on how we should deal with our dogs on a daily basis is great IMO. What he has to say is not new. I have been treating my dogs like this for years and there are tonnes of great trainers out there that do the same. There is no abuse. It just leads to a harmonious life with your beloved dog because everyone knows their place and the dogs have boundaries. By the way, i certainly dont agree with everything Cesar does and some things he does makes me cringe but the underlying message is what i agree with. I think if more people handled their dogs with calm assertivness and were good, respectworthy pack leaders, it would help alot of probs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShellyBeggs Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 I think anyone with a theory about dog training is very game to tell the world about it because they will always get hammered by a whole lot of people. No one will ever agree on dog training and behaviour as there are so many methods and people generally only speak from their own experiences.I think alot of that article has been dramatised. They are basically saying that anyone who is not purely positive uses violent practises it also mentions aversive, abusive practises. It sounds like some extremely positive people who are very anti anything negative. I respect their methods of training but not the way they slam anyone who chooses another method. Cesars tv shows are generally dealing with extreme cases. But the underlying message on how we should deal with our dogs on a daily basis is great IMO. What he has to say is not new. I have been treating my dogs like this for years and there are tonnes of great trainers out there that do the same. There is no abuse. It just leads to a harmonious life with your beloved dog because everyone knows their place and the dogs have boundaries. By the way, i certainly dont agree with everything Cesar does and some things he does makes me cringe but the underlying message is what i agree with. I think if more people handled their dogs with calm assertivness and were good, respectworthy pack leaders, it would help alot of probs. AS ABOVE!!!! Thanks mate, you took what I was going to reply and just said it so much better!!!! You are a legend! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4leggedvariety Posted October 18, 2007 Author Share Posted October 18, 2007 Good on you Jesomil, very well said. If more people could be more assertive with their dogs without being aggressive or abusive or permissive, then we will see less behavioural problems that we have to end up fixing. I have found the trend towards positive training has gone too far, it has turned into permissiveness. Confident projection and an aura of assertiveness and quietness is what dogs respect. So call animal behavourists concentrate too much on learning theories and tend to ignore what I call 'inner strength'. If you show fear to a dog, it will bite you. What you project to the dog is important. not just positive or negative reinforcements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 So call animal behavourists concentrate too much on learning theories and tend to ignore what I call 'inner strength'. But with many people it's not an easy matter of simply telling them to find "inner strength". You need to give them things to do which has the potential to eventually evolve into the "inner strength" you speak of. And the things you get them to do need to be able to produce improved behaviour in their dog. This in itself can lead to a development of confidence that they CAN do it and is often the beginning of a much happier relationship with their dogs from the perspective of both dog and owner. Otherwise, 4LV, a well written post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lablover Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 Good on you Jesomil, very well said. If more people could be more assertive with their dogs without being aggressive or abusive or permissive, then we will see less behavioural problems that we have to end up fixing. I have found the trend towards positive training has gone too far, it has turned into permissiveness. Confident projection and an aura of assertiveness and quietness is what dogs respect. So call animal behavourists concentrate too much on learning theories and tend to ignore what I call 'inner strength'. If you show fear to a dog, it will bite you. What you project to the dog is important. not just positive or negative reinforcements. LOL.....SOME so called behaviour experts. How many times have we been told, treat the dog like a dog. DO NOT NAG. Act fairly, consistently with good timing. Dogs do what works for them. Hey, just like us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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