Crate Training My Staffy

[Barts]

hello all,

Well after years of trying my wife is finally letting me get a dog. After she secretly got herself a cat 3 years ago knowing full well i'm allergic she really had no feet to stand on. So i've moved back to my hometown of Broken Hill after living in sydney for the past 7 years.

I had to get a Staffy, I love the breed. I've been around alot of animals and breeds of dogs and staffy is the one for me. Now i personnally have never own a Staffy so i've been researching everything i can find about the breed, even so that my wife is very excited to get out budle of joy.

I have one question, Growing up all our dogs were outside dogs which i agreed with (also members of my family are bushies and have working dogs aswell as pet dogs), but over the years with having a cat and really wanting a dog i want to have her inside at times, something to staffy won't object to.

Now I want her to sleep outside, but i also want to crate train her, i believe training in all areas is very important, the dogs enjoy training mainly due to there tremendous love of there owners and i just cements the bond between owner and pet (who is the owner and who is the pet is open to discussion, LOL).

So how can i go about this, I'm currently unemployeed (well the work i do is at home and not overly time consuming) and my wife works fulltime so i will be putting everything into this puppy, i'm just not sure how to go about it and its really bothering me as i'm very confident in all areas of dog ownership except for the whole crate training/sleeping outside inside/outside dog subject. I've read alot but no one really answers the question they seem to step around it so i need help. I want to raise this girl right so any help is appreciated. Sorry this is long winded but i write film screenplays and tend to get carried away.

Here are some pic of my beautiful girl Shelby at 2 weeks and 4 weeks, i pick her up on October 20th, can't wait.

Joel aka Barts

[sas]

I think I may be confused but there isn't a need to crate train a dog if you're going to have it sleeping outside as a crate is not appropriate for outside use.

Is there any reason why the dog can not be part of your family inside and sleep in a crate inside?

[cavNrott]

I think I may be confused but there isn't a need to crate train a dog if you're going to have it sleeping outside as a crate is not appropriate for outside use.

Is there any reason why the dog can not be part of your family inside and sleep in a crate inside?

I agree with sas. Crate training is for inside dogs. Crates are not suitable containment for dogs who live outside.

I have the same question. Is there a reason why this dog can't be inside with the family? Staffys are very people orientated dogs.

[Poodle wrangler]

I had a Staffy X in the past. ALL our dogs have slept outside, unless a "winter" puppy. I even had a poodle as a kid who was 100% outside dog and you can't get a more human-orientated than a poodle. We spent a lot of time with him outside. Would have been new to him that he was neglected :rolleyes:.

It's important a pup doesn't get too cold- I'm guessing it's still cold overnight in Broken Hill- so a crate will be useful so pup can be inside overnight without weeing/ pooing/ chewing in the wrong places. He'll need a couple of overnight toilet breaks. Apart from overnight (higher risk of accident) you can put his bedding in there and get him used to the crate while you work at home (door open).

I bought a crate and intended to use it for our standard poodle pup (now 9 months and 25kg) but really didn't use it and sold it.

[Barts]

I had a Staffy X in the past. ALL our dogs have slept outside, unless a "winter" puppy. I even had a poodle as a kid who was 100% outside dog and you can't get a more human-orientated than a poodle. We spent a lot of time with him outside. Would have been new to him that he was neglected .

It's important a pup doesn't get too cold- I'm guessing it's still cold overnight in Broken Hill- so a crate will be useful so pup can be inside overnight without weeing/ pooing/ chewing in the wrong places. He'll need a couple of overnight toilet breaks. Apart from overnight (higher risk of accident) you can put his bedding in there and get him used to the crate while you work at home (door open).

I bought a crate and intended to use it for our standard poodle pup (now 9 months and 25kg) but really didn't use it and sold it.

The nights here are still pretty cold, later on around november through to april our nights will be warm (thats an understatment). I just don't want my new little girl to be cold at night. I wouldn't mind so much if the she slept inside, but my wife and i travel around a bit, and on the rare occasions where we can't take her with us she'll go to my parents, all there dogs are outside dogs and i don't want her to get upset by having to sleep outside there. I want her to be comfortable with sleeping inside and outside. She won't be lonely at all, someone will be around most of the time, i just want her to be train right, so when i was reading about the whole crate training thing (which is new to me) i wanted to make sure i understood correctly and i was going about it the right way. I think since i read the crate training thing i'm become a little ... i don't know how to explain, a little less confident in the toliet training department.

Edited September 29, 2007 by Barts

[Poodle wrangler]

It's easy to forget the puppy stage: Toilet training doesn't last that long. You don't need to have a crate to toilet train, but many people say it makes it easier. Depends how drastic overnight accident(s) will be, I guess.

Basics:

Make crate a happy place for pup- introduce with treats, meals etc., maybe an old, washable blanket to sleep.

Crate will become the pup's den and dogs shouldn't wee/poo where they eat and sleep.

Crate should be only big enough for pup to stand and turn around. Any bigger is too much space and he's more likely to wee/poo in the furthest corner. Make smaller with a box or some crates come with a partition.

Pup should move about and be restless when wanting to toilet overnight. You get up, take him outside to toilet (wait until he goes, name it and say "good dog" and give a treat). Pop back into crate. All very business-like, no play.

Crate only for overnight and up to a few hours during the day. It's not meant to be a cage .

NEVER punish pup by putting him in his crate.

That's my understanding, anyway.

In practice, I found that pup cried when put in crate (hard to know if he wanted to get out or go to toilet and many false alarms) and often by the time I'd got there to let him out it was too late. So, I kicked him outside overnight with the other dog which was fine.

[sas]

If you travel alot, maybe right now isn't the best time to bring home a puppy?

What will happen if the dogs at your parents and the puppy can't all get along?

A puppy can't be left with adults dogs without supervision either.

[Barts]

If you travel alot, maybe right now isn't the best time to bring home a puppy?

What will happen if the dogs at your parents and the puppy can't all get along?

A puppy can't be left with adults dogs without supervision either.

This dog while growing up will be socialised with all my friends and family and there pets, my intention is for her to be very well socialised and therefore a happier dog for it. While we do travel a fair bit, at time only one of us is away, and we intend on taking her with us (family and friends who we are visiting have many pets, again more socialisation). On those rare occasion for instance were flying to brisbane for a wedding later on in the year, she will have to be left behind with my sister. Now if i find that someones dog and our girl don't get along then she will stay at a place where she does get along with there pets. I have plenty of time to introduce her to all the animals so i can gauge which is a better environment for her to stay in.

I have the best intentions for this little girl, i'm just making sure that i'm doing it right, thats all, as i've said before i was alright until i read about crate training and how important it is and i'm now confused by it.

[shellbyville]

I think teaching any puppy crate training is a great idea, whether they will sleep in it as a permanent kennel or just using it at odd times. All my dogs are crate trained! They all sleep outside in their kennels, but knowing I can put them in a crate is fantastic. One of my boys hurt his back and all he needed was rest, because he loves his crate he spent a week in their with no problems at all, with only walks to toilet. Also if I go away to my family and want to take a dog, I take the crate and they happily sleep in there with no crying, whinging etc. All my dogs walk into their crates freely and never have to be coaxed in.

To crate train, make the crate a fun, comforting place. Feed your puppy in the crate. Never put the puppy in the crate for discipline reasons. Make him feel like it is his den, his place of safety. Put his toys in their etc.

Crate training is a great idea and don't be put off using it. You will find it will make life much easier.

[Barts]

I think teaching any puppy crate training is a great idea, whether they will sleep in it as a permanent kennel or just using it at odd times. All my dogs are crate trained! They all sleep outside in their kennels, but knowing I can put them in a crate is fantastic. One of my boys hurt his back and all he needed was rest, because he loves his crate he spent a week in their with no problems at all, with only walks to toilet. Also if I go away to my family and want to take a dog, I take the crate and they happily sleep in there with no crying, whinging etc. All my dogs walk into their crates freely and never have to be coaxed in.

To crate train, make the crate a fun, comforting place. Feed your puppy in the crate. Never put the puppy in the crate for discipline reasons. Make him feel like it is his den, his place of safety. Put his toys in their etc.

Crate training is a great idea and don't be put off using it. You will find it will make life much easier.

Thankyou shellbyville thats good to hear. Its good to get some advice that is to the point rather than some subtle attempts to tell me i'm a potentially bad owner who shouldn't get a dog. I've read alot on the subject and know how to crate train a puppy, i was just having a little difficulty trying to translate that to having the dog sleep outside in her kennel aswell as being able to sleep inside in her crate (at times). Cause i don't want a pure outside dog, neither do i want a pure inside dog, i want a happy medium.

How did you start off there crate training with the transition it to kennels. Some dogs i've seen don't take to it to well, once there inside they like it to much etc, but how did you go about it?

I want a very happy well rounded content dog so i'm doing my research to make sure this comes about.

[shellbyville]

I actually never started any of my pups inside (except for the pups I breed myself). The last puppy I bought here went straight outside into the kennels, which are very secure.) However I have quite a few dogs, so they get their security from each other.

So I don't know if how I do it will apply to you. However You could try putting the crate in the laundry or garage area if you have one, that is away from your direct living space for sleeping at night. That way when you want puppy to sleep outside it isn't such a shock as it would be if you put the crate in the living area or bedroom for example. Sometimes you could bring your crate into the living area and let the pup spend some time in the crate with toys, maybe a bone to chew etc but locked in so he gets used to being confined in the crate, but close to you as well. Never let him out though when he is crying or whinging to get out, only let him out when he is content in there. Sometimes this might be for 5 minutes then gradually work up to longer. (unless you think he obviously needs to go to the toilet) you don't want him to toilet in his crate, can be a very hard habit to break. He will need regular toilet breaks overnight. Even now I have a crate set up inside and everynow and then will let one of my dogs in for some one on one time, when I have given them lots of attention they go into the crate while we watch tv at night, while they are confined they are in our company and they seem to enjoy it, as well as it being good training for them.

It really is just using the crate as a safe place for him, a place he will want to go into. At first, each time you put him in give him a treat or a bone to chew, so he sees the crate as a place of reward. (I just reread your posts and realise your puppy is a girl, sorry for saying him all the time.) My dogs spend a lot of time in crates at shows and then if I am staying overnight at a show, spend a lot of time in their trailer, which is just like a crate anyway. I have found they love their crate. When they were young I just put them in it when I thought about it with a bone or pigs ear, and they quickly get used to the crate and know they get a reward when they go in.

Hope some of this is helpful. What works for one may not work for another, but if you persist with the crate idea you will find it so useful. I am not advocating leaving dogs locked in crates all day or for hours on end, but they are great for those times when you can't fully supervise, or your visiting where there are other dogs etc.

Edited September 30, 2007 by shellbyville

[Barts]

I actually never started any of my pups inside (except for the pups I breed myself). The last puppy I bought here went straight outside into the kennels, which are very secure.) However I have quite a few dogs, so they get their security from each other.

So I don't know if how I do it will apply to you. However You could try putting the crate in the laundry or garage area if you have one, that is away from your direct living space for sleeping at night. That way when you want puppy to sleep outside it isn't such a shock as it would be if you put the crate in the living area or bedroom for example. Sometimes you could bring your crate into the living area and let the pup spend some time in the crate with toys, maybe a bone to chew etc but locked in so he gets used to being confined in the crate, but close to you as well. Never let him out though when he is crying or whinging to get out, only let him out when he is content in there. Sometimes this might be for 5 minutes then gradually work up to longer. (unless you think he obviously needs to go to the toilet) you don't want him to toilet in his crate, can be a very hard habit to break. He will need regular toilet breaks overnight. Even now I have a crate set up inside and everynow and then will let one of my dogs in for some one on one time, when I have given them lots of attention they go into the crate while we watch tv at night, while they are confined they are in our company and they seem to enjoy it, as well as it being good training for them.

It really is just using the crate as a safe place for him, a place he will want to go into. At first, each time you put him in give him a treat or a bone to chew, so he sees the crate as a place of reward. (I just reread your posts and realise your puppy is a girl, sorry for saying him all the time.) My dogs spend a lot of time in crates at shows and then if I am staying overnight at a show, spend a lot of time in their trailer, which is just like a crate anyway. I have found they love their crate. When they were young I just put them in it when I thought about it with a bone or pigs ear, and they quickly get used to the crate and know they get a reward when they go in.

Hope some of this is helpful. What works for one may not work for another, but if you persist with the crate idea you will find it so useful. I am not advocating leaving dogs locked in crates all day or for hours on end, but they are great for those times when you can't fully supervise, or your visiting where there are other dogs etc.

Thankyou very much, your words are very reassuring, it is rather simple when you get down to the basic about it. The fact that i'm home all the time will make this alot easier to do, actually i think i'm due for some new pics of the little girl i think i'll email the breeder, thanks alot.

joel

[R00]

HI Barts,

Sorry if this has been covered ( I don't have time read all the prior posts)

I take my Staffies everywhere I can and it is because of this that I crate trained them. When I go to a friends farm or my sister has to look after them for a night we can set up their crates and they are happy. Also if you get stuck with someone baby sitting them who doesn't like dogs inside, they can play all day outside and then come in at night and be locked in their crates, that way they are warm and safe at all times while contained so as to not worry the householders.

Second point is I would strongly encourage you to rethink the inside/outside aspect of your dog. Staffies are a breed that really love (and I mean really love) their humans. While your dog will be fine outside , you can be sure that she will rather be sitting by your side. You can train them to sit on a mat inside and to stay there. As long as she can see you he will be happy.

The benefit of the breed is the strong connection they form to their humans which allows you to have dog that will be happy to go where ever and when ever with you and not be a pain. They can be stubborn at times but if you allow them to form a close bond you can get them to do anything for/with you.

They are a compact unit with short fur so they don't do much damage inside. Erik will just sit on the rug and go to sleep while I am inside. The key to this is to never ever ever play with a staffy inside. Erik knows 100% he is not allow to even get into second gear inside, no confusion. If he runs inside he is pushed outside very quick. It only took him about 1 week to work this out. Even as a puppy I didn't play with him inside.

A couple of other points.

Read K9force's post on Socialisation ( Do a search on DOL.)

Go to the training forum and read up on the 'triangle of temptation' it is sticky (permanent) topic at the top of the forum

Go to www.k9force.net and read some of his articles, I have done a one on one with him and would highly recommend his theories ( so do a lot of Dolers), the nothing in life is free training program is perfect. (NILIF)

Either buy one of the premium leads from K9 or get one sent from here www.leerburg.com. Staffies are incredibily strong and paying 70 bucks for a top quality lead will be the best investment ever. I have 100% faith that no matter what happens with Erik and other dogs that the lead is going to hold, and I can get him out of trouble at all times. ( not that I have ever had to).

Most staffies don't bother starting any scraps, but you do need to be aware that if they get involved in one they will more than likely finish it or cause some major damage to the other dog. And while I may be flamed here, Joe Public will blame your dog due to his breed no matter if he didn't start it.

Also make sure you get her desexed, there are a number of benefits with this, for mine the most important one is that she wont get stolen (less attractive if he can't be bred from) and typically wont be stolen to used in baiting/fighting. And make sure whenever you meet someone just let on that she is desexed. (even if she isn't at first)

Now that I have finished my preaching , you NEED/MUST go to the staffy thread and post more pics.

Where is the little gal from?

Edited October 1, 2007 by Roo

[Barts]

HI Barts,

Sorry if this has been covered ( I don't have time read all the prior posts)

I take my Staffies everywhere I can and it is because of this that I crate trained them. When I go to a friends farm or my sister has to look after them for a night we can set up their crates and they are happy. Also if you get stuck with someone baby sitting them who doesn't like dogs inside, they can play all day outside and then come in at night and be locked in their crates, that way they are warm and safe at all times while contained so as to not worry the householders.

Second point is I would strongly encourage you to rethink the inside/outside aspect of your dog. Staffies are a breed that really love (and I mean really love) their humans. While your dog will be fine outside , you can be sure that she will rather be sitting by your side. You can train them to sit on a mat inside and to stay there. As long as she can see you he will be happy.

The benefit of the breed is the strong connection they form to their humans which allows you to have dog that will be happy to go where ever and when ever with you and not be a pain. They can be stubborn at times but if you allow them to form a close bond you can get them to do anything for/with you.

They are a compact unit with short fur so they don't do much damage inside. Erik will just sit on the rug and go to sleep while I am inside. The key to this is to never ever ever play with a staffy inside. Erik knows 100% he is not allow to even get into second gear inside, no confusion. If he runs inside he is pushed outside very quick. It only took him about 1 week to work this out. Even as a puppy I didn't play with him inside.

A couple of other points.

Read K9force's post on Socialisation ( Do a search on DOL.)

Go to the training forum and read up on the 'triangle of temptation' it is sticky (permanent) topic at the top of the forum

Go to www.k9force.net and read some of his articles, I have done a one on one with him and would highly recommend his theories ( so do a lot of Dolers), the nothing in life is free training program is perfect. (NILIF)

Either buy one of the premium leads from K9 or get one sent from here www.leerburg.com. Staffies are incredibily strong and paying 70 bucks for a top quality lead will be the best investment ever. I have 100% faith that no matter what happens with Erik and other dogs that the lead is going to hold, and I can get him out of trouble at all times. ( not that I have ever had to).

Most staffies don't bother starting any scraps, but you do need to be aware that if they get involved in one they will more than likely finish it or cause some major damage to the other dog. And while I may be flamed here, Joe Public will blame your dog due to his breed no matter if he didn't start it.

Also make sure you get her desexed, there are a number of benefits with this, for mine the most important one is that she wont get stolen (less attractive if he can't be bred from) and typically wont be stolen to used in baiting/fighting. And make sure whenever you meet someone just let on that she is desexed. (even if she isn't at first)

Now that I have finished my preaching , you NEED/MUST go to the staffy thread and post more pics.

Where is the little gal from?

Thankyou for your advice, i'll definitly be looking at the other thread and posts etc, in fact i've spent the last 2 weeks going through this site finding out as much as i can. While my parents and grandparents have never owned a staffy, many of my friends and there family have them and i must agree that they are a perfect breed for me. While i've been around dogs all my life i've spent the better part of the last 4 years finding the right dog for me. I don't have the room for a ridgeback, which would be the other breed i'd want (two totally different personalities). I've had alot of experience with both breeds and i want the staffy, and more importantly my wife actually likes the staffy breed (she had had cats all her life).

With regards to having my dog stolen, i don't believe anyone in this town would steal her, for starters there are to many "bogan" owners in this town that don't have there dogs desexed. Plus when she is ready she will be desexed, unless we choose otherwise, either way no one will be getting my dog, My family is to well known and i WILL find whoever dares too, But thankyou for your advice and concern its is greatly appreciated.

As for pictures i emailed the breeder yesturday so i should have some up to date pics of the beauty soon, she really is georgous, I'm getting her from Hay, in south central NSW, I'm from broken hill so there meeting us halfway to drop off the puppy at no extra charge, which was more than anyone else was willing to do. I can't stand breeders who want to charge you for everything with a highly enflated price, People say they aren't into breeding for the money but unforunatly "some" people i've spoken to lead me to believe the otherwise.

Anyway thanks again.

Barts

[Barts]

Also can anyone please tell me what size crate to get for a Staffy? I've been looking around, checking all the different sizes and can't make up my mind.

Any help?

[R00]

Also can anyone please tell me what size crate to get for a Staffy? I've been looking around, checking all the different sizes and can't make up my mind.

Any help?

you need to get an intermediate size. Depending on the brand approx 76cm long X 53 cm wide X 61cm high. I have two different brands and they are slightly different dimensions but close enough. You may be able to go a little smaller seeing as you are getting a girl again depending on the size steps the brand uses

Edited October 3, 2007 by Roo

[sas]

I think teaching any puppy crate training is a great idea, whether they will sleep in it as a permanent kennel or just using it at odd times. All my dogs are crate trained! They all sleep outside in their kennels, but knowing I can put them in a crate is fantastic. One of my boys hurt his back and all he needed was rest, because he loves his crate he spent a week in their with no problems at all, with only walks to toilet. Also if I go away to my family and want to take a dog, I take the crate and they happily sleep in there with no crying, whinging etc. All my dogs walk into their crates freely and never have to be coaxed in.

To crate train, make the crate a fun, comforting place. Feed your puppy in the crate. Never put the puppy in the crate for discipline reasons. Make him feel like it is his den, his place of safety. Put his toys in their etc.

Crate training is a great idea and don't be put off using it. You will find it will make life much easier.

Thankyou shellbyville thats good to hear. Its good to get some advice that is to the point rather than some subtle attempts to tell me i'm a potentially bad owner who shouldn't get a dog. I've read alot on the subject and know how to crate train a puppy, i was just having a little difficulty trying to translate that to having the dog sleep outside in her kennel aswell as being able to sleep inside in her crate (at times). Cause i don't want a pure outside dog, neither do i want a pure inside dog, i want a happy medium.

How did you start off there crate training with the transition it to kennels. Some dogs i've seen don't take to it to well, once there inside they like it to much etc, but how did you go about it?

I want a very happy well rounded content dog so i'm doing my research to make sure this comes about.

That's really unfortunate you feel that way, aren't the questions I asked the same questions we ask ourselves when we are thinking about brining a new companion into our home?

I think you were being a little sensitive.

What will make your dog happy is a sable pack with a reliable Alpha not a whole bunch of doggy 'friends' but I can understand how people come to that theory.

[Barts]

I think teaching any puppy crate training is a great idea, whether they will sleep in it as a permanent kennel or just using it at odd times. All my dogs are crate trained! They all sleep outside in their kennels, but knowing I can put them in a crate is fantastic. One of my boys hurt his back and all he needed was rest, because he loves his crate he spent a week in their with no problems at all, with only walks to toilet. Also if I go away to my family and want to take a dog, I take the crate and they happily sleep in there with no crying, whinging etc. All my dogs walk into their crates freely and never have to be coaxed in.

To crate train, make the crate a fun, comforting place. Feed your puppy in the crate. Never put the puppy in the crate for discipline reasons. Make him feel like it is his den, his place of safety. Put his toys in their etc.

Crate training is a great idea and don't be put off using it. You will find it will make life much easier.

Thankyou shellbyville thats good to hear. Its good to get some advice that is to the point rather than some subtle attempts to tell me i'm a potentially bad owner who shouldn't get a dog. I've read alot on the subject and know how to crate train a puppy, i was just having a little difficulty trying to translate that to having the dog sleep outside in her kennel aswell as being able to sleep inside in her crate (at times). Cause i don't want a pure outside dog, neither do i want a pure inside dog, i want a happy medium.

How did you start off there crate training with the transition it to kennels. Some dogs i've seen don't take to it to well, once there inside they like it to much etc, but how did you go about it?

I want a very happy well rounded content dog so i'm doing my research to make sure this comes about.

That's really unfortunate you feel that way, aren't the questions I asked the same questions we ask ourselves when we are thinking about brining a new companion into our home?

I think you were being a little sensitive.

What will make your dog happy is a sable pack with a reliable Alpha not a whole bunch of doggy 'friends' but I can understand how people come to that theory.

Sorry SAS, i get my back up when people say i shouldn't be getting a dog at this time, This is the best time for me to get a dog, i don't have a job, so i can dedicate alot of time to her, my wife earns a bucket load so there is no stress for me to get a job, I now have a yard that suits having a dog, the list goes on. I think my saying i travel alot was taken a little out of context, and i guess that is my fault. I drive alot, if its a weekend trip to adelaide once every couple of months, or its a camping trip down minindee lakes/darling river, it doesn't really matter cause i'd take her with me. But in the arse end of november i have a cousins wedding in brisbane and will be away for 8 days, she won't be able to come with me, and my brother in laws 21st are sept next year and thats in townsville etc etc, over the next couple of years there is potential that i may travel interstate and cannot take her, thats it why i asked the questions i did. Again a little my fault but again i don't like people telling me i shouldn't get a dog, i've wanted to get one since i moved out on my own in 1999 and now my circumstances are suitable for a dog, believe me i've thought about this along time.

With the doggy friends area please let me explain. Its not my intention to have her meet and be around others dogs all the time. But once a week i'll bring her to a friend or familes house for a play day. Also on those times when i go on holiday she'll have the week holiday with us, which will mean being with a couple of other dogs for a week, aswell as me and my family. I do understand the whole pack mentally, and i do know the importance of a Alpha and stable pack, But i do believe that through socialisation i'll end up with a better dog. In my experience dogs that get to meet many dogs throughout there lives end up better rounded personality wise.

But i guess we all have our own views on raising our dogs, i guess same for children aswell (but then again aren't they our children....)

Thanks for the advice people, i've taken it all on board, thankyou.

Barts