Front Legs Held Together

[Prydenjoy]

My Papillon puppy, Chino's front legs slant inwards from the shoulder to the elbow (I know I got the body bits wrong, I'm sure of it, but you get what I mean!), kinda like a British Bulldogs...

I only noticed this today. He gets a home made diet - Could something like this be caused by a deficiency or overnourishment? Or would I be likely to be seeing other symptoms if that was the case? Is it probable that they are supposed to be like that?

What I mean, is when he stands and looks at you the bottom sections of his legs touch up until the first joint. It looks rather pretty, like he's a little ballerina... But bitey

[wylie]

Jeanne

I am not quite sure what you are trying to describe.

A picture explains a lot of things if you can capture it.

He may be out at elbow, he may have an east west front, it could be nutritional, it could be developmental and it could just be his construction.

Owning a pap i see lots of paps who have strange fronts in the show ring.

His legs should drop straight down when he is stacked in a standing position.

By the way pictures are also expected in the papillon/phalene thread for others with paps to admire.

[BC]

I think I know what you are talking about.

You see it a lot in BYB malts and shih tzus. They do look like ballerinas, like their standing with their heels together and toes open and their entire leg is a very slight S shape.

I have been told once it is caused from bad breeding (why you see it so much in malts and shih's), but I really cannot comment as I have no experience in that field and I'm not sure where you got your pap from.

As wylie said it could be a number of things, possibly nutritional, in which a breeder would be able to tell you how to try and straighten the front.

[cavNrott]

It sounds to me like a description of cabriole legs. The shoulder/elbow part doesn't make sense but perhaps the OP means the legs bow out at the elbows and come back in at the wrist.

[Prydenjoy]

Getting a photo to demonstrate what I mean will be difficult, for starters, he is the squirmiest puppy I've ever come across and getting him to stand still for a photo will be next to impossible (only photos I can get of him are when he is sleeping). Secondly, my evil, sociopathic housemate who I used to live with stole the cord that goes from my camera to my computer, so I can't transfer photos to my computer anyway! Oh how I'd love to post photos of the brat, I do have a few that my sister took on her camera though that I can share - Where is this Papillon/Phalene thread?

BC - If it was nutritional I wouldn't be speaking to the breeder about how to fix it, she had him on Whiskas dry and loaf style cat foods and suggested I continue to feed him this food... I could never bring myself to buy cat food for a dog, especially Whiskas!

Actually, since getting Chino I've had a hard time getting in contact with his breeder, I've asked several times for a Pedigree, if only a photo copy (he was sold to me as a pet - I'm still entitled to see his pedigree aren't I?). His dad is well known and a beautiful dog, but I can't find anything out about his mother! I've seen a photo of her but haven't been able to see a pedigree or anything like that.

I love him to bits though, pedigree or none, he's still the sweetest, most lovable thing about

[Prydenjoy]

Ok I found a photo of a dog with legs slightly like Chino's - his legs do not bow out at any point though, his shoulders sit in very close to his body.

His legs are similar to the dog on the right of this photo

From what the webpage says it seems it is something that is bred into them. Is there anything I can do to make it less of a problem? Is it even a problem for a non-show dog?

[poodlefan]

Jeanne, I think the fastest way to allay your concerns about find out what is happening is to take your pup to a decent vet.

If it is nutritional, then the faster you get onto it the better.

[Prydenjoy]

Well he got a once over by a vet in Sydney about two weeks ago, Vet said he's a healthy little thing.

I think there is a vet coming out to dog training on Sunday, if so I'll ask her then (although it may have been last weekend, but we didn't go because it was raining).

Its probably nothing, I'm probably just an overly worried mum... Montie has a rather wide chest, so I'm used to his legs, which are further apart - Chino is a totally different type and at the moment he's so skinny (as in, has a narrow body - He's a healthy weight) it's probably natural for his legs to be closer together.

If I could find out more about his pedigree it might be easier to tell if it runs in his family...

[Prydenjoy]

Spoke to the vet today, she said it's unlikely to be anything serious - She saw him at his 12 week vaccinations and when she saw him today she said "wow, he's shot up!", because he has shot up so quickly and had a growth spurt his ligaments probably haven't caught up with the bones yet.

I'll just give him some extra vitamin C for that and try to prevent him shooting up and down the stairs

[badboyz]

With regard to seeing his pedigree - from which state did you buy your pup and was it from a registered breeder. In all states except SA & WA, I think, all pups bred by registered breeders must be registered, and the papers, whether main or limited, must go with the pup. Your breeder may not be playing by the rules me thinks!

[Prydenjoy]

Oh really? That's news to me! I'd better get on her back about it - I believe he is registered because she was going to keep him, I know his dad was registered so I doubt he would be used at stud to an unregistered breeder.

I'm in NSW, he came from NSW also. I can't believe she would sell me a pup and hold onto his papers, even though the rules state that the papers should come with him

Does anyone have the clause number and a quote explaining this part of the rules? If so could you please post them, so I can get a letter together to send to her to request his papers?

Thanks so much!