Puppy With A Severe Case Of Epilepsy :(

[puppiesmum]

hmmm...amazingly I also read in a couple of places that annual vaccines can possibly cause seizures in epi-dogs.

There is a difference though WSM saying that they can 'possibly' cause them to saying "they DO cause them so don't vaccinate your dog anymore' which is what Morgan originally said.

If vaccinations cause epilepsy, why is the average age of onset of convulsions 2 years? A dog commences vaccinations at 6 weeks.

Where have I said in this thread anything whatsoever about possible causes of epilepsy?

All I did was quote the advice of two different vets and offer a link with comprehensive info on a diet to assist with treatment of epilepsy

Guys, I'm just trying to get some tips and info on how best to deal with my pup - so does this really matter. I keep checking when there is a reply on here thinking someone else has some useful information but its just arguing

Can we just leave this be? I see what all of you are saying and I did post asking for thoughts and advice. There is not one particular set of rules for any dog with epilepsy so I am taking EVERYTHING on board. i appreciate all of your replies ... Except the arguing ones

Edited August 23, 2007 by puppiesmum

[~Anne~]

All I did was quote the advice of two different vets and offer a link with comprehensive info on a diet to assist with treatment of epilepsy

You may not have said that vaccinations cause epilepsy here in those exact words but you have said it before. In fact EVERY thread where someone mentions epilpesy you talk about vaccinations and ceasing them.

What you actually said and which I STRONGLY object to is;

Don't let him have any more vaccinations - not good for epilepsy sufferers or any dog with neurological or auto-immune problems.

There is currently a thread going whereby a lady has all her 5 dogs begin seizures on the same day. They started 21 days after their Vaccinations which included Lepto. It goes on to recommend Fish oil........

http://www.dolforums.com.au/index.php?showtopic=111094

Yes, I saw that. Interesting.

Another condition that can causes seizures is Syringiomyelia (Arnold Chiari Sydnrome) which might interest Puggles as Pugs are one of the 16 Breeds affected.

Thanks. I'll look into it.

For those looking at minimising their heartworm meds, Dr Jean Dodds recommends one of our monthly heartworm medications (ie does heartwom ONLY), every 45 days, she said it is not necessary to heartworm every 30 days.

I'd like to discuss this with my Vet as it sounds like it could be something that makes sense. I don't medicate with heartworm preventatives monthly during Winter. I drop it to every 2nd month. Although this is not on advice form anyone... just my own thoughts on it all.

Edited August 23, 2007 by Puggles

[morgan]

There is currently a thread going whereby a lady has all her 5 dogs begin seizures on the same day. They started 21 days after their Vaccinations which included Lepto. It goes on to recommend Fish oil........

http://www.dolforums.com.au/index.php?showtopic=111094

I am another one against over vaccinating, and due to virtually every site I have ever looked at saying that it can cause encephalitis, and seizures are a symptom of that, then it most definately is a cause of seizures IMO.

Another condition that can causes seizures is Syringiomyelia (Arnold Chiari Sydnrome) which might interest Puggles as Pugs are one of the 16 Breeds affected.

For those looking at minimising their heartworm meds, Dr Jean Dodds recommends one of our monthly heartworm medications (ie does heartwom ONLY), every 45 days, she said it is not necessary to heartworm every 30 days.

Heartworm meds were designed to last for 6 weeks (safety margin) but manufacturers felt that owners couldn't remember to give them at this interval, so recommended every month to simplify things.

The fact that they also sell more this way is beside the point

[White Shepherd mom]

Guys, I'm just trying to get some tips and info on how best to deal with my pup - so does this really matter. I keep checking when there is a reply on here thinking someone else has some useful information but its just arguing

puppiesmum, have a look at this website: www.canine-epilepsy.com

There is a forum you can join and there are lots of people that can help. Good luck with your little one's seizures.

[puppiesmum]

Guys, I'm just trying to get some tips and info on how best to deal with my pup - so does this really matter. I keep checking when there is a reply on here thinking someone else has some useful information but its just arguing

puppiesmum, have a look at this website: www.canine-epilepsy.com

There is a forum you can join and there are lots of people that can help. Good luck with your little one's seizures.

Thanks white shepherd mom - I will shoot off and have a look now.

[Staffy-Lover]

puppies mum how is it all going? any seizures since the last ones you wrote about?

Can i also suggest that you buy a diary just for your dogs epilepsy where you monitor the time and any changes in weather, food, exercise and anything else you can think of including worming, environment, bathing EVERYTHING.

Some epilepsy has triggers, so by keeping your diary you may be able to work out if yours has a trigger. Some dont have triggers but the diary can be a handy source of info if you have problems down the track.

i also record changes in meds, blood test results etc

good luck

[Belljari]

Hi, I hope your puppy is ok and is settling down. The advise from Puggles and Staffy-Lover has been great

I have lived with a dog for 12 years and for 10 years he suffered from epilepsy. I don't know how old your dog is but usually epi starts around 18m to 2 years. Just asking because if he is younger make sure it is not something else. Maybe ring Dr Childs and get some advise over the phone and maybe there is a specialist in Qld to go to or she could help your vet with controling it.

It is also better for them not to be under stress I found if he was stressing about something he would fit. I kept a routine for him and he knew it, feed in the morning and night at the same times every day with his meds. It is really important to do this as it will control it. I kept him on a routine with everything!

I moved not long after he first started fitting and the stress of this caused him to have cluster fits this would happen off and on for a while. When I say cluster fit he would fit get up and fit again and again and again. And every time he fitted I had to give him a dose of phenobarbitone I felt like I was going to overdose him. I too use to ring the vet in tears, it was heart breaking to watch but it does get better he needs the bromide to build up in his system. For his whole life from the age of 2yrs he was on the pheno and bromide just as he got older and from the build up in his system I did lower the dose slowly and also he would fit less sometimes we would go a year or two with no fits and towards the end of his life hardly ever! But he was on meditcation his whole life.

I also gave heartworm tablets and he was vaccinated with no ill affects.

Just give the medication a chance to work.

Good Luck.

[puppiesmum]

Okay, an update so far. No more fits since I joined on here - its been 2 weeks from yesterday since he had his last fit and his petite mals have virtually completely stopped for now. but this has happened before - and then out of nowhere the big cluster comes along. I started him on some fish oil tabs as suggested - 1 every 2nd night because they are too strong otherwise. He had a blood test a little over a week ago and his levels were around mid range - maybe a little higher - they test was taken a few hours after his meds dosage though. So he is staying on 1.5 tabs morning and night for now and we'll get him tested again in another few weeks just to be sure that its not too much for his little body. So for now its just a waiting game as you would all know The vet spoke to a specialist also and we have other (more expensive) options if this higher dose of phenobarb doesnt work which we will explore if need be. I dont particularly care what the cost if it gives him a long and happy life.

[~Anne~]

.............- they test was taken a few hours after his meds dosage though. ...................

I'd be demanding they re-test for free as they have stuffed up. The levels should be taken at TROUGH. Basically this means just before he is due for his meds so they can test what the levels in his system are at their lowest. With phenobarb, it is absorbed within the system in 120 minutes and then from then on in it decreased throught the hours until his next dose.

Good to hear his seizure activity is nil for the mean while.

Edited as you said on the other thread he is already on bromide.

Edited September 2, 2007 by Puggles

[Staffy-Lover]

.............- they test was taken a few hours after his meds dosage though. ...................

I'd be demanding they re-test for free as they have stuffed up. The levels should be taken at TROUGH.

i agree with puggles. you can't take the test after meds it doesn't work.

go back and talk to your doc about it, many don't know the protocol properly if they haven't had the exp , but those tests are bloody expensive so id demand it be done again.

[puppiesmum]

.............- they test was taken a few hours after his meds dosage though. ...................

:cool: I'd be demanding they re-test for free as they have stuffed up. The levels should be taken at TROUGH.

i agree with puggles. you can't take the test after meds it doesn't work.

go back and talk to your doc about it, many don't know the protocol properly if they haven't had the exp , but those tests are bloody expensive so id demand it be done again.

I will be getting the test done later in the afternoon next time - It was just in this instance that circumstances with work etc we couldnt get him there any other time. The first test was taken about an hour before his meds were due. So we will get that next time. its just difficult timing it as he is terrified of needles and its bad enough putting something into him let alone trying to draw blood out!! Last time was an absolute mess - there was blood everywhere. 3 of us could not hold him still This tiny 5kg dog grew strength I dont think even he knew he possesed! it was truly a mess!

As for demanding a new test for free - there is absolutely NO WAY I would have the nerve to do that - considering I cant remember the last time I actually paid to see the vet!! So even if the results arent 100% I'd say we are still up by a long way!! He's been really good to us.

[~Anne~]

As for demanding a new test for free - there is absolutely NO WAY I would have the nerve to do that - considering I cant remember the last time I actually paid to see the vet!! So even if the results arent 100% I'd say we are still up by a long way!! He's been really good to us.

Fair enough but in my honest opinion you should discount the results then. It was a pointless exercise and a waste of time and your Vet is doing the wrong thing by judging his levels of medication and his seizure control on the results. *shrugs*