House Training Going Downhill

[Gwinganna]

When we got Stella she was in an enclosure to sleep and we had a puppy pad in there. It was really cold when we got her (june) and so she was trained to go on the pad. Now, I :

a) can't seem to get her to go outside. She plays and looks at me and then we go in after 10 minutes with me thinking I'll try again in 15 minutes, and in 3 she just pees or poos inside before I can catch her.

b) her hit rate on the pad has gone from 80% to about 5%, although half the time it is NEAR the pad

I want to train her to go outside, but I suspect the wife might have roused on her once ot twice for going inside, unintentionally, or when she has caught her in the act, I know I did once by mistake, and I suspect she is now a sneaky toileter. We praised her lavishly when she did the right thing and went outside early on, but she just doesn't seem to do it at all now.

Somehow I have ended up with a completely arse about house training, and I have done largely what I have done in the past, but the effect has been diametrically different this time. It's VERY frustrating. She is 13 weeks old.

I need some tips. I was thinking I need to have her sleep in a "crate" or something she can't get out of at night so she builds it up and MUST go when I put her out. Thing is, I really hate crates, and don't want one inside the house. What other alternatives are there? She learned to climb out of the enclosure we got for her. I could put her in the laundry at night, but it's too big to stop her going inside I think and I really need to train her to go outside. It's getting ridiculous.

Any good advice?

[Miranda]

I always train my puppies to go outside from the moment I get them, I'm not a believer in pads or newspapers being used when you're wanting a dog to toilet outside IMO they just hinder the process, really you just have to bite the bullet and take them outside rain or shine, hot or cold.

I crate all my dogs and there is no doubt that crates are a great help in toilet training, if you don't want to use a crate then you are going to find it much harder. Puppies need to go after sleeping, after eating and after playing and about every hour in between, you need to take the puppy outside after each of these activities and you have to stay outside with her until she relieves herself, it doesn't matter if she takes 5 minutes or 55 minutes you just have to wait and then lots of praise. When the puppy is inside watch her all the time, if she shows any signs of wanting to go eg. circling, sniffing take her straight outside and once again you'll have to wait. When you can't watch her you need to confine her to a small area like a crate because every mistake is only reinforcing the behaviour.

Overnight she should be able to hold on if you put her to bed at about 11 and take her out at about 6, but if you've got her loose in the house obviously this won't happen so once again I'd recommend that you confine her somewhere, if you don't want to use a crate maybe someone else has some other suggestions.

I have large dogs and from what I've heard toy dogs can be harder to toilet train so hopefully someone with toys will come along and offer some alternative ideas.

Hope this helps :D

[pebbles]

What Miranda said :D I've got Miniature Pinschers and haven't had much trouble to train them although some can be a little slower (stubborn) to catch on. You may have to start from the beginning again but keep at it, it will come! I'd get rid of the pad.

[krash01]

I actually used the puppy pads with my pup and got him trained quite quickly. He sleeps in the laundry so we had the pad in there also and gradually moved it closer to the back door. Also, when he's inside with us, we'd take him outside about every half hour, take him to his pet loo (cause we don't have any grass) and say "toilet".

We've been pad free for quite a few months now (he's 10 months old) and he holds on through the night and hasn't had an accident in a very long time. He'll go to the back door by himself when he needs to go (but he wont bark).

I think the key is constantly taking them to the toilet and showing them where they need to go. Hope this is helpful :D

Good luck with the training!!

[Gwinganna]

Just told my child bride to get different puppy fencing she can't climb over so she can have her corner again, and we'll tighten the area up some to discourage her toileting in there, (it'll be like a crate without having a cage sitting in the house, and while I see the practicality, I just can't handle the look, how shallow am I?) to get the Piss Off urine smell remover stuff, and the Piss On toileting attractant stuff, and a dog door. We'll have to go back to basics.

Thanks for the reply Miranda and pebbles and Krash, I saw the "read" numbers going up and no reply and thought I might have alientated people with my "bah humbug" reply to the Doggie Spirits thread :D

When I take her out, do I say "Toilet!" (the word I have been using, so I may as well stick to it) when I want her to go, or when she does go. Lately I have been saying "toilet!", and I think she is going to think it means "run around a bit, sniff stuff, sit and look at boofhead and lie on his feet"

Plus I am only there early morning and late at night (I leave the house at 7am for work and get back around 7pm most nights) and at weekends, so my wife is going to have to be on the same page, and for her with a 3.5 year old for all but 2 days a week and an additional 5 and 8 year old in the mornings and after prep and school, it's hard for her to be super vigilant 100 % of the time, so the enclosure will need to be good enough for Stella to spend bursts of time in while Ro runs the house, so to speak. Stella can see everyone from there, it's right near the kitchen, so she shouldn't feel too isolated.

Never had a problem house breaking a dog before, I must have subtely stuffed this one up. Ah well - refocus and we shall overcome!

Edited August 21, 2007 by Gwinganna

[BenjiMom]

When we bought Benji...he was used to using the grass to pee and poo on......so wasnt that hard to train him....anyway, my parnter left for melb last friday and since then i've had the most naught puppy ever. He's gone back to poo on the carpet and chew leads, wakes me up at 3am etc etc etc, dont know if he's missing my partner or just his age, he's almost 16 weeks old now. As to training, back I go to retrain him. Im going to work in the morning and will confine him to the bathroom with blanket food, water and bones and toys. I hope this is the last puppy for me and he lives for a long time also lol Love is great, but at times they just stress you out. Stella will settle, takes time. Benji wont stay in the yard without me there, so I still have to stay til he wee's etc. Least i know when he goes to other side of yard..tis poo time also ..lol We've had him now for almost 5 weeks and im starting to feel very tired. But saying all that..he's worth all the trouble, he WILL grow up and we love him.

[Teebs]

Dont want a crate in the house

Do you realise they make great coffee table? Great spare seats if you have visitors, and also they are pretty good at being bedside tables.

:D

[Gwinganna]

Dont want a crate in the house

Do you realise they make great coffee table? Great spare seats if you have visitors, and also they are pretty good at being bedside tables.

:D

Thats funny. If I could find one that kinda looked like furniture, I would get it. Maybe thats a market niche?

[Erny]

When I take her out, do I say "Toilet!" (the word I have been using, so I may as well stick to it)

You can use whatever word you like. I use "quick quick" (much less embarressing when in very public places). But if you've been using the word "toilet" and are happy enough with that, then stick to it. More civilised than calling out "wee wee" or "poo poo" in public anyway.

One thing though - avoid saying "Toilet!". If you use the word with exclamation or even loudly chances are you're going to distract your dog from the very thing you want her to do. Use the word quietly and without excitement or emotion.

... when I want her to go, or when she does go. Lately I have been saying "toilet!", and I think she is going to think it means "run around a bit, sniff stuff, sit and look at boofhead and lie on his feet"

You're only in the "teaching" phase of this part of her training. At this stage she hasn't yet paired the word with the action of going. You are therefore best to avoid giving the "toilet" command before she goes - because if she does not you are only rendering the word as something meaningless to her.

Instead, wait for the 'stream' of urine to start and then, without causing distraction, say the "toilet" command. But you do need to say it before she's finished urinating.

As her toilet training improves and you are certain that she is about to 'go' you can then begin to use the word just a split second before urination begins.

You will then soon be able to use "toilet" as an actual command.

Kal used to oblige me with a dry 'squat' if I gave the toilet command when she was already empty. I'm sure she would have rolled her eyes at the same time if she'd been capable .

[Gwinganna]

Thanks.

She seems to be holding it and waiting to go inside. How do I stop that?

[Erny]

She seems to be holding it and waiting to go inside. How do I stop that?

How long are you waiting outside for her to go?

[Flaves]

Dont want a crate in the house

Do you realise they make great coffee table? Great spare seats if you have visitors, and also they are pretty good at being bedside tables.

I use them as both!!!

[Gwinganna]

I wait about 20 minutes, but she is treating it as play time. Plus I haven't been able to be sure if she needs to go.

Now - this morning - it was different. I got a new enclosure for her to sleep in, like when we got her. She took to it first time again, no dramas, slept in it all night. In the morning, the puppy padd was very wet, but no poos, so I was like YAY!! Took her straight out (6 am) and it's pissing down rain of course. Put a pad at the edge of the deck out of the rain, next to the grass, and drops of the attractant etc on the basis it was at least outside and near the grass. Nothing. Then I had to go to the loo myself, so I left her outside and went to the loo. I get back 10 minutes later, and my boy has gotten up, let her in and there were 2 poos inside on the timber floor!

AAARRRGGGHHHHH!!!!!!!

I had her right where I wanted her and it slipped through my fingers!

[Nova'sMum]

Thanks for the reply Miranda and pebbles and Krash, I saw the "read" numbers going up and no reply and thought I might have alientated people with my "bah humbug" reply to the Doggie Spirits thread

Hi Gwinganna

Have to confess, I'm guilty of reading and not posting. I'm new to puppies and the forum and having similar problems so I'm just surfing for info.

Not having much luck with my own pup, though he's worked out what the dog door is for and is quite happy to go outside to play and I guess toilet (there's no mess in the laundry when I get home from work). He knows the word "toilet" and will usually oblige when requested. He also will prop in the middle of whatever he's doing when inside and feels the need and give me this baleful look (if I'm around to see it - and it seems I'm the only one in the family who can see the dog) as if to say "when a guy's got to go, a guy's got to go!" and then goes on his merry way. I need to work out how to make him realise inside is not good. He knows outside is good. I've come to the conclusion I must be more vigilant oh and pay more attention to how long it's been since he last went.

BTW - hope I'm not "hijacking" this thread. Totally new to forums and how things work, so any advise on forum eticate as well as puppy training greatfully accepted.