poodlesplus Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 "Every one has there own line of thinking though. I respect that." So do i. I am not in to grading adversives, it is far to easy to get pompous about this adversive or that adversive. Really, i don't think about them much at all as I am fairly heavily weighted towards the R+ end of the spectrum. I guess thats why I train the way I do for retrieves. I also find it very enjoyable for myself which is a factor to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jesomil Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Yes, looking forward to FOO nights, and I hope some of the other DOLers can make it this year. Anyone else planning to come? Leo, JulesP, Jesomil, RoxysMum, Shoemonster? They do mock trials with real judges, and have a BBQ as well. Whats a FOO night?? I used FR with my first dog and didnt get fantastic results. Could have been because i was a novice handler?? Next dog i used free shaping (thanks for the right name PAX ) and i had a brilliant trainer and a driven dog. It took about 2 weeks to have a good solid formal retrieve. She never lost any points in a trial from her retrieves. I liked free shaping for that dog because it had her out and back so fast and with such enthusiasm and precision. With the dog i am training now, i have been free shaping the dumbell but he is not as food motivated and is being a little slow with it and i am getting bored. May have to try option B with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 I have been using a clicker to train the retrieve (so free shaping too). Diesel loves to hold it and carry it around, but we have some motivational issues with going out to get the dumbell when thrown. Once he gets it he is happy to come back quickly and front. But I have some motivational issues with Diesel at times anyway, so I don't think it has much to do with method I have used to retrieve I have to admit I haven't practiced it much lately, which doesn't help. Zoe has a much faster, zippier retrieve than Diesel, but can be a bit mouthy with the dumbell. Since I am not trialling her, and it is just for fun, I haven't corrected that. I haven't tried using a force retrieve, and don't think I would unless I had someone experienced to show me and a dog with the right temperament. I'd be too worried about mucking it up and making the dog hate retrieving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxy's mum Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Whats a FOO night?? My thoughts exactly!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arya Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 FOO nights (or in the case of me and my dog should be 'fool nights' LOL) are Friends of Obedience nights. They are trial run-throughs held at KCC Park in the evenings on Tuesdays during daylight savings. They cost (last year) $5 a go and it's really good. Judges and other exprienced triallers who act as judges come and rings are set up and you can do a trial run through in the ring in the class you book. There is a bbq and tea and coffee and it's great fun as well as good practice for the dogs. I went to every one last summer (for all the good it did Tess and me LOL) and loved it. It is very popular though so if you want to go, keep an eye out in VCA mag and book in. You need to book in on a weekly basis, I think. Or say you will be there next week or whatever. The people who go to the trouble of putting it on (Nolene McIllroy and OTEC members) just do a fantastic job. It's well worth supporting as it raises money for OTEC too and new stuff like ring ropes get bought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatevah Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 I taught it like this First few training sessions Step 21 of Shirley Chong method Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridgie_cat Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 I am not dead against FR - just would prefer a dif method. Both I think would work with Lana - where some dogs I think would not do FR and some would not learn by the clicker method. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Posted August 17, 2007 Author Share Posted August 17, 2007 It's interesting to hear everyones methods. I'm not against any, but every dog is different. I had no choice but to try a different method as getting the finger off Cooper with FR was not nice I have never had a problem with Cooper mouthing, which I am thankful for. When I say hold, he holds it, and doesn't let it go. Even if I have my hands on the dumbell while its in his mouth, he will not let it go until I say "give". He has never spat it and I dont think he ever will Hopefully he does just as well with articles. Its also great how he knows the difference. He will play with the dumbell at home, but when we are at training, he knows what he has to do with it. I am assuming it is the environment, and he obviously knows the difference between work and play. As I am a novice handler knowing the different methods are great. I am 99% sure I will have an Aussie pup in a couple of months and I'm sure she will be different to training Cooper so knowing different methods in all aspects of training are a great help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulesP Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 What is it with these BCs?? I am (as most people know) quite stressed with this retrieve business now. Brock still thinks it is quite offensive still (patience, Jules, patience). I am considering trialling my cat after she went and fetched a toy I had chucked for Brock! FOO hey? bit of a hike for me Dogdude but will try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridgie_cat Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 JP - what method are you using? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ness Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Hey JP just have patience - I should know I needed it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulesP Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Shirley Chong mainly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogdude Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 Come on Jules! I live in Epping remember!! No excuses They are great run throughs because they have the same level of distractions as a real trial. Good experience for new trialling dog or novice handler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arya Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 He he , I travel from Phillip Island each week, at least once a week sometimes two or more for different training sessions. I train at Frankston on Sats and then there's trials and then there's FOOS in summer and then there's different trips to KCC etc. Gawd, hope the price of petrol doesn't go up any further LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulesP Posted August 18, 2007 Share Posted August 18, 2007 Lol I am probably closer than both of you, but think you have better drives to get there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueM Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 (edited) This is a good thread I have to teach a retrieve with my dog and all this advice is very usefull, he is a chihuahua so its a bit of a challenge but he is very toy focussed etc so hopefully I can master it, finally found a small wooden dumbell and I am finding he is showing a lot of interest in it, I can now have him sit at my side, I can throw it, he will wait for my command to fetch will retrieve it and bring it back to me but drops it, he hasnt mastered the hold part as yet any tips on that would be fab also.....he does this at home , but so far has no interest in the dumbell at training club :-( Edited August 19, 2007 by varicool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC Posted August 20, 2007 Author Share Posted August 20, 2007 This is a good thread I have to teach a retrieve with my dog and all this advice is very usefull, he is a chihuahua so its a bit of a challenge but he is very toy focussed etc so hopefully I can master it, finally found a small wooden dumbell and I am finding he is showing a lot of interest in it, I can now have him sit at my side, I can throw it, he will wait for my command to fetch will retrieve it and bring it back to me but drops it, he hasnt mastered the hold part as yet any tips on that would be fab also.....he does this at home , but so far has no interest in the dumbell at training club :-( To get Cooper to hold it, I would let him grab it out of my hand, just touch him slightly under the chin, with a yummy piece of hotdog up above his nose, and the command "hold" I started off with a couple of second, then built up the hold time from there. I also had heaps of trouble with Cooper being interested in toys etc out of the house. Played with everything at home, but when we got to training, no thanks. He just wanted to herd everything. I started teasing him with it. Shake his toy in his face, throw it in the air, throw it between people, and the first sign of him wanting to grab it, I put it away. He then started looking for it after a while, and as soon as I grabbed it I had his attention straight away, thats when I actually started letting him have it. I then started doing the same thing with the dumbell. I tease him with it a bit first, and then he is keen as mustard to go and grab it at training. I found this the hardest part of his training so far. Training is tough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueM Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 Thanks BC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leopuppy04 Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 ok - I just tried a new 'game' this weekend with d/b retrieves and am really pleased with the results. Leo is fine at the 'mechanics' of the retrieve, but I do need to build up his enthusiasm a little.... All I did was 'throw' the d/b one way and once he retrieves it, I will mark and reward by throwing the food in the opposite direction (was this what you were describing with the toy Arya?)..... He absolutely LOVED it. Once in a while (we only did about 3 retrieves) I would pivot turn to face the dog and get him to present.... I loved it, my dog loved it, my knees didn't Gradually i'll build up to him 'fetching' a dead dumbell but at the moment, I just want him to understand that boy - these d/b are FUN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yarrowfell Posted August 20, 2007 Share Posted August 20, 2007 I have a Pug that I have managed to teach to retrieve in about 8 days. She has NO retrieve drive at all when I started but has a huge interest in food. I used two websites: http://www.dragonflyllama.com/%20DOGS/Leve...LevelsBook.html and http://www.shirleychong.com/keepers/retrieve.html. I read both of these over and over so I understood what I was doing. I also read and asked questions here. I clicker trained with two separate exercises to start with. 1. To go out and touch the dumbell 2. Was to sit in front and take dumbell (clicks for touch/nudging/mouthing and finally holding) when she could do both reliably (about 5 days - I work her 10mins each night) I threw the dumbell and didn't click when she touched. She looked at me, picked it up and stood there. I clicked for that. I hit a wall at that point as she would go out, pick it up and drop it and come in and sit. At the suggestion on a judge I but a thin lead on her and as soon as she picked it up gave a slight tug. As soon as she took a few steps with the dumbell I rewarded. Built this up and she is happy to fetch it now and actually gets excited when she sees the dumbell. Hope this makes sense; it can get hard to explain. Phill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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