KitKat Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 Well...as Varicool can attest...my lil black brat Sabre decided to chuck a tantie while Bronx and i trained in the third class at training tonight. Sabre trained in the first class...did as expected...very distracted but not as bad as he could have been But when i swapped them over Sabre went nuts...and spent 40 minutes out of the next 45 barking his pretty head off - all tantie that he was there and Bronx was with me on the field. I'm looking to take the remote trainer next time...as i can't really put everyone thru that much noise again! I was suggested to put Sabre in the car...except i know he would trash it! I live nearby but not close enough to take Sabe home and get back with Bronx before classes restart. Any ideas? On a good note...Bronx was doing stands and stand for exam fairly well!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAX Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 Dog Trailer and a spray water bottle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poodle wrangler Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 Crate in car? Didn't a DOLer's dog recently chew every seat belt: $1000- damage in < 20 minutes? There are a lot of dogs at obedience who have this problem at our club. Some are so impossible their 'sibling' is left at home. Is he used to being alone at other times? If not, you could gradually get him used to it when you're at home. Or, is it just that he wants to join in? Don't worry, our instructors agility dogs do a fair bit of barking if she has them tethered outside. She just yells at them to be quiet or asks someone to shut them up for her . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KitKat Posted August 13, 2007 Author Share Posted August 13, 2007 Sabe is used to being left behind...he doesn't like it when i take Bronx out with me and leave him at home...but it's only 5mins of whinging and then he is over it. I think part of it may have been the fact he could at times see us...and see that Bronx was out 'playing' with me...so he did what he used to do....chuck a tantie until he decided it wasn't working for him. He was quiet for a few times while he couldn't see us, and perhaps the last ten-15mins of class...as we were finishing and discussing what to practice etc etc. As we walked back he was quiet...and when i tied Bronx up with him Sabe was still quiet etc. I thought about a crate in the car...but my car isn't big enough to be able to do that and still fit Sabe in the crate...lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAX Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 I thought you bought a dog trailer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KitKat Posted August 13, 2007 Author Share Posted August 13, 2007 (edited) Yeah...i did have one but had to sell it as i wasn't getting as much use out of it as i had intended/expected due to a change or two in circumstances. So sold it and paid out what was left owing on it I may end up getting a little 2berth in the next year or two...but it will partially depend on how finances go at the moment - and i am still hoping to get a Challenger in the near future so depending on how much that costs me i might be able to add a cheap trailer to it not long after ;) ETA - mind you with a Challenger i would be able to put a crate in the back - not to mention if i set the back up as a crate itself etc...lol Edited August 13, 2007 by KitKat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leopuppy04 Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 (edited) Hmm.... this sounds familiar! Take one out and the other chucks a hissy!!!! How much patience do you have? Leo used to do this at agility when I would tie him up to get the equipment out.... also when I used to train with a friend and I would tie him up to help with her dogs. Kinta does this/ did this when I train Leo. I can't 'growl' at the 'barker' as the dog with me will think i'm cross at them! So I found with a bit of patience this works. 1. - you can wait it out and as soon as they are quiet reward them with a handful of treats - if you are quiet look at all the yummies that come your way! 2. - Sounds like with your dog - if you did step 1, you would be waiting forever and a day, plus coming home with a massive headache! so - this is another option - put dog in crate and cover with something that they can't see through. Leave a pigs ear/bone/toy - something nice in there..... if he is quiet, give plenty of treats etc. Go away - do a small amount of work with your dog, come back and reward etc, etc, etc..... To graduate from that - when the dog can lie there quietly for longer periods - slowly start lifting the covers up etc..... Good luck ETA: oh yeah - DONT go back to him when barking and don't even look at him - the slightest 'look' was a reward for my 2!!! Edited August 13, 2007 by leopuppy04 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KitKat Posted August 13, 2007 Author Share Posted August 13, 2007 (edited) Yeah...a look is kind of a reward for Sabre as well - he'd be quiet for a second as soon as i glared at him from across the soccer field ( ;) ) and then would start up again as soon as my attention was back on Bronx...lol. I've thought about the crate...but it would have to be one of the metal ones as he can easily trash a soft crate...but shifting a metal crate across the field before and after training would wear me out more then just training the dogs! I might have to invest in a trolley..... ETA - thinking about it...not sure i can fit two large dogs and a big metal crate and trolley in my car...at it is Bronx sits in the front passenger seat. Might have to clean out my car and see if i can make some additional room Edited August 13, 2007 by KitKat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leopuppy04 Posted August 13, 2007 Share Posted August 13, 2007 LOL - what type of car do you have? Don't underestimate space - I am the Queen of getting things in the car - I could fit 2 x dogs, 2 crates (1 soft, 1 trolley), show grooming box, trial bag, my chair etc... ALL into a 3dr Toyota Echo.... but if you wanted to come with me - you'd be strapped to the roof When I would even slightly glance at Kinta - she would have the last say - quiet for a second and then a 'woof' as if to say 'i'll show you'!!!! A trolley is the best investment i've made yet ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KitKat Posted August 14, 2007 Author Share Posted August 14, 2007 I have a lantra wagon...however it's still got a fair bit of stuff from when we moved a few months ago...i haven't had the chance to get the last smaller bits and pieces from the seat wells etc ;) Not to mention that i have a soft crate almost permanently in there for when Bronx works with me on Sundays (if i thought Sabe wouldn't have eaten it i'd have stuffed him into it - however it's already fairly trashed thanks to Sabe!). If i shift everything i should be able to fit a metal crate into the back seat, Sabe in the boot and Bronx in the passenger seat - however the crates will have to wait until the new dog runs arrive - as otherwise i'd be too stuffed to shift the metal crate back into the shed for bedtime So if the pens haven't turned up by next training day i might try the remote trainer and go from there - but if we have the pens i'll try the covered crate idea (with the RT as backup! lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickie Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 (edited) KitKat, I guess it depends how important it is to you for him to be quiet. Trim used to literally scream (not bark) her head off as a puppy whenever I trained the boys. I HAD to do something about it, people thought she was being murdered. Before taking her back to training, I did some training at home, tied to her to the clothesline, worked a dog right in front of her & was close enough to correct her instantly. I hyped the other dog right up, so that I could be sure to get a response out of her. I used a waterspray & although I wouldn't recommend it for all dogs, it worked perfectly & only took a few very strong corrections paired with a verbal to get the message through. The verbal I used was a word I don't use in every day language & was one saved especially for her tantrums. I must confess, now that I am starting to train Shine, I need to repeat the whole process. Shine is fine in a covered crate, but if she can see, she does the same. I think it's important to decide what you will do & do it straight away, the longer you take him & let this behaviour continue, the harder it will be to stop it. I also think it's VERY important to train it at home first, then in an empty park, then a busy park before you take it to training. I know lots of people won't agree with the correction, but IMO, a couple of strong corrections are much kinder than years of nagging (like I did with my boys). JMO. Edited August 14, 2007 by Vickie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidoney Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 This is a good situation for a Treat and Train - a remote rewarder (tone and reward dispense, plus has a few other functions). I used one for exactly the same kind of behaviour and found that it was very useful. Training needed a high rate of reward at first, and shorter distance and separation period esp. with the more excitable and stressy dog, but all the dogs I used it with improved quickly to the point where I could use it when training. It's also a very effective crate training tool. They are not being made any more, but a new version is coming out in October, called the Manners Minder. The Manners Minder has a variable frequency so you can use multiple units in a training session - good for rewarding different dogs in different crates, or for direction training at a distance, etc. I bought two of the TnTs coz I found them useful - I'll get one of the new ones so I can use more than one unit at once. You may be able to pick up a second hand TnT on Ebay, esp. once the Manners Minder comes out with its multiple frequencies. And NO, I don't have any interest in the company! LOL! I just like them for training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KitKat Posted August 14, 2007 Author Share Posted August 14, 2007 (edited) Oh i whole heartedly believe in corrections if and when needed...lol. However distance was more the problem last night...there was no way i would have been able to get back to him in time to correct and have the timing right if that makes sense? His tanties are much like the sterio typical kid in a shopping centre on their back with feet and fists in the air, kicking, screaming and angry...lol - he's been doing them like that since he was 8 weeks old. One of his brothers (the other black on in the litter!) is exactly the same!!! I thought Sabe had grown out of them...but i guess last night was a 'newish' experiance and so decided it was worth a shot with a tantie...lol. He is fine in the back yard...i can actually put him in a stay and work Bronx around him...or tie him up and work Bronx around him. Haven't tried a park as the only parks really near us and useable are dog parks...which i don't take my dogs to...lol. Chances are the pens won't be here and up by next Monday so it will either be my OH there to watch him, or the RT with me having the controller with me...lol. Or he may just decide the tantie didn't get him anyway before and behave - can't always tell with Sabe...lol. ETA - Thanks for that Sidoney - i might look further into the TnT idea - however it may have to wait until i have paid off the pens...lol - they ate up my 'Ebay allowance" for this month Edited August 14, 2007 by KitKat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueM Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 hiya KitKat I was their I heard what a racket, the instructors were concerned and I know they were getting the crappers over the noise, re the remote trainer would they let you use it at training ??? Maybe the OH is the best idea to keep him happy, it is good distraction training though having the hound from hell screaming in the background Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KitKat Posted August 14, 2007 Author Share Posted August 14, 2007 Hehehe John wasn't particularly worried...he said they'd had dogs there much worse then Sabe And i ran it past John about having the RT for next time and he was fine with it The Brat knows that the more distressed he sounds the more sympathy he is likely to get! Not from me...but from anyone else around! Bad mother i must be for my dog to be sounding that upset ;) Little toad that he is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueM Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 Oh it was the lady instructors that were concerned and getting the irrits Blardy shepherds ;) Harvey can have a piece of him next week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KitKat Posted August 14, 2007 Author Share Posted August 14, 2007 Harves is such a lil hunny!!! And did beautifully at training!!! I had warned the lady instructors that he was a Brat on previous occasions...but i don't think they believed me...i mean...Bronx is such a sweetie...and Sabe is his half brother after all...but they couldn't be more different! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddii Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 Hey Kit Kat, I was there with CK in your class last night - the idiot BC who wouldn't stop staring at you/your boy - have to keep working on that before he gets himself out of his depth! Hopefully the little op he's having today will fix that. ;) For me it's pretty funny to read this post and relate to my situation. I put a similar one up the other week when my girl pulled a similar stunt while I had CK in a seperate class. It really annoyed/embarrassed me I have to say, but your boy last night didn't bother me at all - I think we are all so conscious of what our own are doing, but others don't seem to bother us. CK has done the same thing at flyball while Xena is working for about he last 8 weeks, but all of a sudden last week not a sound. (He is crated in the car because we can park almost on the field.) I wouldn't worry too much about it - your boy will stop when he realises he isn't going to get anything out of making the noise - might just take a while. See you next week. Cheers. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueM Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 Yeah great Kitkat now he has another admirer that wants to pick him up and nurse him ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SueM Posted August 14, 2007 Share Posted August 14, 2007 Maybe bring him a big mammoth bone for him to chew on after he has done his training and no he cant chew on Midgetguts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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