Sensitive Dogs?

[Jeff Jones]

I think sensitive is a human description that is too broad. Weak nerves would describe many dogs who we might think are sensitive.

[Cosmolo]

An aloof dog is not one i would describe as necesarily sensitive in the way the OP means. I would be interested in LP's and Jules responses to my last post.

Edited August 6, 2007 by Cosmolo

[leopuppy04]

LOL - Completely forgot about this thread Cosmo till you 'bumped' it!

I think in future i'm going to PM you with my thoughts and get you to start a thread - your questions were ones that I was trying to ask in a less-articulate way :p

they have weak nerves?

In the way that i'm thinking - no, I don't think so.... Just in terms of them being particularly 'sensitive' to their handler and their interpretation of their signals/ communication etc.

they didn't receive good socialisation to training during their critical period?

Sometimes I think yes, other times no. I guess at always "it depends on the circumstance and dog"

someone at some point has sensitised them to training by accident? (it would therefore not necesarily be the natural temperament of the dog)

Could be.... I think this is a definate possibility for some dogs

they don't have strong drives so they are too easy to 'knock out' of drive and appear sensitive?

I think this can be a key factor. They may have the 'drive' to do it, but not strong enough to overcome a mild 'correction' whether it was intended or not . On the other side of the scale, there are dogs that are SO driven, you could correct till blue in the face and the dog couldn't care less as the 'wrong' thing is far more rewarding

If anything - this thread has pointed out that there are multiple types of 'sensitive' dogs. For instance, I consider Leo to be a 'sensitive' dog. He is an extremely confident dog and in any 'regular' circumstance, not much phases him. I also don't think i've sensitised him to anything in particular during training. He is also a confident, happy and driven worker..... but as soon as he is 'uncertain' in anything his drive plummets and enthusiasm curbs a little. To me it is part 'concentration' (no one can keep up enthusiasm and drive while they are 'thinking' through something new) as when he 'knows' what he is doing, he is back to the eager, confident worker. But, change the circumstance a little and I have to be very careful.

He is also very 'sensitive' to changes in signals etc.... if I change it a little, he may do it 'correctly' but perhaps a little uncertain as he is not sure and doesn't want to make fault.

He is 'sensitive' to my moods. If I *ever* should decide to train in the wrong mood, I will get NOTHING out of him...... If I correct to harshly or wrongly misinterpret 'obnoxious behaviour' instead of 'uncertainty' we'll end up further behind in our training than when we started .... If I am particularly nervous, he can be a bit 'worried' too......

so sure - most of these are probably 'training/ handler errors', but some dogs can ride through those and the handler won't even know they are giving their dogs 10 different signals for 'sit'

Then of course you have the truly 'sensitive' dogs who are sensitive by nature and anything 'out of place' can make them a little nervy....... these dogs to me is probably more 'genetic' or lack of social as a youngster...... sometimes, it is just them.

Is this the dog themselves or is this what they have learned will work to not get them into trouble?

Funny you mention that - I wonder how many dogs have realised that 'cowering' has resulted in the punishment being a little 'kinder'???

Are dogs naturally sensitive? Or do we teach them that certain behaviours (that we think are sensitive) work to get what they want?

Hmm - I do think that there *are* dogs that are naturally sensitive fo sure. I do think that there are dogs sensitive to a 'correction' and can send your training backward.....

Interesting....

As for aloof - that is a *completely* different ball game IMO......

[Lablover]

I like sensitive dogs. Soft on the other hand - can be on someone else's couch.

A couple of dog friends dropped in today and we naturally discussd training. I mentioned I thought my dogs were sensitive. My friends laughed. Rather hysterically in fact.

As per usual, my terminology is very different - related to retriever trial/training lingo.

[JulesP]

I'll have a go to answer Cosmolo.

What is sensitivity in a dog? Does it mean that:

they have weak nerves?

- Don't think that it is necessarily the same thing. Brock is happy to keep going in any condition and once working stays focussed on me. Think a dog with 'weak nerves' would chuck the towel in during yucky weather etc.

they didn't receive good socialisation to training during their critical period?

- IMHO, if it a genetic/natural instinct then socialisation can only minimise it not totally change it. Expose to bad things has certainly had a negative impact on Brock so very careful socialisation is needed. I have found that doing stacks of aggressive proofing stuff doesn't make them better but gets them more freaked out. I avoid those classes were they do heaps of weird stuff. Some might call that weak nerves?

someone at some point has sensitised them to training by accident? (it would therefore not necesarily be the natural temperament of the dog)

- Think the dog would need to be sensitive in the first place. could definately make them worse though.

they don't have strong drives so they are too easy to 'knock out' of drive and appear sensitive?

- Brock has a pretty strong pack drive, pretty much stays in it regardless. People expect the strong prey drive because of his breed but that is pretty low. So if you didn't realise this and tried to use a toy or something then you would definately think he was low in drive. I get good recalls!

A few posters talk about appeasement behaviour occurring in their 'sensitive' dogs. Is this the dog themselves or is this what they have learned will work to not get them into trouble? Are dogs naturally sensitive? Or do we teach them that certain behaviours (that we think are sensitive) work to get what they want? Sensitivity to a correction varies from dog to dog but can also be taught to any dog. The dog who is strctly hands off for training- is that sensitive or a lack of manual handling/ socialisation to handling and touch?

- With both my last 2 borders the appeasement behaviour was defiantely natural as neither really do naughty things so I have never really told them off. If they do something I don't like then cowering doesn't get them anywhere anyhow! They are both total goody twoshoes though. But I guess I do enforce the pack rules of them showing polite behaviour (not knocking me over, rushing past, polite eating, staying on beds etc).

The main trouble I am having is in class when someone else tells their dog off. Poor Brock freaks out. This happened during the stand for exam last week. The person next to me told their dog off, Brock just drooped and flopped to the ground. Once he has decided he is in trouble it takes a bit to convince him otherwise. Can also work the other way, if someone is reinforcing their dog during stays, I don't need to reinforce Brock!