Obedience Classes

[Reddii]

When it comes to training our two dogs are basically mine, but I want OH to be able to handle them too. At the moment I have done all our 12 month old BC's training - basic obedience, now agility and flyball. For me she's pretty solid, although if OH and the pup are around I have to work pretty hard to keep her attention on me, but manage to do it with her off lead.

In the last couple of weeks we've begun going to a new obedience club with both dogs. We decided I'd manage CK, the seven month old bag of trouble and he is going really well in the level 2 class, while Xena (12 month old) is in level 1 with OH because she isn't quite as experienced handling the dogs.

The problem we have is that Xena in the L1 class is bored and cries and looks for me every time she is not doing something. Week 1 she wouldn't work for OH at all, week 2 she did work, but still made heaps of noise and looked for me at every opportunity.

Unfortunately the only feedback OH got from the trainer was dirty looks - not too helpful. I've suggested that given OH reckons she is across everything they are covering in the L1 class that she could be doing things (targetting/down/turn etc) to keep Miss X occupied during 'down' times. (OH has done a bit of training, just not confident, but not a complete novice.)

Does anyone else have any thoughts about how we can handle this one. I'm not keen to swap dogs back as Xena does do agility and flyball with me and to swap now would be to give in - not a trend I'm happy to start.

Edited June 18, 2007 by Reddii

[Reddii]

anyone?

[poodlefan]

My honest advice?

You take both dogs to obedience, OH watches. You help OH with training them at home. Most dogs profit from having one consistent handler. It's not fun for a handler who lacks confidence to be trying to train a dog that simply doesn't want to be with them.

Option 2 OH takes over all feeding, walking duties etc to assist with creating stronger bond with dogs. OH takes Xena to a class when you are elsewhere.

If I were the instructor of a multidog class, I'd probably be a bit peeved too. I've politely suggested to more than a couple of handlers that the dog isn't profiting from spending the entire lesson trying to get to another family member who is watching from the sidelines. Either take over or make yourself scarce.

Why can't OH learn to handle both dogs at home? Far easier for a Novice handler to give and reward cues on a trained dog than to try to train it, especially if it's highly distracted.

Edited June 15, 2007 by poodlefan

[ness]

I am a bit confused. Is all that you want that both dogs will obey each of the handlers in a very informal sense as being good family pets or are you intending to trial ? If its for the benefit of the first then I agree with poodlefan in that OH watch at training and practice at home. That way you can take them both to the park and set it up so that OH can work Miss X but without the downtime associated with class training. I find BCs because they pick up on everything so quickly do final class pretty boring and get bored quickly. If you work at a park by yourself then you can also work at how long you expect X to work with your OH. Maybe your OH can even have a cue where X is allowed to go find you - but I would only recommend this once OH has X working for a reward.

At the begining the amount of things X will do before looking for you and the pup might be not very much but you can build up to it. Have you tried playing the recall game between the two of you - that involves leaving one and going to the other when they call.

From my observation some dogs work best when the person they are trying to hunt for is actually visible rather than hiding whereas others work best when they are completely hidden. Again is a matter of finding what works.

Not sure if any of that helps at all.

Edited June 15, 2007 by ness

[Reddii]

Thanks for the replies.

The problem we have on Monday night is that both dogs are in different classes at the same time, hence OH handling Xena. So, it's not like I'm sitting on the side line watching, I'm 2 football fields away working with CK. If I was to handle both dogs the only option would be to take them week and week about - not recommended by the club people.

We have done retstrained recalls - initally Xena would not leave me and go to OH, now she will do it quite happily.

We are doing this with a view to trialling the dogs, not just in an informal sense. Around the house both dogs will do as they are told (more or less) for both of us, it's only at obedience club that we strike the problem.

PF - agree with you, I'd be a bit peeved if I was the instructor. But as you said, you've politely suggested that they look at other options - dirty looks don't help anyone - if we could discuss the problem I'd be really happy. We don't have an ego issue in terms of 'this is what is right for my dog' and are both quite new to the dog world so are quite happy to listen to those with more experience, but don't always know the questions to ask.

Monday just gone there was a small improvement, but I think I'll have a chat to the instructors and see what they recommend. May just be that we do have to swap dogs.

Cheers.

ETA - Xena will work for me - her entire flyball and agility lessons are off lead, we constantly get comments from both dog and non-dog people how good she is for a dog of her age with me and is almost as good with OH when I am not around. Just this obedience club thing that has us stumped.

Edited June 15, 2007 by Reddii

[ness]

Alright if your looking at trialling my answer would be train whichever dog you wish to trial. Don't confuse the dogs while they are learning and if when they are fully competent you wish to work the other persons dog then give it a shot then. If however they are a bit like mine you might find they just won't work for anybody else (or only a select few). Mum handled Ness in obedience class about 3 years after I had trained and she already had her CD title. Ness will happily work for mum when I am there but not at the standard I like - hence she isn't doing it anymore. If it were me and my aim was trialling I would want to work with the dog and me only so they didn't learn any bad habits from the other party (although they can differentiate) its just better if they don't.

[Reddii]

Alright if your looking at trialling my answer would be train whichever dog you wish to trial. Don't confuse the dogs while they are learning and if when they are fully competent you wish to work the other persons dog then give it a shot then. If however they are a bit like mine you might find they just won't work for anybody else (or only a select few). Mum handled Ness in obedience class about 3 years after I had trained and she already had her CD title. Ness will happily work for mum when I am there but not at the standard I like - hence she isn't doing it anymore. If it were me and my aim was trialling I would want to work with the dog and me only so they didn't learn any bad habits from the other party (although they can differentiate) its just better if they don't.

mmmm......thanks Ness, not what I wanted to hear, but what I kind of suspected might be the case. Looks like we have some decisions to make.

Cheers.

Tony

[Kavik]

You have options depending on what you want to do. I agree with the others if you want to trial, best to stick to one handler. If you want both people to be able to handle for a pet situation, then you can have OH handle, but I would suggest at least in the beginning to have only one person in class. (ie at the start, have only OH there to make it easier and less distractions, until the dog is working well for them.

You can either alternate dogs - one dog this week, the other dog next week. Or (at least if you want to train them both yourself on the same night) you can take both and train half the lesson each. I have done this with Diesel and Kaos. It requires an understanding club and quick thinking but it can be done. Quite a few people at my club bring more than one dog and swap half way through or similar.

I have also instructed classes where there are two people from the same family, and it is difficult when all they want to do is get to the other person/dog. I have even had them swap dogs half way through the lesson!

[Mystiqview]

I would get your OH to start training the dog at home when you are not present. Like others said. get him to start taking over the general maintenance of the dog (feed/bath etc).

what you may have to do is this week, you OH goes to class with dog (you may have to stay home to start with).. then the following week, you go to class with your dog. You may have to do this for a few weeks. Let the dog get used to the distractions at classes with your Oh without adding the worst distraction (YOU) there as well.. Once the dog is comfortable with OH and general class distractions, you can both then start going together again.

[Reddii]

I would get your OH to start training the dog at home when you are not present. Like others said. get him to start taking over the general maintenance of the dog (feed/bath etc).

what you may have to do is this week, you OH goes to class with dog (you may have to stay home to start with).. then the following week, you go to class with your dog. You may have to do this for a few weeks. Let the dog get used to the distractions at classes with your Oh without adding the worst distraction (YOU) there as well.. Once the dog is comfortable with OH and general class distractions, you can both then start going together again.

That would be ideal and if we could do it then there would be no problem - Xena will work for OH when I'm not there. Problem is that I take our other pup who is the one who we really want at obedience at this stage as Xena is getting two other nights training at agility and flyball. CK is quite a strong willed boy, physically strong and quite exciteable because of the isolation he's had during the previous month or so which is why I have him. (he's the boy going to see Rowan K atm.) OH isn't strong enough or confident enough with him - Xena is quite submissive and is easy to handle, except for the whining.

Seems there is not an easy answer to this one - I'll have a chat to the club trainers and see what they suggest - will update on Tuesday. Thanks everyone for taking the time to have a look at this.

[Reddii]

Thanks again to all for your replies. OH and I had a very honest chat this morning after last night's training or lack of - Xena topped her previous efforts with a supreme

She isn't really interested in having anything more than a dog who will come and sit when she asks. ie: her heart isn't really in formal classes or trialling ever.

So, to ease the pain on all involved and continue the progress of both our dogs I'll continue to take CK and get him through the level 2 class. At this point I'll be able to start taking Xena to level 2 and CK to level 3 as they are at different times.

Once they are both level 3 (which should be fairly quick once CK gets there and she is back at training as I'm pretty confident Xena could cope with that now) I'll just have to take them week and week about, unless the club is happy for them to go halves in a lesson. I'm not really a fan of that, but we'll have to work out what is best.

So for now poor Xena will only get flyball and agility, plus frisbee once a month or so on the weekends!!

I still really hate it when I don't get my own way, but that's what I love about dogs - they teach you humility and patience.

Cheers.

Tony

[BC]

I have the same problem. My OH is not really into the training of the dogs, thats all me, and 1 is trialling and 1 is in level 2.

I am a member of 2 clubs, one trains at 1 club on Saturdays doing ring practise and the other trains in level 2 on Sundays at the other club.

I also do private lessons on Fridays with the 1 i am trialling. I found this is the easiest to avoid conflicting class times.