Zorro_007

I am 100% CONFIDENT that a properly immunised adult dog will not catch parvo. I do make a point of demanding to see the sticker that comes with the vial of vaccine, that sticker has an expiry date yet not many vets make a habit of removing this sticker and attaching it to the vaccination certificate which by rights THEY SHOULD!!!! I have heard of many a vet using vaccine that has expired, some make a point of buying expired vaccine for a pittance and yet charge the same exorbitant amount to unsuspecting dog owners!!! I would like to know the details of how a fully immunised dog that has had its puppy shots at the right stage of its life, that is when maternal antibodies are not floating around so the vaccine is not neutralised...and a booster 12 months later can catch parvo??? something is amiss here and there has got to be an explanation for this!!! I have had adult dogs that have been vaccinated as pups and a booster 12 mths later and then no more shots and 5 years down the track they found themselves in a parvo infected environment, thanks to a bastard of a neighbour with his parvo-infected dobe crapping in my front yard, and yet none and that is not a single dog (12 dogs at the time) caught parvo!!! Unfortunately I lost an entire litter of puppies to parvo. This ****hole of a neighbour knew that his doberman had parvo and still allowed him to crap around the area!!! CAZBEAR - a dog can indeed catch parvo even if it is not walked on the ground...it seems you are missing a fundamental point here and that is that parvo infects the environment so if a pup is at risk of catching it from walking onto the infected ground then you are going to be picking it up from the soles of your shoes and walking it back home and that is how a dog can then catch it, from the supposedly safe haven of his own home because you walked parvo back home so carrying a dog is not safe...you have been lucky in that there was obviously no parvo to be caught in the 1st place. WARLEY - well well, you have taken a fair few gambles and came out a winner, wouldn't it be wonderful if everyone was so lucky, lol?!! Parvo is not an imaginary disease, it's very real and just because your dogs escaped it doesn't go to say that every inch of our planet is free of parvo, don't take such a nonchalant attitude, you are playing russian roulette! HAVEN - where there is a will there is a way and it is possible to socialise a pup without running the risk that it's going to end up dead and a very painful and agonising death at that too, what good is a well socialised dead pup??

To all that have posted here so far that have had dogs having seizures, I wanted to ask if you had your dog/s immunised on a yearly basis?

GS, as soon as I read your post I thought of a condition called "MEGA-ESOPHAGUS" which is prevalent in the GS breed but is also known to affect other breeds. This is usually a narrowing of the esophagus which makes the passage of solid food difficult due to damaged esophagus tissue (scar tissue), another possible reason is damaged nerves that do not function adequately in pumping food down which can cause a pouch to form and food will lodge there for a few secs only to come back up again; in puppies this tends to be congenital but it does develop occasionally in adult dogs, constant vomiting can cause this problem to develop that is why trying to alleviate the vomiting as a matter of urgency is very important. My parents have a standard fox terrier which had contracted parvo as a pup and was hospitalised, obviously they gave him antibiotics which caused scar tissue to form on his esophagus and once he came home he was unable to keep his food down...we didn't know what was wrong and he was taken back for tests and he was diagnosed with this condition, the vets didn't offer any explanation as to why he SUDDENLY developed this problem and said that perhaps it was genetic...I had difficulty believing that 'excuse' as he ate plenty as a pup, all kinds of things and NEVER once vomited...the vomiting started upon being discharged from the vets after beating parvo...I researched and researched and came across information that stipulated that some antibiotics (esp. vibravet) can cause scar tissue if they lodge for a period of time in the esophagus which I believe is the case with the fox terrier. I am not saying that antibiotics are the cause with your GS and I hope that I am way off altogether but I felt compelled to mention this. Suffice to say that the Fox terrier (Johnny) is thriving as mum soaks up the dry food and then mashes it and feeds it in small amounts at a time and he doesn't bring the food up...she tried to give him a chicken wing which she regularly supplies for the other dog and he gave it one munch and brought it back up immediately. Perhaps it would be worth mentioning this probability to your vet... Here are a couple of links that you may find informative...the 1st link shows a diagram of a dog and you just click onto the food bowl and drag it up into the dog's mouth and it shows how it settles into the stomach without a problem and the 2nd diagram shows a dog affected with mega-esophagus and you click on food bowl and drag to dog's mouth and it shows how the food seems to lodge into this pouch only to come back up again almost immediately. I wish you luck and I really hope that it's just a case of the wrong food being fed. http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_megaesophagus.html http://www.dogstuff.info/digestive_tract_disorders.html

There is the high possibility that her fitting is due to her being vaccinated and even once vaccination seizes this still persists for a few months AFTER the next shot is due, that is 12 months down the track when you would be supposedly due for a booster and the dog is not given a booster the fits will still continue until they slowly but surely subside until no more fits. I have been through this so I am speaking from personal experience and going out with a vet for some time, and being the kind of vet that liked to do his research was quite an educational time for me. Another reason that small dogs are prone to fitting is due to hypoglycemia, in other words 'low blood sugar' so hence feeding 3-4 small meals per day will ensure that the fitting will stop providing this is the cause. Did you vaccinate her recently? in other words, has she had her 2nd booster? do a search on 'side effects of overvaccinating a dog' and you will see what the repercussions are to give a dog a booster for every year of a dog's life....MAJOR NO NO and the americans refuse to do this, pitty that vets here are either incredulous to the risks or simply do not know any better or worse still they don't want to lose their wallets getting fatter and fatter because not only do they make top money with vaccinating dogs every year but then dogs get sicker with auto immune problems just to name one and there's more money coming in, the vet just cannot lose.

Thanks Hesapandabear but it looks like I am forced to have to choose another product as I live in the country and it would be a 400 kilometre round trip to go to Keilor Park and with the price of petrol these days it would end up being quite an expensive exercise as it would cost me an extra 160-180 dollars for petrol as it cost me $80 for a trip of 400 kms but then I am left on an empty tank so I have to fill up again. Such is life....how is it that noone else has caught on with Nutro?

Wow thanks. Apparently it isn't all that easy to find Nutro, I did an online search and found only a couple of places where that can be obtained from in melbourne. I guess I will try to pm 'Hesapandabear' and hopefully she may be of further help. I have heard of Nutrience and know that is is made up of herbs as well which sounds good so if Nutro becomes an impossibility to find then I may give Nutrience a shot.

nynka, yes I know that some cases of localised DM clears on its own accord providing that the dog is on a nutritious diet and given immune boosters but generalised DM is much harder to treat and usually doesn't clear up on its own albeit I helped a friend's japanese chin which had generalised DM, I took her in and looked after her for 4 months and her condition cleared and it's been well over 12 months and there is no sign of it nowadays. I tried taking that path with Luna and it's been 2 months now...I have tried everything from a BARF diet supplemented with fish oil, Vit. E, Vit. B & C, Evening Primrose Oil, etc etc but her condition has deteriorated so I really can't let it go on at the rate that it is going. I think that once the mites invade the body to this extent they have to be destroyed and although a nutritious diet will help to strengthen her immune system to a degree (providing that her condition has been caused by neglect from her previous owners) but if there is an underlying health reason as to why the mites have multiplied then drastic measures have to be taken besides which I would like to get to the bottom of things and have a total blood panel carried out to see whether she does have a health problem and try to resolve that problem but according to the vet she doesn't seem to think that Luna has any underlying health problems and has recommended we start with the Ivomec and not to worry about any underlying problems. Since the condition hasnt cleared the natural way then Ivomec is my only choice. I honestly can't wait for Luna to grow her coat and start looking normal again, she really is a great specimen for her breed although at the moment she looks moth eaten, poor girl...she has the most beautiful amber eyes with black eyeliner.

I am a big fan of BARF and feed all of my 16 dogs on this but I was wanting to introduce a good premium dog food to my maremma sheepdog (the one with generalised demodectic mange)...she would be fed this premium dog food combined with the BARF. I used to feed Proplan once upon a time and it was okay but the amount of poo was unbelievable, not to mention the smell whereas with the BARF diet there isn't any odour. I was after one that is not loaded with cereal and corn disguised in various ways and I also prefer one with Vit. E as a preservative rather than ethoxyquin, BHA, BHT. I have heard of glowing reports from people feeding a premium diet and I do have to admit that I am sceptical but am willing to give it a shot and find out for myself. I would especially like to hear from those that have used INNOVA, CALIFORNIA NATURAL and NUTRO and where I can get these foods and whether you have noticed a definite improvement in your dog/s after introducing this kibble. Any other brands or suggestions would be appreciated; except for IAMS or EUKANUBA...for starters none of my dogs liked it when I introduced them to this brand and most importantly I don't want to pay for a product that is known to have conducted some hideous experiments on animals.

Hi Tangerine, I have heard of Ectodex which is basically amitraz and I am too scared to use this product as I have heard of a few dogs dying because of it. Thanks for the suggestion though. I have introduced the Ivomec in low doses and so far so good so I'll stick it out although I did some more research on ivermectin's side effects and I was disheartened but there isn't much else that can be done.

My puppy has just started Puppy School and we were givien the same information as Lily, only he said it was Ok to take them to the park as long as you pick them up when other dogs come over and ask owners if their dog is vacinated and friendly before allowing them to sniff each other (I don't put her down). Also not to allow them any where near Dog poo as that carrries the Parvo virus (hard at a dog park but most people at our local one are very responsible). I just tend to carry her around with me when their are other dogs in the park, I have an older Dog who loves it there and I will be taking them there everyday so the teacher said is best to get her used to the sounds and the people now. WRONG ADVICE There is absolutely no point in picking up a dog when you see another approach UNLESS you feel that the approaching dog is about to maul your dog. Parvo is not just transmitted by dogs sniffing or greeting each other, parvo is transmitted through the feaces of infected dogs and I can't imagine a dog walking around with a piece of its own turd dangling from its mouth If an infected dog has eliminated in a public park it is highly likely that the area is contaminated and hence other dogs and people will be walking the virus all around and your own shoes are likely to be infected and in turn you will be walking the virus back home. I can't believe that a vet would suggest that you ask other dog owners whether their dog is vaccinated Do you actually expect people to openly admit that their dog is not vaccinated? besides which just because a dog is not vaccinated doesn't go to say that it is harboring the virus and this raises another important point - there is no need to vaccinate a dog every year for the rest of its life...this is overvaccinating and this causes auto-immune problems eventually...if a dog has had its puppy shots and a booster 12 mths later it is protected for life against parvo, hepatitis and distemper and I can guarantee that.

The mites that cause demodectic mange burrow deep into the hair follicle and that is why most products don't penetrate deep enough to kill them but, for discussion sake, even if garlic did work (which it doesn't) I wouldn't and couldn't use it, the smell of raw garlic would be enough to make me violently ill . Luna is on vitamins, fish oil and oral ivermectin and I have to start her on 3ml of ivermectin daily for 3 days and increase the dosage every 3 days till she's on the full dosage for her weight. She is moulting like nothing I have ever seen before but hopefully she should be on the mend soon enough. Rappie, the vet did suggest using Advocate but the success rate is not that great with generalised DM as you said yourself. So as much as I hate doing this to her I don't have any other choice but to stick with the oral ivermectin which she hates herself because of its bitter taste.

Thank you all for your input. I have taken Luna to see another vet and a skin scraping was carried out and she does have DM which I knew anyway. She is now on oral ivermectin; I was hoping that there would be another way but obviously there isn't. I was advised to use advocate but this is a much slower way to treat this condition and Luna is not looking too good so I have decided that this is the best way; meanwhile she is fed a BARF diet and is on fish oil and vitamins, fingers crossed for the poor girl. I will post a photo of her soon.

Personally I don't believe in feeding raw fish to dogs; Raw fish contains an enzyme that breaks down Vitamin B2, so feeding too much raw fish to your dog can result in a Vit. B2 deficiency. Fish makes a healthy meal as long as it is cooked and providing it doesn't contain any bones. Stick to your normal routine of feeding him tinned fish, great for his skin.

Brookie, glad to hear that your little girl is almost back to her old self I shudder to think how she may have been treated, she should not have been so depressed simply because of a clip and there was no need for them to shave her if she only had one or two knots in her coat and the fact that another poor dog died in the hands of that same vet is quite a concern, I wonder if he may have been over generous with the sedatives? I find it strange that a dog will die from shock and clipper burn? I would be suing that vet if I was the owner of that poor dog! It would be worth your while to invest in a good pair of clippers and learn to clip her yourself, there really isn't too much to it and if you exercise some common sense then you shouldn't be running into any problems.

Daisy, so sorry that poor Bree is so sick. It sounds like a severe case of gastroenteritis which could have been brought on by a variety of ailments from salmonella poisoning to actual ingestion of some poison or a bacteria, there is also the risk that this could be 'corona virus' given that there is this apparent outbreak of parvo in your area. I wanted to point out a few reasons why dogs get severe diarrhea and vomiting but out of all the reasons why this is I can't help but feel that your girl has giardia. This is brought on by drinking infected water or food. There are a few products that treat giardia, one is FLAGYL but apparently this treats only certain types of giardia; METRONIDAZOLE is another effective way to treat this; PANACUR is another. The least that your vet could have done would have been to give her some fluid subcutaneously rather than just giving her some antibiotics which may not even be the right antibiotics for her ailment; by rights she should be on IV fluids at the vets! I would ask for some FLAGYL and treat her with this at the same time rather than just wasting time on a 'wait and see' game. Sounds like your vet has his hands full at the moment but that is no reason to let your girl fall by the wayside. She sounds pretty bad and I'm afraid that if she doesn't receive more care you may lose her. Good luck.

HI cavNrott, Yep...reread the post and I understand it better now, lol. Dr. Nicole Hoskins sounds like a dream....I have yet to find such a vet and unfortunately she is about 200 kms too far! Such is life...

I am a big fan of RAW but I am concerned with feeding bones to dogs with a short snout as they lack the capability to chew raw bones as efficiently as dogs with a muzzle, I won't generalise as I don't doubt that there would be a fair few pugs out there that can manage a chicken wing or neck quite successfully but nevertheless I would be watching such breeds very, very carefully. You can still feed RAW without the wings or necks, chicken pet mince purchased from a chicken place where they sell chicken pieces to the public is good as it has grounded bone that is so fine that it wouldn't cause a problem for your bulldog, you could add cooked rice and vegs to this; a couple of boiled eggs a week, a fish oil (not cod liver oil...can be toxic) capsule 3x weekly and Bob's your uncle, lol. Kelp is also rich in mineral and vitamins. The only dry food that I recommend is either California Natural or Innova, they use human grade ingredients and although these products are rather expensive, being an ultra premium food you would need to feed considerably less than other foods. For those that have only the one or two dogs I wouldn't be looking past these brands.

I have adopted a maremma sheepdog (I already had a maremma of my own) from my neighbours, they only had her for a couple of months and one morning I received a call from the wife saying that I was welcome to go and pick her up otherwise her husband was going to shoot her with his .22 magnum rifle. She is a beautiful dog and I just couldn't sit back and let this happen so off I went. Anyway, the reason that they wanted to shoot her is because she has demodectic mange and they couldn't be bothered with her. Now I know that DM could have an underlying health problem as all dogs are known to carry this mite but a healthy immune system keeps the numbers to a minimum; it's when the immune system is compromised that the mites get out of control...now I have taken her to the vet and I was recommended IVERMECTIN by mouth and I have to say that I am a little concerned about this as some dogs can have a reaction to ivermectin not only shelties, collies, etc. but also that this can be toxic and weaken an already weakened immune system so I was wondering if anyone has had any success using other methods. I would like to hear from anyone even those that have used ivermectin, I would like to hear of your experiences with this nightmare! My next port of call will be to have her blood-tested to see if there is an underlying problem but there doesn't seem to be all that much of a choice in what one can do to treat this.

Hi monsterpup, I am a little confused with your post, lol. You said that Dr. Hoskins was the only doctor that would do a titer test for you but then you proceed to say that if someone DOES NOT want to hear about the side effects of OVERVACCINATING then she is the one to go for So does Dr. Hoskins recommend yearly vaccinations or not? lol. Vets that are honest enough to admit that overvaccinating is a real risk are very few and far between and the day that I will find a vet that will proceed to explain the risks of a yearly jab is the day that I will be screaming his/her name from a mountain top but so far no such luck!!!!!!! I can't help but be of the impression that the majority are nonetheless too greedy to admit this .

I think it is obvious why some vets would disapprove of BARF seeing that the majority of them stock premium foods namely Iams and Waltham Also, when in the short or long run dogs start to show health problems due to diet yet owners are none the wiser that diet is the cause, it's more money for vets to try and rectify the problem for instance skin problems amongst other things and one of the greatest money spinners as most vets don't seem to try and decipher why the dog is having skin problems but instead choose to prescribe a course of NSAID's plus antibiotics knowing only too well that once treatment is stopped the symptoms come back worse than ever, not to mention that NSAID's have nasty side effects...and don't resolve the problem!! There are always exceptions to the rule and there are some absolutely wonderful and considerate vets out there that try to do the right thing by our pets but as I said they are the exception.

1stly I am curious as to why Cordy should be considered an authority in this issue....how would she know for sure that some puppies are born without maternal antibodies??...I can understand that in her line of work she may have witnessed the loss of puppies due to parvo but it goes without saying that the puppies in question would not have been titre tested so how can she make such stipulations? My belief and, as I said earlier, those of a fair few vets, is that those maternal antibodies are present only in very small numbers, nowhere near enough to combat parvo but still able to neutralise a vaccine. I was told by the vaccinate manufacturers that Protech Duramune is one of a couple of vaccines that is able to override maternal antibodies. It goes without saying that a live vaccine would be stronger than a killed vaccine hence more efficient. If a dog is going to have a reaction to a vaccine it will happen no matter whether it is killed or live, you will find that the reaction is due to other additives that are added not the virus in itself.

Steve, Of course there are variables as to the age that puppies still carry maternal antibodies, there are variables also between litters and I think this boils down to the dam, her vaccination protocol, vaccine used, etc. (not sure if that is what you mean?) some puppies do carry maternal antibodies for longer periods of time but there is a vaccine that is able to override a small amount of maternal antibodies and that is why I insist on a live vaccine, I am partial to Protech Duramune....although I still think that 6 weeks is far too young to start vaccinating. From what I have been told, the higher percentage of puppies are antibodies free if you like, by the age of 9 weeks so this would be the optimum age to start vaccinating; this doesn't apply to rotties and dobes and I don't know the answer to that and the vets don't have an answer to this either. What breed of dogs are you into?

I don't know- is horse meat less nutritious than cow, pig, lamb kangaroo, chicken etc? As far as I know its important that dogs get to eat sinews and tendons and offal etc- its part of a biologically appropriate diet. Dog food isn't meant to sound appetising to us humans but in their natural state animals eat and thrive off all that yucky stuff and they dont waste a single bit of a carcass :rolleyes: Nope, not putting words in your mouth....I am referring to the above post where you are mentioning that dog food isn't meant to sound appetising for us humans and that is true enough, that would apply to a barf diet too since it is recommended that a biologically appropriate diet for dogs should consists of raw meats but the difference between a barf diet and commercial dog food is the preservatives and hence that is what I meant when I joked that should dog food contain noxious and carcinogenic additives and preservatives to be biologically appropriate for dogs since you made it sound that it's okay if all those ingredients that Lillysmum quoted are used for dog foods.

O'rens - that is a good point but it's called BUSINESS and PROFIT....they would much rather spend money on advertising because ultimately it brings in the cash, as much as they may spend millions on this they must be getting trillions in return otherwise they wouldn't keep on doing this. It's all about the money...I can just hear them "BRING ME THE MONEY....!!"