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So sorry to hear about Lane Wyvernblade - poor boy Hoping you get some news about him soon and that he'll be okay :D

Thanks Steve - done! :p

Does anyone have any recommendation for the West side of Melbourne/Geelong for trainers/dog schools who do drive training?

Touche Shekhina! I'm in Western Vic (about 1:20 West of Geelong) currently drive over an hour to present club, new one is 45 mins away. I'm happy to do the distance if its worth it. Its hard when your instructor is competing at a level that I'd like to get to, probably got umpteem training certs under their belt, yet to say to them in the middle of a class "thats not the way I want my dog treated/trained", especially when you're as green as me But after I seen a check applied to a dog (twice) that I wouldn't ever consider using on my 600 kg horse, let alone my dog, I know I need to look further afield. Maybe a regular lesson is a possibility, something I hadn't thought about. If anyone has any recommendations at all, happy to drive to Melbourne and surrounds if I have to. Just not something I can do every weekend. Thanks everyone for your suggestions and help so far

LOL! Darcy was doing that at 8 weeks and I trained her out of it! Bugger!

I have a young dog that I would like to do obedience and then agility further down the track. My aim with the obedience is to have a reliable dog in all situations. I'd like to think she'll be good enough to do well in both. She's my first ever dog thats been mine to train. Grown up with dogs (both working and pet) but they weren't mine. I have a lot to learn about obedience (having never really seen it in action at a high level) which is why she's been to PPS, puppy school and now obedience. Missed one class in that whole time. I'm keen to learn. She's a beautiful natured dog, wants to meet everyone (dogs and humans) and I'm starting to see it affect her learning/focus etc at class. I.e today I made the mistake of letting her play with another dog for a few minutes and it then took me over half the class to get her attention back. When I get her attention she works really quite nicely. By herself - she's great! Add in distractions and she can be a sh*t! My problem is that I'm starting to see obedience class as a double edged sword. On one hand I need to learn, she needs to learn, the distractions are probably a learning process. On the other hand, we have socialisation during class that ruins her focus for the rest of the class, people who insist on a pat/doggie play without asking and instructors feeding dogs treats. How do you say no without looking like a control freak/cow! Having been to the k9 workshop I'm keen on the idea of prey drive training, and having just sat down and read the prey & socialisation/neutralisation thread from start to finish (plus watched a lot of the "inspiration" videos) I can see the benefits but feel there's a conflict between dog club and prey drive training. I will be starting with a different club this coming weekend, mostly because its a fair bit closer. But I'm still confused! Given there are others on here who have done drive training, what do you do?

I've been using dried liver because I can stick it in my pocket and not make a mess..... however given Darcy couldn't give a stuff about the dried liver in class today, I'm thinking of switching to some kind of lunch meat type product. I'll be interested to see what everyone else uses....

There's actually a huge collection of video clips on the youtube.com website, just do a search for dog training and there's heaps of good ones (some pretty dodgy ones too) Keep an eye out for the sitmeansit.com ones - they are great - there's one there of a dog being trained in a off lead dog park, with dogs trying to jump on him and sniff him and he's so focused on the handler. Amazing!

Thanks for that Shekhina! Darcy's auto sit has just come as part of her training - cos she was such a little sh*t when I got her (thus the feralpup!) I made her sit for everything so its actually got to the stage that its become an answer for everything.... when in doubt, sit :D I'm now learning there's a flip side.... I also take her for walks on lead a lot and I've made her sit before she crosses the road since she was 8 weeks .... its kind of flowed on to the stage that I don't need to say a word as she knows that when I stop, she needs to sit, whether its crossing the road or not. Thanks again Jess

LOL yes know all about the lick to death thing..... also Darcy seems to think I have fleas as I get flea-d a lot while learning stands.... At this stage it's just a straight stand... Now the signal's left hand across in front of the face, and then extended down to the flank area as an extension while learning.... have I got that right?

We've just moved up from puppy class to class 2 at obedience, and we did some very very basic stand work in puppy class. I have to admit, never having seen the application of it I didn't really get what was required. I've now seen it once at class last week. Problem is Darcy's a wrigglebutt - touch her at all and she wriggles endlessly wanting to play. She really doesn't get the stand command at all. So she sits! So how do I teach her the stand from step 1.... I've been doing a bit of work at home just brushing her and encouraging her to stand still while being handled and brushed. Where do I go from here?

Thanks Lablover I appeciate it!

Completely agree Wyvernblade - we should have an "aspire to" post pinned to the top of the training forum for videos like this Lablover - can you please explain why you thought the heeling was choppy and the figure 8 was poor? Not to stir up a sh*tfight or anything I'm just interested to know why

Would like to give it a try - I wish we could get it in Vic Decided I will give Eagle Pack Natural a try - will see how we go on that one!

WOW!!! That's nice!!!! So good to see what "it" looks like at the top end.... I've not really been exposed to that level of training much at all so thanks myszka Keep them coming!

Hi Zaindria! No problems at all I was the same - grown up with dogs my whole life but Darcy's my first pup thats been mine to train and look after! I would recommend obedience training I took Darcy to puppy preschool at 12 weeks and we went through that, then puppy class and now class 2 obedience. Still not a "high" level but the comments I get on the street and even at obedience school about how well behaved she is tells me its well and truly paying off! I've learnt a hell of a lot from it - I don't agree with all the instructors there but I avoid those whose training methods I disagree with when I can and Darcy gets so excited when I let her in the car for Sunday Doggie School

Ah well............ we've all heard the saying "hell hath no fury like a women scorned"..... So what did you do Steve.....??? Touche workndog!

Hi Zaindria! What a cute puppy I had the same problem with my pup - I got her at 7.5 weeks off a lovely family with youngish children who'd roughed her and thought the biting and growling stuff was "cute". She had to learn from day dot that it wasn't acceptable. I got her out of it by pats and playtime rewards for good behaviour, and a warning "no teeth" in a low voice if she used her teeth at all. That was the only warning she got - if she persisted with using her teeth then play time was over and she got ignored completely for a short period of time. No exceptions - I had to be completely consistant 110% of the time. I also taught her to sit for everything from day 2 - she had to sit for a feed, sit for a pat etc so when she got a bit out of control I could use the sit as a distraction -give her something else to think about for ohhh 2 seconds but it seemed to work ok as part of the toolkit for good behaviour.... So when it comes to giving your pup a pat, she has to sit and stay sitting to receive one - if she gets up - pats stop until she puts her butt on the floor again! Check out the "Nothing in life is free" info which was really helpful to me.... http://k9deb.com/nilif.htm As children were part of Darcy's problem, I actually stopped her having any "play time" with children - they could pat her but it stopped there, and only if she was sitting nicely at the time. If your neice was playing with the puppy then maybe its a good idea to only let her play under strict supervision as kids don't learn to be consistant with dogs until they're a lot older. We have enough trouble with it as adults I reckon If the pup gets overexcited then maybe "sin-binning" or a short time-out will give her time to settle down might be an idea? I hope some of that is helpful.... I found it worked well on my pup (who's now 6 months old)! Good luck with Dizzy!

Are bones an issue with weight? I.e lamb leg bones, beef ribs etc with minimal meat on them?

No probs Labsrule I've got my own doggy weight problems with mine and she's only 1/2 lab!! Would've been nice if the kelpie 1/2 of her kept her thin but no such luck!

Hi labsrule! I've just been doing some nutrition reading myself.... found this: "A: Fiber in the diet is probably good for overall gastrointestinal health and may help some dogs keep their weight down. The diet of normal adult dogs should contain between 2.5 and 4.5 percent fiber. However, the fiber content of some "diet" dog foods is between nine and 10 percent. This may allow the dog to feel full without consuming too many calories for effective weight control. Diets high in fiber also may help in the management of hyperglycemia and the prevention of such disorders as diverticular diseases. On the other hand, too much fiber in the diet can decrease the digestibility of other important nutrients and result in loose stools, frequent defecation, and reduced palatability of the dog food. Generally, foods low in starch content, such as corn and wheat bran and barley products, are high in fiber. Conversely, dogfood ingredients high in starch, including rice and dried potatoes, have less fiber." Taken from: http://dels.nas.edu/banr/cd_dog_faq.html

Wow - thats nice!!! Well done!! How did you get the wave SM? Darcy can high 5 (she normally gives me a "10" instead - very funny!) but haven't tried shake paws at all and I'd prefer a wave to the shake!

Thanks Mooper - Echuca's on the border of NSW/Vic (Echuca - Moama) which is about 3.5 hour drive..... thats without piddle breaks :D Tullamarine is a bit closer so will keep my eyes peeled! Thanks!

Does anyone know of any herding days coming up in Western Vic or where I could find out..... would love to give Darcy a go on sheep but my parents are now retired from farming!

You're exactly right Mooper..... I've grown up with working dogs, and I don't ever recall any of them being given a food reward. They're bred to work, and they love it! My dad has a bitch that, if there were sheep around the house, would go out and round them up of her own accord. You let the 4 dogs off for a run, give it about 5 mins of "unsupervision" and you would end up with a mob of sheep at the gate of the yards behind the house. Thats what she loves to do! :D I guess with food training with agility, obedience etc.... when you work a dog with sheep or cattle then you don't really ask a lot - i.e bring me the mob of sheep/cattle, slowly without stirring them up, and don't leave any behind. The rest is instinct! We don't make demands on which rock the dog should jump over, or how long it should sit for at that thistle, or expect it to weave in and out of the fence posts while its at it! Yes you expect a little more of them when you take it to sheep trial level, but being able to do what they are bred to do is reward enough for most dogs! Placing a few extra demands on them isn't a big deal! OTOH - to compare to agility as an example, we expect them to do exactly as we want, nearly to the footstep and second. Wait here, make you step on the end of that ramp, make sure you go and out the right side of the weave poles etc. Plus dogs weren't bred to jump through tyres, run through tunnels or along balance ramps, and its not instinct for them to do so :D BTW not picking on agility here at all, just used it as an example