sandgrubber

please delete, posted twice . . . don't know what happened.

Spend a bit of time googling and you'll answer your own question . . . The Dogo originated as a fighting dog. See http://www.bulldoginformation.com/dogo-argentino.html The Presa has a reputation for killing people due to a few spectacular cases that got a lot of press, and there has been a worry about them gaining popularity among people wanting 'tough' dogs. see http://www.igorilla.com/gorilla/animal/200...sa_canario.html

If you take a dog from Australia to any place that has rabies (and perhaps a few places that don't have rabies, but have other diseases) you will have to put your dog in quarantine in Australia when you come back. It is very expensive and means you will have to be separated from your dog for at least a month. Not a comittment I would take on lightly.

I agree with Nancyk. When I go to a dog show I want to see the raw dog; not some cooked up creation built out of the dog. Ideally, I'd like an untrained handler to have a fair chance of winning. In my breed (Labradors) we don't do much consmetics . . . but I wonder how many white stars on the chest are removed with texta. If I'm making decisions relating to what to breed for, or what to breed toward, I only want to consider things that can be inherited. . . not what can be added on. If we are lenient about cosmetics, who knows, maybe we'll be getting bitches with tummy tucks showing up in veterans and contact lenses to improve eye colour. Or is that already happening?

It is possible to be ethical without being registered . . . eg, many great working dogs are not registered. As others have stated, it's also possible to be registered and not ethical. In my experience the BYB label is often thrown around by people who think everyone should be like them: commonly by people who believe you shouldn't breed if you don't show, or that you should only breed to preserve your line and not to produce litters for sale as pets. I would hope that people who aren't grinding an axe would use more neutral terms, such as 'unregistered breeder' . . . or describe the situation, eg., breeds but doesn't show, or owns a pretty average dog and a couple bitches and breeds them over and over. The puppy mill label is likewise a matter of opinion and degrees . . . and I'd . I recently toured a kennel where there were two girls in whelp and about to pop, and two girls with litters on the ground . . . I'd guess the owner goes over 10 litters a year. She doesn't show. But the kennels were clean, the dogs appeared friendly, happy and calm, she had three dogs just out of quarantine that she imported for stud purposes. She has her own humicrib. No question it's a business. But I'd say 'puppy mill' is harsh.

The Swiss still have very strong legislation on animal cruelty (including something like mandatory walkies). See, eg. http://www.animallaw.info/articles/ddusicacl.htm for international comparison of animal cruelty legislation. I'm not sure whether the referrendum overturned the animal advocates in Zurich or not . . .

I don't think you need to worry about Mollie's teats unless they are looking big, swollen, hard, painful and the ends are hot. Generally bitches are good about producing the amount of milk that is taken by the pup(s) and a singleton at one week isn't a big feed. If you are bottle feeding, or tube feeding, you need to do it around 4X daily. I can't advise you about quantities, but you should be able to find someone who can do so. I find tube feeding is easier than bottle feeding for really little guys . . . but you should get an expert to help you learn to do it. Would be much better to get the pup back to suckling. Good luck!

We don't know what the lab in the add looks like. The link shows one of a few possibilities . .. I would say a less likely possibility. Semi-brindles and black-and-tans are more common see the Wing-N-Wave pages on Lab colour genetics). Occasional spots, especially on the chest, are not at all rare (I'm told that a certain Gr Ch has a white star that is routinely corrected by dying). It is well established that brindle and black-and-tan mismarks can appear from Labs of excellent breeding. They are highly visible and automatic disqualifications, but I wouldn't say they are a disgrace. Cosmetic defects, in my book, are far less serious than health defects or defects of temperament. I have two brindle-type mismark Labs who stay in my boarding kennel. Both are well bred, but apart from unfortunate colouring, they're regular Labradors.

Looks like fish won't have lawyers in the future . . . but Switzerland will continue to be an interesting place to look for people interested in animal rights issues http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/...referendum.html http://' target="_blank"> Swiss voters reject lawyers for animals in referendum Swiss voters have overwhelmingly rejected a controversial plan to appoint lawyers for animals. By Alexandra Williams in Geneva Published: 12:33AM GMT 08 Mar 2010 All of the 26 Swiss cantons on Sunday voted against the proposal by animal rights activists to extend nationwide a system already in place in Zurich. Overall, just 29.5 per cent of voters were in favour. In seven cantons the "No" vote was more than 80 per cent.

The CDC site is down at the moment. Try this one instead: http://www.dogbitelaw.com/Dog%20Attacks%20...6%20Clifton.pdf number of dogs involved in killing or maiming a child or adult in Canada or the US 1982-2006: Score 1100+ for APBTs, 400+ for Rottis, 2 for beagles (but one was a child who got strangled in a game of tug), 1 for pugs, 2 for JRT's . Precisely my point. Relying on ambulance chasing lawyer sites and hate sites who themselves rely on information garnered from unscientific media reports such as the Clifton report achieves nothing. CDC are the epidemiological experts and are good enough for me. Remember too in the US AST, APBT and SBT are legally one and the same breed. Lack of compassion for the victims of small breeds continues to astound me. But those who believe in BSL, why not ban those breeds because they have killed in Australia or show up in attack stats here. For the same reason - they are unreliable. The UK introduced BSL and the RSPCA now admits dog attacks and APBTs are now more prevalent than ever. South Australia was the first state to introduce BSL and they've had to have an inquiry on the massive increase in dog attacks ( an indictment of the Dog and Cat Management Board and BSL). These results are replicated world wide. The science is well and truly in, BSL doesn't work. It is a way to control owners, not dogs, and it even fails to do that so will eventually encompass more breeds. The CDC's report, at the moment, is (I've been trying for two days). The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention website is temporarily unavailable. Please try again in a few minutes. Thank you for your patience. I have tried to follow the chatter . . . which seems to say that the CDC report encountered serious methodological difficulties and draws weak conclusions. Having read the methods for the Clifton report, I agree, the media hype will result in over-representation of the APBT, but your characterisation as "ambulance chasing lawyer sites and hate sites" seems slanderous. No question, the Clifton report reflects media bias. But it is transparent . . . the methods are clear and the source of bias is obvious. As a scientist, myself, I know lots of sources are biased, and in the absence of better data, I will sometimes consider a biased source and try to correct for bias. Even if 10% of the reported APBT attacks are real, the Clifton statistics say something about the owners of the breed, if not the breed itself. Should be noted that the Clifton report is pretty hard on some non pitt-bull types. For example, Akitas, Chows, GSD's and wolf-hybrids come off pretty badly . . . even Labradors chalk up quite a few points. The only study I can find that was done in Australia (Adelaide) is pretty old, but does come up with breed trends -- which GSD owners wouldn't like. See: http://www.mja.com.au/public/issues/aug4/t...n/thompson.html A clear picture is difficult in an emotionally charged situation where data are poor. But physics calculates force as mass x velocity squared. A 5 kg dog will thus hit with 20% of the force of a 25 kg dog, if they achieve the same speed. In boarding kennels I sometimes have to manage dogs that will attack and bite. With the little guys, I put on welding gloves and put on a muzzle if required. For the big guys, it sometimes comes down to picking up a chunk of gridmesh to serve as a shield and herding them in and out of their kennel run . . . getting close enough to put on a muzzle can be scary or simply not worth the risk.

Wonder what happens to Swiss pigs?

The CDC site is down at the moment. Try this one instead: http://www.dogbitelaw.com/Dog%20Attacks%20...6%20Clifton.pdf number of dogs involved in killing or maiming a child or adult in Canada or the US 1982-2006: Score 1100+ for APBTs, 400+ for Rottis, 2 for beagles (but one was a child who got strangled in a game of tug), 1 for pugs, 2 for JRT's .

I don't expect to agree with everything any court decides. Still, having courts is a good thing. Even if the decision was that the angler did nothing wrong, it would have been good that an attempt was made to determine whether it was senseless/needless cruelty.

I'm getting old myself, though I've got awhile to run before turning frail. I would sure as hell rather be attacked by a couple feral silky terriers (I'd clobber them with my cane or kick the little buggers) than by a couple feral Rotti's, mastifs, GSD's, Akitas, cattle dogs, pig dogs or other 25+ kg dogs with strong guarding instincts and possibly strong prey drive. I agree that bad owners of a large dog are likely to be bad owners of a small dog. But the owners of feral large dogs tend to be of the 'size matters' school, and given a choice between a pet rock and a small dog, I think many of them would choose the rock. If you check any data on fatal attacks (Google away to your heart's content) you'll find that small dogs are rarely the culprits.

The behaviour you describe is not normal for a Labrador. I agree with others about finding a behaviouralist. I'd say the problem could well be hard wired in the brain, if not hereditary. It would be worth discussing this with the breeder. Few Lab breeders would be happy turning out dogs with a-typical behaviour of this sort, and most would want to know about it. An honest breeder may also tell you if other pups of similar breeding have had the same problem.

I respect the Swiss system. Animals do need advocates. I'm haunted by a story I've told a couple times on DOL .. . family pet Lab bites child. They go for the green dream. After the dog is asleep on the green dream they discover that her ear is full of staples. If there had been even a simple process to determine whether the dog in question was vicious, it would have been decided that the problem was cruelty to animals and the poor dog was just acting in self defence. Not sure what I think about fish . . . but agree that making a sport out of slowly killing any animal is not something an enlightened society would support.

If there's a new, effective drug for obsessive-compulsive disorder in dogs, that's great news, particularly if it's affordable. As for depression, I think one in five is a conservative estimate. The number that seem to prefer our boarding kennel to their home is greater than 20%. I'd say less than 50% of dogs get enough stimulation, socialisation and exercise. But I agree . . . drugs are not the solution for this problem.

Severity of injury doesn't matter????? Are you saying an ankle bite that causes a flesh wound is as bad as getting killed or ending up in hospital with severe flesh trauma to arms, face, neck, etc.?

If you can't pin it on the owners, there will be no change. If the local authorities aren't willing to charge the guilty owners and fine them enough to get their attention, then there's not a lot you can do . . . except, perhaps, be ruthless and let the situation take care of itself.

Good on you for not naming names. You'd likely be up for a lawsuit if you had done so. The dog world, unfortunately, is awash with malicious rumours. Make sure before you spread gossip.

Sorry - it's been a few days but I only saw this post just now. You said you had 10 pups each with vaginal AI's. Are you willing to tell me which vet you used? I am also in WA and am contemplating breeding a maiden bitch using frozen semen. I usually go to Applecross who now use the trans servical method to A.I. Have PM'd you. This was chilled, not frozen semen. Applecross did the prog testing.

Sorry to hear Mischa isn't suckling. Will she suck on your finger? If not it's likely that she's in bad shape. If so, it's likely that there's something about Molly that isn't working. If you do go to the vet and she/he recommends feeding formula, you might ask about tube feeding. It sounds horrid, but it can be much easier and effective for feeding very young pups . . . provided you do it right.

Given the hype and counter hype, I find it hard to be objective about APBTs, and wind up as a fence-sitter on this debate. If the debate is to be resolved, people are going to have to build better cases. Lots of assertion being thrown around with little evidence, apart from long lists of anecdotes. Eg, in the above, Dogs from fighting lines (such as Peterbilt) did not produce successful fighters. Being polygenetic (such as many traits) it is quickly lost. The easy/biddable, moderate temperament in Labradors and many other Group 3 breeds is polygenetic, and tends to be present in Group 3 X-breeds. A Lab X kelpie is likely to be toned down from the high-strung, energetic, somewhat manic temperament that makes kelpies great herding dogs but dogs that require good management to make good pets. Also in the above: Giving a dog a weaker opponent or a bait animal destroys it's usefulness as a fighter. Totally unsupported by evidence, and I see no reason to believe it is true.

Poor woman. What bothers me most in this story is not breed, but numbers. Large, not-friendly dogs should not be permitted to roam in packs. I'm no expert on dog behaviour, but as I understand it, dogs with drive are much more likely to take on large game (including people and cattle) if they are in a pack situation. That this was permitted shows a serious break down of government.

Interesting. I assumed it was something like the game in "I'm game" . . . and thus meaning up for anything, enthusiastic, or at least willing to go along. Game as an adjective is a word going back to the 1600s. It is from a very Old English word "gamen" which means joy or pleasure. Funny how a word can take on so many meanings.