sandgrubber

Snake repellers have gotten lots of air on DOL, mostly debunking them, including some lovely input from snake fanciers, who seem to think they're quite funny and totally worthless. Try a search. I think most of the posts have been in the General forum.

In my experience as a Lab breeder and running a boarding kennel that gets lots of Labs and kelpies, I disagree. The critical difference is that Labs do ok as family pets in the suburbs. Most simply adore people. Kelpies are more high strung and can be a pain in the backside if they don't get enough exercise . . . meaning around 60 km/day. Labs are working dogs whose work often involves a lot of sitting an waiting, and in many cases doesn't involve high-drive and high energy activity (eg drug detection, guide dogs), while a working kelpie should be out with sheep. Even a retrieving dog should be happy sitting for long periods behind a duck blind; and I suspect the original Labs (UK) were bred so that the landed gentry of the 19th and early 20th century could have a loving companion when 'loving' was not a big part of human family relationships. Yes, Lab pups can be horrid chewers, diggers, etc. and it's easy to train them to bite kids. But they do settle down, and most problems can be avoided by early training. No stimulus, then ZZZZZZZ is the Lab's approach. Kelpies, on the other hand, tend to bother until someone gives them what they want. Very often older kelpies, in kennels, are bossy to other dogs, maniacal about playing fetch, and prone to fence fighting. Btw, we're not supposed to like X breeds on DOL, but I think the kelpie X Lab is a great cross.

ONLY if they had been properly trained, eg, the Triangle of Temptation approach, and that hadn't curbed the problem. I think 99% of food aggression is preventable by proper training. If food aggression were part of a complex of aggression issues, that would be another question.

What bothers me is that the 'In the News' category has essentially jumped the que and sits before Health, Nutrition and Grooming, Training, BSL, Puppy Problems, the Show Ring, etc. So it becomes a high emphasis forum. That was ok when the 'News' was dominated by tragic events that happened to much loved DOL'ers. But it stinks, now that the 'News' is dominated by animal cruelty. If this forum stays dominated by negative stories, I think it should be put down below the training and show sections . . . so people will be exposed to it only if they seek it out. You're not going to get people to change topic headers . . . ok . .. maybe for a week or two, but then a whole new mob will come in and hey, lots of people want attention, and gore gets attention. Btw, while discussing listing order of forums, I think Breeds 101 was interesting at first, but has become moribund. Every time I check a Labrador listing I seem to find someone asking chatty questions that don't fit into the forum and being referred to 'Those Crazy Labradors' in the General Discussion. I think Breeds 101 should be moved to the bottom of the list or sub-listed in the Show forum.

You're right. These products are widely available and much cheaper than Frontline in the US. I think the more interesting issue is class action against veterinary products manufacturers. I'd think, for example, there is a case to be had for suing manufacturers for vaccines that cause ill effects (eg, standard doses applied to Chihuahuas or k9 cough vac's that give k9 cough to a litter of puppies). The focus seems to be on a certain permethrin which seems to have much worse effects on dogs. It's called cyphenothrin. I don't know much about how drugs are licensed for vet use in Australia, but it is a drug that should not be permitted.

I know a trainer SOR who is interested in 'crittering' training using an e-collar. I have no love for aversive training, but associating snakes (or showing interest in a snake) with a mild shock is better than risking a bite. PM me for contact details if you're interested.

I know a trainer SOR who is interested in 'crittering' training using an e-collar. I have no love for aversive training, but associating snakes (or showing interest in a snake) with a mild shock is better than risking a bite. PM me for contact details if you're interested.

Some are worse than others . . . I think Frontline is generally ok'd by the people doing the lawsuits. Here's the HSUS take on the bad and the ugly of flea control. I got interested in this after one of my girls nearly died from taking a cyphenothrin based product (ie, a particularly nasty pyrethroid). The vendor gave no warnings. Their HOTLINE number didn't work . . . the symptoms . . . very bad seizures that continued until I finally got the advice from a vet to wash the stuff out. The chemicals Besides pyrethroid-based products, ingredients to be wary of are organophosphate insecticides (OPs) and carbamates, both of which are found in various flea and tick products. A product contains an OP if the ingredient list contains chlorpyrifos, dichlorvos, phosmet, naled, tetrachlorvinphos, diazinon, or malathion. If the ingredient list includes carbaryl or propoxur, the product contains a carbamate. According to the NRDC, the potential dangers posed by these products are greatest for children and pets. There is reason to be concerned about long-term, cumulative exposures as well as combined exposures from the use of other products containing OPs and carbamates. The Center For Public Integrity's study said permethrin is classified under the most toxic category by NRDC because the EPA says it is "likely to be carcinogenic to humans" if ingested orally. The products The NRDC's report lists flea- and tick-control products marketed under the following major brand names that have been found to contain OPs: Alco, Americare, Beaphar, Double Duty, Ford's Freedom Five, Happy Jack, Hartz, Hopkins, Kill-Ko, Protection, Rabon, Riverdale, Sergeant's, Unicorn, Vet-Kem, Victory, and Zema. To protect their pets and children, consumers should consult with a veterinarian before purchasing any over-the-counter (OTC) products.

http://www.courthousenews.com/2010/08/26/Biospot.pdf In the US a $5,000,000+ Class Action lawsuit has been filed against the manufacturers of certain spot on flea protection products which have sickened and in some cases killed the animals they were manufactured to protect. Much background on this can be found at http://www.biospotvictims.org/ I guess courthousenews is news . . . this one belongs in more mainstream news. Too bad they are more interested in the morbid and grotesque.

So what do people think about reviving the points system? Has it helped with the breeds that still use it?

My vet told me it is prevailent in rotties and dobes .. . but I don't think she extended that to Gordons and black and tan kelpies.

Another contestant. I know of a certain boarding kennel owner who locked the dogs OUTSIDE their kennels at night. When asked why by a neighbour, who was tired of hearing fence fighting all night long, he said something to the effect that he didn't want the dogs crapping and pissing in the kennel.

I hate u-tube posts cause I always have to check out the others shown alongside and end out burning up both time and bandwidth. It is amazing how 'in tune' dogs can be with human motion. I can't see it as cruel. Costumes look a little silly, but hey, what's wrong with silly. This one brought up a horrid horrid 'dance' of two SWF's in a plexiglass cage supposedly dancing the meringue . . . that bothered me.

I get more cautious if I know there's parvo going around. The 4 wk pups may be better protected than the older pup . . . if Mum's antibodies were strong. I think most parvo deaths are in pups at least 8 weeks of age and quite a few happen in pups that were vaccinated once, or even twice. Sometimes vaccines don't take. Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong.

They're all from the same genus and the same species. The amazing thing about dogs is how strongly they differentiate, not how alike they are as newborns.

So long as you have steriotypes, you're going to have media bias. Remember the 'God's Rottweiler' tag bantered about when the current Pope was nominated? Note the frequency with which Labbies are used on product labels to convey a loveable image. I've come across pit bull imagery in some pretty old novels used to describe vicious people. Steriotypes are hard to eliminate cause they strike a cord. I think the only way you'll get rid of media bias is by creating more, and stronger images of the 'bad' breed being 'good'. Lots of people are trying to do this . . . and making progress here and there. But it's a long, slow process.

I'm sure you'll find there are speyed bitches showing in the veterans class . . . and people not bothering to report they've been speyed. It's almost impossible to tell.

Tried Google. The most 'balanced' statement I can find says: "there is a possibility that some of the available heartworm preventive medications may not be entirely safe to administer to dogs harboring heartworms." It recommends annual testing whether or not you gap cause sometimes dogs spit out meds, meds are not 100% effective, and some people skip without realising they have done so. Pretty mild statement on the dangers of taking meds without testing. Strong statement made, however, on what an awful affliction heartworm is. Author is a US vet who claims to stay current on the Vet literature. Read more at Suite101: Does Your Dog Need a Yearly Heartworm Test?: Annual Heartworm Tests for Dogs: Are They Necessary or Not? http://www.suite101.com/content/does-your-...4#ixzz10YXMbpac

ditto, except it was HRT tablets. The vet said 'don't worry, it will have no effect.

What's grown up? If you mean physical neotony, the squashed in face breeds are all puppies. . .and a case could be made for smaller breeds too; and long nosers are more wolf-like. If you mean behaviour you get a different set of answers. I think you need to consider DNA evidence, thus publications written before the dog genome was published add historical interest but can't be taken too seriously.

I think my vet in Oz said that it used to be the case that meds were dangerous to dogs who were already infected, but the modern versions were generally safe. I'm pretty sure she said HeartGuard was fine, and the injectable didn't require prior testing . . . I can't remember that she said "but if you use X,Y or Z you MUST test first". I seem to remember reading that Sentinel and Revolution were safe, too. So which ones are dangerous?

My father always had tubal ligation done on his dogs (ok bitches). He liked dogs to have sex but didn't want puppies. Ok, a little crazy, anthropromorphic, and all that. The tubal is a much simpler operation than a full spey. It can very easily be tacked on to the end of a C-section . . . tying the tubes once the bitch has been cut open is a trivial job. But it does not give the same protection against oestrogen-stimulated diseases that a full spey does, and the girl will still come into season. Not sure whether a tube-tied girl is considered neutered or not when it comes to showing . . . but no one will know the difference.

In the US you have to test for heartworm and get a script to buy tablets. My Australian vet told me that testing wasn't necessary (hope I'm not loosing my memory). US Americans seem to think you can kill your dog by giving tablets if the dog is already infected. I can't remember ever hearing this in Australia. Curious about the difference.

Flame suit ready and the fire retardant is on hand. My parents allowed bitser bitches to have a couple litters when I was growing up. I think us kids learned a lot from it. No disasters. They were hardy little girls. My parents died years ago, so I can't ask them what happened to the pups . . . it probably wasn't good news. When I ran a boarding kennel, I ran into a lot of people who wanted to perpetuate their lines -- bitser lines. Some of them had lovely tempered older dogs who were in great health, and I can understand why they might want to keep a pup. There are some exceptionally good dogs who don't have a pedigree In the farm situation, neighbours asking for pups was a good reason to have a litter . . . in times past . .. and my guess is this sort of logic played a big role in the development of many working breeds, especially before the pedigree system was organised. Yes there are a lot of idiots out there who don't know what they are getting into and who will ultimately be adding to the unloved and unwanted dog population. But I can see why people might want to perpetuate a line . . . pedigree or not. It's an old tradition and still has some merit. Also, I think you'll be more successful in twisting arms by sympathising than blanket condemnation.

My understanding: the larger the litter, the smaller the pups on average, and hence the lower the chance of getting stuck and the easier to get the breach pups and other trouble makers out. So I'd agree with the others about going natural and having a backup plan. Might add, with smaller and more pups you have a greater risk of loosing a pup or two. A good vet can reduce this risk by doing a Ceasar, though an emergency Ceasar may be as good or better than an elective for this purpose. The only Rotti breeder I talk to regularly has horrid problems with bitches rejecting (as in wanting to kill) pups. Hand rearing 12 is a big job. I'm not saying it's a breed trait or something to worry about, but you might do well to find out about the grand dam's maternal instancts, and prepare yourself if they aren't good.