sandgrubber

So well said Alyosha. Well said, but not correct as a matter of law. Having rights does not pass responsibilities back. A 2 yr old child has lots of rights, but no responsibilities. Some argue that the unborn have rights. A dying person or someone with serious brain injury has rights, but is incapable of taking responsibilities, and therefore not be held responsible by the law. Human owners have responsibility because they vest in animals rights to some minimal standard of care. Animals have rights because people recognise a responsibility to meet certain standards of care.

I am not attacking cocker spaniels, so there is no need to defend. However, it is incorrect to say that temperament is 99% training. If breeders are not willing to admit that bad temperament flaws can run in lines and stop breeding from dogs with bad temperament, breeds will deteriorate. I'm thinking of a reasonably popular stud dog, I won't mention the breed, but not a cocker, whose second, off-the-books call name was A##-hole, and who was known to throw stubborn and troublesome pups. In my book, that dog should have been neutered faster than a dog with 3/3 elbows.

Old age was 'old age' as reported by owners, so it could mean lots of things.

Do inquire about temperament (for any breed). http://dsc.discovery.com/news/2009/05/22/cocker-spaniel-aggressive.html World's Meanest Dog: The English Cocker Spaniel? May 22, 2009 -- A floppy-eared, innocent-looking breed may be one of the world's most aggressive dogs, according to a new study that found English cocker spaniels tend to be more hostile than other breeds. The discovery adds to the mounting evidence that aggressiveness is an inherited characteristic, suggesting that genes and breeding practices can both help determine how a dog will behave. "In our country and according to our database, the English cocker spaniel is the breed that shows more aggression problems," lead author Marta Amat told Discovery News. Amat, a researcher in the School of Veterinary Medicine at the Autonomous University of Barcelona, and her colleagues analyzed 1,040 cases of canine aggression brought to a nearby veterinary teaching hospital from 1998 to 2006. Of those cases, the majority of cases were attributed to English cocker spaniels, Rottweilers, Boxers, Yorkshire terriers and German shepherds. Probing the data further, Amat and her team discovered that English cocker spaniels were more likely than other dogs to act aggressively toward their owners as well as unfamiliar people. In contrast, dogs with reported behavior problems from other breeds tended to act aggressively toward other dogs. Among the English cocker spaniels, golden varieties and males were found to be the most hostile. The findings, published in the latest Journal of Veterinary Behavior, confirm an earlier study conducted by a separate Spanish team from the University of Cordoba, which also found males and golden English cocker spaniels were more aggressive than females or those with black and mixed-color coats. In terms of coat color, Amat explained that the coat pigment melanin shares a common biochemical pathway with dopamine and other brain chemicals involved in the control of aggressive behavior. Next »21« Previous

I've recently shifted from BARF to Castor and Pollux All Natural . . . which I doubt you can get in Australia. It includes visibly identifiable dried bananas, peas, carrots . . . and contains about 4% menhaden (a cheap, oily fish sometimes used as stock feed) and has a fishy smell . . . rice is the only grain. Has done wonders for my girls coats. Hard to tell how much they appreciate it. They'd go whacko over a bowl of diced Wonder Bread with bacon drippings poured over it.

I think there are some uncharitable, judgmental people on DOL.

Ugh! I wish everyone in this discussion could live in a place where there are more pit bulls than Staffies. Yes, there are monster pit bulls, bred and managed to be monsters. There are pit bull X's, bred to be bigger and fiercer than the monster pit bulls. The idiots who make them that way deserve some sort of extreme management . . . desexing would be a punishment to fit the crime. But the average pit bull is a wag monster much like the average Staffie. Yah, it's not uncommon for either breed to be a bit DA, usually cause they haven't been socialised from an early age. I sympathise with staffy owners. I wouldn't want that sort of hate and fear spilling over onto my dog, either. But it's a mistake to give in to the notion that the fear and hate is justified. I also think the editorial misreads the AVA. The AVA says the legislation IS NOT A SOLUTION FULL STOP. . . and does not concede that it is even a temporary solution.

A cousin of mine had a dog lead that stated: MY MOMMY IS SINGLE. I kinda prefer that approach. Holding a cold synthetic hand is creepy.

see http://www.canine-ge...m/lifespan.html for full details This guy conducted a web based survey of standard poodle owners. His findings showed some interesting things: * cancer and bloat account for about three quarters of all deaths * average lifespan is a bit over 11 years * more inbred dogs are much more likely to suffer bloat * only 9.1% of dogs die of old age I find this interesting. Not sure if I believe the data though. The author (now deceased) was active in the Canine Diversity Project, which clearly affected the questions asked, but I'm not clear if it affected study results. I sure would like to see the equivalent for other breeds. Comments, anyone?

Couldn't find the letter. The link put me to a debate about energy sources.

I don't know a lot about cockers, but am aware there have been serious temperament problems in some lines. At least this answer will give you a bump, and you might get a reply from someone with more info.

I've seen this study mentioned many times. Thought it useful to post links for the original study. I think the underlined text below will give a link to the .pdf. It's an amazing study, both because the results are conclusive and because they observed their dogs for a full 15 years! https://www.avma.org/News/Journals/Collections/Documents/javma_220_9_1315.pdf Effects of diet restriction on life span and age-related changes in dogs Richard D. Kealy, PhD; Dennis F. Lawler, DVM; Joan M. Ballam, MS; Sandra L. Mantz; Darryl N. Biery, DVM, DACVR; Elizabeth H. Greeley, PhD; George Lust, PhD; Mariangela Segre, DSc; Gail K. Smith, DVM, PhD, DACVS; Howard D. Stowe, DVM, PhD Objective—To evaluate the effects of 25% diet restriction on life span of dogs and on markers of aging. Design—Paired feeding study. Animals—48 Labrador Retrievers. Procedures—Dogs were paired, and 1 dog in each pair was fed 25% less food than its pair-mate from 8 weeks of age until death. Serum biochemical analy- ses were performed, body condition was scored, and body composition was measured annually until 12 years of age. Age at onset of chronic disease and median (age when 50% of the dogs were deceased) and maximum (age when 90% of the dogs were deceased) life spans were evaluated. Results—Compared with control dogs, food-restrict- ed dogs weighed less and had lower body fat content and lower serum triglycerides, triiodothyronine, insulin, and glucose concentrations. Median life span was significantly longer for dogs in which food was restricted. The onset of clinical signs of chronic dis- ease generally was delayed for food-restricted dogs. Conclusions and Clinical Relevance—Results sug- gest that 25% restriction in food intake increased median life span and delayed the onset of signs of chronic disease in these dogs. (J Am Vet Med Assoc 2002;220:1315–1320)

This appeared at the top of my screen . . . below the DOGZONLINE caption and above the forum itself. What an abomination. Pugs have health problems enough without someone trying to create teacups! Teacup Pugs For Sale Search multiple engines for teacup pugs for sale www.web crawler.com

yip - nothing to do with the new laws (although she is happy to paint it that way...). ok, bad example. Lesson to learn. Those who beat their breasts may not be the people who have suffered the most. It's going to require some sort of outreach to get those who suffer in silence for the loss of a loved animal to come on board. Or do you mean to say that it's all a myth and no one is loosing their pets? I'm surprised at how quiet the waves seem to have gotten after the deadline passed.

I was reading comments on the Melbourne Rally Facebook page and was saddened to see the following comment: Caren Halliwell I'm bringing the empty collar and lead Boyd left. This made me want to cry. Seems like there are people out there loosing their dogs. Not all of them will be willing or able to participate in rallies. Seems like it would be worth setting up a memorial website somewhere to pay tribute to the dogs lost. Perhaps a simple black page with the dogs names, pictures, and comments written in white set up as a Wiki so people can add to it. I checked. emptycollar.com, emptycollar.net, emptycollar.org and all the other variants are available.

it's ok to rip out a car's radiator or a computer's hard drive, but not ok to pull out something from a dog's guts. I've met people who take on a second job to pay their vet bills. You don't do that for a mere possession. As Steve pointed out, 'rights' is not all or nothing. You have to be a loonie to want full freedom for dogs. Freedom of speech, freedom of movement, freedom to choose a mate and raise a family . . . those are not meaningful rights for dogs. But most people would agree that they have a right not to be treated with extreme cruelty and that owning a dog involves a duty of care. Saying dogs are more than chattels one is not signing on with the animal lib agenda. I think the very special place dogs have in many of our lives should give them a status higher than that of a possession. The Law should give some standing to the affection people feel for the animals that share and enrich their lives.

Now, if I were a house burglar, there are a number of breeds I'd be wary of. In my book, that's good (so long as the same dogs don't bail me up in the park or attack my dog in a dog park).

Thanks for the links, dogcentric. Interesting stuff. I guess this all will be slow and difficult to resolve. Personally, I don't see how an animal that someone loves as a family member can be reduced to 'property' status. It sickens me that the people who are supposedly working for animal rights don't stand up for condemned animals. Maybe that's just me. You might be interested in a book called "Pawprints of History" by Stanley Cohen (2002). http://www.amazon.com/Pawprints-History-Course-Human-Events/dp/0743222318/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1317845913&sr=1-1 particularly Chapter 11, which deals with the founding of the RSPCA. The original advocate, Richard Martin, started his activities with a duel with a local landlord who shot a friend's dog and managed to get legislation through Parliament in 1822. It goes on to describe the mayhem the ensued when the RSPCA managed to pass laws outlawing cart dogs.

I disagree. Anti-cruelty legislation, dating back to the 19th century, has established the concept that animals, particularly dogs, should have certain minimal standards of care, and should not be worked to death (as sometimes happened with spit dogs and cart dogs, horses, donkeys, etc.). The first child welfare laws in the USA were based on anti-cruelty legislation put in to protect work animals. When people take on an animal as a companion, that animal deserves a certain minimal standard of care. Yes, there will be disputes about what that minimum of care is, and it will vary over time and from place to place. What I don't understand is how the Loonies fail to be interested in the execution of dogs because they look wrong. I can't think of a worse violation of rights than mass execution based on suppositions with no scientific basis. As for the vet care question . . . I may not agree with where the lines are drawn: ear and tail docking and removal of dew claws are things that breeders have done for centuries, and there's no question that these things can be done in a humane fashion. I'm not convinced that a bullet is any less humane than the green dream. But I do agree to there being laws. DIY Ceasars and debarking are a step too far (I don't know about Australian kenneling laws . . . but these are practices that have recently been outlawed in some US states after finding them widespread in huge, highly commercial breeding operations).<br /><br />p.s. If anyone can explain what's going on with my posts . . . adding a bunch of /br's and &gt's etc., please help. I have posted in the appropriate forum for this, but I don't think I've gotten a response yet. I removed a lot of junk from this post, but it was a real mess before I did so. I've re-edited it . . . maybe the junk will find its way back in.

Surely, the government has ways to force the trailer company to pay. . . garnish something? take away business licenses?

Lane Cover Rd. Isn't that one of the streets where they play the game, kill the cyclist! I'm not saying the dog was innocent, but that is one nasty thoroughfare.

A bit more on this from the PDE Blog 23 Sept 2011 http://pedigreedogsexposed.blogspot.com/ PDE provides a link for the BVA / KC joint announcement: http://www.bva.co.uk/newsroom/2460.aspx also notes . . . Elsewhere, there are several other initiatives aimed at helping to further elucidate CM/SM. They include the Foetal Tissue Research Project, the Cavalier Collection Scheme, and Rupert's Fund which funds MRI scans of older Cavaliers (6+). Rupert's Fund has so far met the cost of MRI scans for 50 dogs vital to SM research. If you have a Cavalier, and haven't already done so, please do check out how your dogs could help future Cavaliers by participating in the research.

periannath, could you give sources for the material you're posting. Many of us appreciate the posts . . . but it's always better to know where information comes from . . . thanks

<br /><br /><br />fun article, but anything that says "science proves" is an automatic turnoff to scientists. Sounds more like anecdote than data. Humans are pretty good at misunderstanding animals. It would be more satisfying to know more about the freeloaders. Were they all males (as in human hunter-gatherer societies)? Were they youngsters, perhaps learning the ropes? Or retired wolves, who had done their duties and were serving as backup.

<br /><br />Doesn't a vet certificate of breed identity clear a dog from seizure if declared not a Pitbull or Pitbull X?<br /><br />Are the vets saying they won't declare a dog to be a Pitbull or they won't provide conformation that it isn't?\<br /><br />Ultimately, all anyone need do, is have their vet provide a certificate to say a dog in the firing line is not a Pitbull and the problem is solved isn't it?<br /><br /><br /><br />No, the problem isn't solved. The AVA is saying they want nothing to do with the mess and they advise their members not to play along with the stupid laws. There will be vets who break with party line and agree to certify dogs on the firing line. Some vets may even be happy to use their credentials to certify dogs they know ARE APBTs, just as some doctors were willing to help blokes trying to avoid the draft. But not everyone who adopted a harmless and cute staffy X and got 'caught' by some gung ho animal control officer is going to know the ins and outs of finding a vet who will certify.