Kelly_Louise

Regardless of surgery or not, I would be adding the Sasha's Blend and getting him lighter asap anyway. So full steam ahead on those. Seeing it's a partial tear, I'd probably give these things you mentioned a go first. The worst that can happen is that it will become a full tear - which is painful, but at least you have the surgery option and can move quickly. The best outcome is that it can heal really well and might solve the problem. Who knows? I was under the impression that vet's didn't operate until it was a full tear anyway - but I could be wrong and it might be different depending on who you go to. I think if you could get him to really rest it for a good few weeks you may have a chance of it healing without surgery. I'm not sure of the statistics, or if people have had long term success with this or how well it heals - so it's worth giving a shot before you put him through surgery.

Chloe was walking as soon as we picked her up - actually as soon as she woke from the op. She's a tough bugger. With or without the cast she walked pretty much straight away. For her first op she came home with no cast (not sure why)... on the second she came home with a cast on - but chewed it off that night (and yes here I was cutting the rest of it off at 4am in the morning, in winter, with blunt scissors . On her first night home from her first op, we left her to sleep in her little pen (it's like a crate) and when I got up in the morning she was down the backyard napping... she just hadn't been used to confinement and had crawled her way under 2 lots of secure chicken wire - with a 'broken' leg and stitches. To this day we still dont know how she did it... For the first 2 - 4 weeks I would keep him strictly confined in a small area. No walking on his own, and toilet on lead only (maybe a slow little walk around the yard on lead only for a short time) then back in confinement. To release boredom on the weekends when I would take chloe to toilet I would just lie her down in a sunny piece of grass and sit with her, just watch the world go by. After the first month we let her wander in her own little pen always under supervision during the day (it was about 3 x 5m with a small area of grass to toilet) but out of that pen was still on lead only. Still have to watch them as at this time they are starting to feel better and want to jump and do normal things. But it gave her a little bit of freedom and she could move and lie where she wanted. However, we were lucky that chloe was 8 and was not hyper anymore, and had no other dogs to convince her to try and play. She really did adapt to her confinement - probably didn't like it, but she coped better than i would have ever expected and learnt to deal with it all. Her first leg took about 12-16 weeks to fully heal - it was very slow to mend the break. After that it was straight in for the other leg op. That took the more usual 8ish weeks to heal. When the vet gave us the all clear, she was then allowed free reign of her yard. We took it slow on walks and built her up - don't let them just get straight back into it - I gave her muscles time to strengthen and rebuild to support the surgery. Rehab with physio etc is usually recommended however we did it ourselves. But your vet will guide you about what you should and should not be doing at all stages. Never be afraid to ask them, no question can be too silly. They need xrays at regular intervals after the op, so they will monitor and let you know how the healing is going and what your dog is now capable of. It's hard work, but the other side is well worth it - and I was such a worry wart which didn't help (actually I think my family called me 'anal')

Yes it's always the way... Glad you have a thorough understanding of the surgeries and are feeling confident... that's the first step. I would also recommend taking some time of post op. I took a couple of weeks for both Chloe's ops, plus i was lucky enough to have mum and dad at home so they took over when I couldn't. I won't lie to you... it's tough. I was so tired (I woke constantly at EVERY single noise, thinking it was Chloe caught up, fallen, slipped etc), worried and stressed I thought I was going to have a breakdown Then I was up at 4amish to toilet her, then I'd curl up and nap with her so she didn't feel alone - in the middle of winter... But you know, as long as you are prepared for what is coming and have as much as you can ready and organised (a crate, pen, fenced area) somewhere where he can't slip, trip, run or jump etc. Oh and start making a list of boredom busters... new tricks, long life chews etc. Also, when/if he does have surgery he will be needing alot less food due to inactivity, otherwise they tend to put on weight which is a big no no with these surgeries. He needs to be as light as possible. I agree, for bigger dogs (I feel also) surgery is the best long term option (providing it is the correct type of surgery for dog) for best quality of life. YES, it does take some time out for recovery... Chloe was out for approx 9 or 10 months (her old bones healed slowly) and I copped ALOT of flak... but it was worth all of it and she has had a fantastic quality of life since and we don't have to constantly worry and monitor her legs (only her Cushings disease now ). Most of the time we've forgotten she once struggled to get up... that sad memory I have has turned into a happy one. The day I saw Chloe toddle off on her first official walk since recovery was such a happy day I cried. I have a shirt that says... Surgery $3500, xrays $500, physio $30/hr etc etc etc - seeing my dog run again - PRICELESS. And it was.

Oh poor Harry... How did he break it? His well behaved crating should see him recover this time too hopefully. Special hugs to him

Personally I'd stay away from option 2 and the scar build up/replacement ligament techniques- they are not as good for bigger/heavier dogs... and the last thing you want is to have to have further operations to keep repairing it. The first option sounds pretty much like what Chloe had done... the leg is in effect broken, a 'wedge' of bone is taken out and is repositioned to create a more stable knee slope, and then pinned back together with a metal plate and screws. Not sure on the third option - does it use a spring or something in there? There was something being trialled when Chloe had hers done, but I didn't want to take the risk with there being no formal results at the time, and to me it sounded like there were too many parts in there that could potentially go wrong and cause problems and Chloe was too old to be put through the wringer. But not knowing what it involves and what the stats are on recovery it's something you would need to check out first. For a partial tear they are not usually so quick to go to surgery - usually they will wait until it's a full tear to see if it can heal itself (although not sure if they ever go back to 100%). I would probably get a second opinion and perhaps do xrays - or ask to be referred to a specialist who is better equipped to a) handle the surgery and aftercare and b) guide you to the best procedure. If you feel okay with your vet now though, do a bit of research on Google and you will start to understand what is involved and what is your best option. Hopefully it may not come to surgery though - although being so young it will be hard to keep them rested and prevent re-injuring. Also be aware, that a high percentage of dogs will blow their other cruciate within 18 months of the first going (if they haven't already blown both)... ;) At least you know what the problem is now and have options. Good luck keeping Asher quiet Keep us updated please, and if you have any other questions please let me know.

Hugs to you and your family at this terrible time - but he will now be released and pain free over at Rainbow Bridge, and he will thank you for it. Seems he's had a wonderful life, a very lucky dog and part of a loving family. May he always have a special place in your hearts.

It's always scary, but with practice you will get more confident!! Lucky you have such an easy going dog!!

Yes generally they will go under for xrays. 3 does sound young for bad arthritis - especially if he hasn't had any obvious leg injury or trauma. But I guess not unheard of... arthritis is just nasty and indiscriminate I think your vet should investigate further seeing that it is a recurring thing, so best be guided by them. Just don't let them shrug you off if you feel something is not right. Unfortunately we let that happen as we believed it was arthritis, and were under the impression that it was arthritis for a long time... till it got to the point where Chloe couldn't get up to toilet and would hold her arm out for me to help her up (and trust me you've not seen anything more heart shattering than a helpless cattle dog asking for help to get up). If it should be just a partial tear of the cruciate, then it's best to know as it can be repairable without surgery. Regardless of what it turns out to be, it's best to know what you are dealing with so you know what his limitations are to best keep him safe and pain free. Best of luck and let us know how you go!

Three years on after surgery and Chloe is really good. If she over does things, she may have a stiff day every now and then - but generally she is a normal dog (we just avoid really rough play or hectic jumping) and if I don't tell you she has had these leg problems you'd never know. She is 11 now, so arthritis has set in and had before her operations... but generally it's not noticeable much at all and can match it with the best of dogs half her age. We did have xrays done to confirm torn cruciates - and they will also pick up any arthritic changes in the joints should he have any anyway. Chloe's specialist could also tell my manipulation of the knee and joints as well - although Chloe did not show signs of discomfort either but there were obviously problems there. I'm not sure what others would do, but I know that if I had suspicions of leg problems again, I would want xrays sooner rather than later as I am the type that wants to know what I'm dealing with and get treatment started asap to minimise damage. Unfortunately Chloe's torn cruciates were diagnosed way too late and was so damaged her meniscus also had to be removed (which is like the buffer shock absorber between joints). Hard to say, but being persistent with your vet to find the answers would be my best advice. How old is Asher and has he had any obvious leg injuries before?

It sounds like perhaps he has a problem with one of his back legs. We had the same problem before Chloe totally blew both her cruciate ligaments. Intermittent leg problems, we were given anti inflams etc and told to go home and rest her. We were never really informed it could be a cruciate ligament (and back then we knew little about cruciate ligaments) until she blew them and required surgery. Leg issues should be investigated or dealt with quickly - as joints can deteriorate quickly with arthritis and DJD if not treated. I would think another trip to the vet is in order - be persistent until you get a diagnosis you are comfortable with. My young girl Sasha also drags her nails every now and again - I don't see that as too much of a problem... but the holding the leg up certainly says it's somethign more than arthritis to me. ETA - if he's only barely touchign it to the ground - then it IS sore. Chloe had her leg broken and pinned together under surgery and even she used her leg and I know it must have been damn sore. For it to be an on/off problem - to me sounds like a cruciate tear, maybe not fully torn but at perhaps a partial tear.

Send your dog to my Mum's house - she can fatten up any dog in record time

Lizzy06, I do understand that you are in an even tougher position with your little girl. Nothing wrong with sweet potato if that is what will best suit her tummy - it's all about the presentation!! Just put it in a nice shape, put a candle in and hey presto - you have a sweet potato cake!! Maybe decorate it with something else she can handle (i think I read she can have some fish)? Perfect!! Our dogs with sensitive tummies shouldn't miss out, even if it is just made out of their boring old food

I started a similar thread not long ago in General Discussion - if you do a search you might find it has some great ideas. Due to Sash's sensitive tummy, I made her 'cake' out of Advance canned food (which she is accustomed to) and pieces of cheese which she loves and are a massive treat for her. So it was pretty basic (but tummy friendly) and I made it into a nice design for her... she loved it!!!

For supermarket brands, I have used Optimum with really good results and the dogs love it, will even eat it if they aren't well. Makes all their poos nice and firm too. But I prefer Advance canned food due to the tighter less fatty texture. I have used Nature's Gift before, but the amount of fat in the tin makes ME want to throw up... and gives my dogs the runs

I believe the Lawrence family was in a bit of shock - as would any of us be if we were told, all of a sudden, that our beloved family member only had days or weeks to live. The confusion and hurt in the first post is evident. When we get such bad news, we do want to blame someone, get out our frustration and the why's, and we feel hard done by - it seems so unfair, and in a way, it truly is. I understand, I had a blue cattle dog that went into her vet to have a tooth taken out - and was never the same after that. I held a grudge against that vet and refused point blank to ever go back there again. It was only after MANY years and hearing that the specific vet was no longer there could I go back. I still feel what I feel as a betrayal, even though it may not make sense to others. The Lawrence family seem to love their little Benson greatly, and I have no doubt they will do the right thing by him - and let him go should he be suffering. I do think a consultation with a specialist might help the diagnosis to sink it, for you to believe it is a correct one, and for you to feel in your heart that the decision you make is for the best. Sometimes we need that confirmation - I know after a misdiagnosis I would be afraid of making a wrong decision as well. But please do it soon, as if Benson is suffering it is kinder to let him go. It seems he has had a wonderful life of love with his family, and will rely on that to help rid him of his pain. For him to live such a great life, is all we can really ask for, for our dogs - and all we can do to repay them for the years of love and loyalty and good times they give to us.

Perhaps for peace of mind, you should take the xrays to another vet/specialist and get a second opinion. That way you can make the best decision for your boy without wondering 'what if...'. I can't imagine what a terrible shock it must be, and horribly sad for your family as well. Our lovely dogs are never with us long enough... We need to do the best thing for them, and if he is suffering perhaps getting a second opinion will put your mind at ease and help you to see what will need to be done. Hugs to Benson and to your family at such a sad and confusing time.

It was approximately $3500 per leg (give or take a couple of hundred). I did have a choice of similar surgeries and the TWO was one of the more expensive - however I had done alot of research online and that was the surgery I preferred and understood, and I have to say, it was worth every cent. It was painful financially (that was my wedding money and I'm still not married), but if I had the chance to do it all over again, I would do the same thing without a second thought - the results were just so good for us. The recovery was long, and stressful for everyone especially because I wanted everything adhered to down to the last syllable... but again, worth it. I know alot of people are not a fan of surgery, but for me, I'm glad I made the decision and am thrilled with the ongoing results (she was so bad our alternative was really PTS). But I have had my girl for another 3 wonderful years (and hopefully many more) and she has been happy and mostly painfree and normal life. ETA - this price was for the surgery performed by a specialist orthaepedic surgeon

Hi Pitchick, Sorry to hear of your girls cruciate damage. At about 8yo, my red cattle dog also blew both her cruciates. We opted for a tibial wedge osteotomy (similar to a TPLO) surgery, because the osteotomy surgeries are generally considered more stable and more successful on larger/heavier dogs (I guess that would include more active as well) due to the fact that the slope of the knee is permanently changed to be more stable, and is plated and screwed up to keep it all in place. We followed the aftercare rigidly, and let me tell you, once she was done with her rehab - I actually have to tell people she has had these ops as no one would ever guess. If she has a really BIG and active day, she may get a little stiff - but it is nothing drastic (no limping or anything, mind you she has a load of arthritis in all 4 legs too). My best advice if you are going to go ahead with surgery - is to research, or speak to the vet about the different techniques - and find the one that will suit your dogs size, weight and activity level best. Aftercare is also very tedious and needs to be followed carefully if the surgery is to be successful. Also, keep her as lean as you can (we haven't managed that with Chloe due to her other issues - and she manages fine but the leaner you can have her the more successful surgery will be). Chloe, now at 11yo and with numerous other health and leg issues, can probably outrun any dog her age (or younger). We don't encourage rough play or jumping play anymore (ie jumping for balls or off high places etc), just to keep her safe - but she can function very normally otherwise. At her age she was slowing down anyway with natural ageing, and we replaced all her balls with squeaky toys or tugs that don't require jumping or anything too rough. She did get used to this, and now has balls in her massive toy chest - she does little runs to fetch them and we throw so she can catch it without having to jump etc... but in all honesty we've never had any problems since her surgery. It was actually (in my opinion) the best decision I made for her and gave her a quality of life (a slightly different life - but a happy painfree one none the less) that alternative treatments couldn't. So yes, we are one example of an ongoing surgery success story. If you have any other specific questions, I'm happy to answer them! ETA - these good results were achieved even after her recommendation for surgery was delayed way too long and much damage had set in - her meniscus were totally destroyed and these had to be removed as well - pretty much means she has no shock buffers in her knees anymore. Which is why if you are going to opt for surgery, do not leave it too long as joint changes can set in very quickly.

DW, hoping you will pop back on here soon and let us know how the wonder boy Diesel is doing? I'd love to hear some good news from you. And also some pics too... we are all hanging to see your little miracle man.

Yes Chloe has them when her arthritis is particularly bad - work very effectively and don't have side effects. I believe they are more safe for long term use as well?

Will do Poodle wrangler, thank you. I don't like messing with the eyes or ears too much, so if necessary in the future I will be very careful.

Thank you all for the suggestions. I wiped it out last night with some warm water (left out the salt as I was too afraid I'd put too much in) - and I learnt something new... Sasha does not like having her eyes cleaned :D I had to chase the bugger around the yard, but once I got her I got a few seconds to wash it out. Today is much better, doesn't appear to be the same amount of gunk in her eye - just a normal (little to none) amount. So I'm guessing she may have just irritated it by sticking her head in a bush or something. Thanks for the advice, next time I'll know what to do initially.

I generally check under the nails to where the fleshy 'quick' part is and cut as close to it as possible without actually cutting it - basically it's easier for me to do it with Sasha lying on her side, then I can see the quick from underneath and better judge how far to go back. Then I file them back a little to push the quick back if needed. I've never had a bleed and the filing is easy as it won't do much damage and if the scraping annoys her she lets me know I also use clippers that only let you cut a pre-set amount at a time, just in case she jerks or I move and stops me from cutting too much. I was also terrified, but I find if I follow this and keep an eye on the underside of her nails and the quick I don't have any problems.

Thank you dianed! She normally has a little bit of sleepy stuff every now and then, but it's just that this seems to be a bit more accumulating more quickly and only coming out of one eye. I will try a solution and keep it clean and see how it goes. I'm assuming only a small amount of salt (don't want to sting it) is needed? Thanks for your help, Mum told me not to use salt but I've seen a couple of people recommend it on here so will give a small amount a try!

Hi guys, Sash has a slightly gunky eye at the moment. It doesn't seem to be bothering her, but every now and then she will get an accumulation of clear/whitish runny gunk (not too watery, it's a thickish watery consistency that just snakes out of the corner) in one of her eyes. When I get home from work or when she wakes up, there is an accumulation (like sleep but a bit more) - I wouldn't say lots, but more than what you would expect to see from a normal eye. It doesn't look abnormal, she's not squinting or blinking excessively - could she have just scratched it or something? What is the best thing to do for me to ensure it is comfortable for her? Of course if it gets worse or goes on too long I will take her to the vet, but just hoping it's nothing major and maybe just wash it out with something? Can someone please let me know the best eye flush to use, and how many parts of each ingredient should be added to the solution? Thank you!