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Yet this breeder would most definately be branded unethical n puppy farmer here anyway. http://whitedobermanpuppies.com/index.html

spotted this on a puppy website. agree with the owner of the site. definately required reading. When I was a puppy, I entertained you with my antics and made you laugh. You called me your child and despite a number of chewed shoes and a couple of murdered throw pillows, I became your best friend. Whenever I was "bad," you'd shake your finger at me and ask "How could you?" - but then you'd relent and roll me over for a belly rub. My house training took a little longer than expected, because you were terribly busy, but we worked on that together. I remember those nights of nuzzling you in bed, listening to your confidences and secret dreams, and I believed that life could not be any more perfect. We went for long walks and runs in the park, car rides, stops for ice cream (I only got the cone because "ice cream is bad for dogs," you said), and I took long naps in the sun waiting for you to come home at the end of the day. Gradually, you began spending more time at work and on your career, and more time searching for a human mate. I waited for you patiently, comforted you through heartbreaks and disappointments, never chided you about bad decisions, and romped with glee at your homecomings, and when you fell in love. She, now your wife, is not a "dog person" - still I welcomed her into our home, tried to show her affection, and obeyed her. I was happy because you were happy. Then the human babies came along and I shared your excitement. I was fascinated by their pinkness, how they smelled, and I wanted to mother them, too. Only she and you worried that I might hurt them, and I spent most of my time banished to another room, or to a dog crate. Oh, how I wanted to love them, but I became a "prisoner of love." As they began to grow, I became their friend. They clung to my fur and pulled themselves up on wobbly legs, poked fingers in my eyes, investigated my ears and gave me kisses on my nose. I loved everything about them, especially their touch - because your touch was now so infrequent - and I would have defended them with my life if need be. I would sneak into their beds and listen to their worries and secret dreams. Together we waited for the sound of your car in the driveway. There had been a time, when others asked you if you had a dog, that you produced a photo of me from your wallet and told them stories about me. These past few years, you just answered "yes" and changed the subject. I had gone from being your dog to "just a dog," and you resented every expenditure on my behalf. Now you have a new career opportunity in another city and you and they will be moving to an apartment that does not allow pets. You've made the right decision for your "family," but there was a time when I was your only family. I was excited about the car ride until we arrived at the animal shelter. It smelled of dogs and cats, of fear, of hopelessness. You filled out the paperwork and said "I know you will find a good home for her." They shrugged and gave you a pained look. They understand the realities facing a middle-aged dog or cat, even one with "papers." You had to pry your son's fingers loose from my collar as he screamed "No, Daddy! Please don't let them take my dog!" And I worried for him and what lessons you had just taught him about friendship and loyalty, about love and responsibility, and about respect for all life. You gave me a goodbye pat on the head, avoided my eyes, and politely refused to take my collar and leash with you. You had a deadline to meet and now I have one, too. After you left, the two nice ladies said you probably knew about your upcoming move months ago and made no attempt to find me another good home. They shook their heads and asked "How could you?" They are as attentive to us here in the shelter as their busy schedules allow. They feed us, of course, but I lost my appetite days ago. At first, whenever anyone passed my pen, I rushed to the front, hoping it was you - that you had changed your mind - that this was all a bad dream...or I hoped it would at least be someone who cared, anyone who might save me. When I realized I could not compete with the frolicking for attention of happy puppies, oblivious to their own fate, I retreated to a far corner and waited. I heard her footsteps as she came for me at the end of the day and I padded along the aisle after her to a separate room. A blissfully quiet room. She placed me on the table, rubbed my ears and told me not to worry. My heart pounded in anticipation of what was to come, but there was also a sense of relief. The prisoner of love had run out of days. As is my nature, I was more concerned about her. The burden which she bears weighs heavily on her and I know that, the same way I knew your every mood. She gently placed a tourniquet around my foreleg as a tear ran down her cheek. I licked her hand in the same way I used to comfort you so many years ago. She expertly slid the hypodermic needle into my vein. As I felt the sting and the cool liquid coursing through my body, I lay down sleepily, looked into her kind eyes and murmured "How could you?" Perhaps because she understood my dog speak, she said "I'm so sorry." She hugged me and hurriedly explained it was her job to make sure I went to a better place, where I wouldn't be ignored or abused or abandoned, or have to friend for myself - a place of love and light so very different from this earthly place. With my last bit of energy, I tried to convey to her with a thump of my tail that my "How could you?" was not meant for her. It was you, My Beloved Master, I was thinking of. I will think of you and wait for you forever. If you are not crying now you can not have one of our pups! Never take one of our pups to a shelter or rescue! Bring them back to us, we will care for them and find them new homes... They are our babies and we will never abandon them!

my aunt used to breed bull terriorists, LOL. yep scary dogs all right, help the burgler carry out the furniture that lot.

since the topic is roos, i dont think your thoughts are too OT. I dont understand how that roo with the broken neck was kept alive. thats no quality of life for him. ooo if you want a good laugh, (yes off topic) go to the dairy display at any show and what the reactions and whats said by the kids seeing a cow milked for the first time... particuly if offered some of the milk to taste..... absolutely amazing how many didnt know and as one said "grossed out"

having a friend who took up roo harvesting/roo shooter. went out with them for a week. ye gads. had nightmares for years. every shot landed just behind n slightly below the ear. clean kill every time. n im talking hundreds. only once did they accidently hit one with a joey in the pouch and it was tiny. and put down immediatly. the realisation what these men could do if they went nutters like the strathfield massacre scared me witless. as for why do they cull. most of the stations we went through there were more roos per paddock than sheep. no wonder the farmers are having it tough, in the droughts its even worse. plant crops for your stock and its a sea of roos every night. those who think the eastern grey or the big fellas are endangered need a trip out coonamable way. to me i felt pretty sorry for the farmers. they supply the feed and water, pay the rates and the roo shooters harvest a crop on their land and pocket the proceeds... nice job if you have the talent and it sure is a talent. i couldnt shoot that straight night after night like that. also. they never took small ones.. always the biggest...so considering the majorty of a mob are mid age and younger there wasnt any culling of the females unless they were really big ones . no no reduction in next generation. so little relief for the farmer long term anyway.

interesting he says dogs dont pass it on? not what the family who were pressured into putting their kelpie down dont need to find out after the fact

I know how disappointed when a old time breeder sold me a "brood bitch" 12 months old knowing she had grade 4 luxating patella. being a novice i didnt have a clue what i was looking at, but sure learned fast. if there were photos of the different grades walking, newbies would know on the spot what they were looking at. who knows, maybe even that old breeder didnt realise what it was. my vet sure did.

if breeders got off their collective butts and began addressing reducing the incidence of breathing , walking, u name it problems that puppy buyers find in their pets...... surely a breed that needs constant vet care needs reevaluating by the breeders long before a doco like "pedigree dogs exposed " ever got the chance to be made? its been a long time comming. now the pidgeons have come home to roost and there is more butt covering than proacting.. pity

now you are on the mark. everyone and anyone can become interested in becoming a registered breeder. just as there are billions of people now on this planet there are equally billions with very different ideas. the big mistake members of the canine bodies made was decide to begin witchhunts for "backyard/puppy farmers" among the registered breeder ranks. instead of witchhunts in which as usual no one can even agree on what that actually constitutes. why couldnt it intead be an education program.. on the lines of.. What are you looking for in a Pedigreed puppy. educate puppy buyers what to look for! bright eyes, clean coat, health checked parents etc etc learn the breeds strong points and the problem points. do you mind if your puppy's parents have 3 hernia's as long as they are australian champions.? do you mind if the parents never saw a show but look lovely AND dont have hernia's? the list can get pretty long but isnt educating a buyer what to look for themselves going to help? always ask can you return the pup if your vet finds something not right? if the answer is no, keep looking. ... does mum and dad walk normally, do their eyes look normal? what does their mouth look like? if they look odd then the puppys could too. surely this would sort out things far better and less damage to the membership than witch hunting? i asked this question a very looooooong time ago and no one seems to be learning much and look where its got them. running scared because now all registered breeders risk being branded...just like they were warned in the first place. told u so has a nice ring to it.

There is a heck of a lot of confusion. ive friends who have told me they have bought a "registered" dog or puppy. when they show me the "registration" its their microchip papers for council registration????? so to many people "registered" is assumed to mean pedigree but they have no idea what they are supposed to receive for that. In these cases all they have is a lifetime registration with the council one word can sure have a lot of different meanings cant it?

such happy news, now to get him to fess up as to where hes been and whats hes been up too.

They are still dogs right? Dogs are living animals and as such may have flaws, quirks, failings. There are no perfect living things. maybe im getting it wrong, but seems the infernece is registered breeders are supposed to have perfect ones? with no realisation that all animals have their own personality regardless of who bred them or raised them . well remember a litter of 9 and one black and tan girl steadfastly stayed in the bed they were raised refusing to leave even to try food as they grew older. she was a loner no matter how much attention was paid to her, then at 2 years after her owner had began to despair all she ever wanted to do was watch the world go by, began to interact with the other dogs and the family. by 3 she was happlily part of the group. but as a puppy, she was a worry.

so right, my uncle had a pet male raised when his mum was hit by a car, living in the outback, eg station out of Inverell, there was no way he could be stopped from returning to the homestead but he was very docile so he was allowed to stay, and came and went over the years with no problems. except one day a drunken shearer decided to box him and hit him so hard blood came from his nose and one ear. he shook his head, leaped forward, grabbed the shearer round the torso and in one stoke disembowled him. the idiot died and the roo had to be shot for everyones safety. incredibly sad for all concerned. just watch a video of a roo fight and realise never let a roo grab you or grab at you. they are very good at defence, deadly defence. never take a roo for granted.

They can tell a dogs external heath - glowing coat, good muscle tone and fitness, clear and bright eyes, happy in itself etc. They can assess a dogs basic mental health - happy to be there, bright, aware, comfortable in what it is doing. They can assess a dogs structural health - how it meets the structural standard for the breed, how the dogs structure supports or hinders its ability to do its job, how the dog moves, that it is happy and comfortable moving at a pace and in a style suitable for the breed. They can NOT assess long term genetic or internal health or look into a crystal ball and see how the dog will be health-wise tomorrow or a year from now. But that is not the role of a dog show judge. A judge is there to judge TO THE STANDARD. The standard does not address health isses beyond the types of things I have listed above which can be assessed EXTERNALLY on the dog in front of the judge. Any further assessment of health is carried out by the breeder, sometimes under the auspices of official and formal schemes run by the ANKC, breed club or other organisations and sometimes not. Assessment in accordance with the standard by a show judge is just part of it and never ever have dog shows set themselves up to be a one stop shop assessment of all elements of the 'health' of a dog :thumbsup: "Assessment in accordance with the standard by a show judge is just part of it and never ever have dog shows set themselves up to be a one stop shop assessment of all elements of the 'health' of a dog" I remember being told something along those lines once, when i queried how could a dog well actually two dogs become australian champions with three hernia's in another case again two dogs, was looking after them for friends on holiday and my 7 yr old visitor asked whats wrong with them. as i was going to the vet for one of mine i took the pair just to make sure they were ok, i had noticed they moved funny myself. grade 4 patella was the answer. if a 7 yr old child could see something was not normal. i asked how could they win 100 challenge points? to be told by a judge the above. with the additional comment judges are not vets. as for the hernias? where is making champions with these bettering any breed? walked away shaking my head and still wondering

how weird? it double posted

was that the arab stallion who used to do endurance races when he was in his late 20's? Cant recall his name but I think I'd know if it I heard it. fancy remembering that. it was so many years ago. this ones name was Aeneas and he won 5 tom quilty 100 mile buckles without a single vetout. considering the average vetout rate was 60% n more. then went on to win ironwoman races against horses a third his age. with margins of half and 1/4 of a mile Yep, that's the one! Aeneas I believe he was dual registered as an Australian Stock Horse. What is your connection to him? Yes he was. He was my best freind, partner and forever is in my heart. He brought me out on the other side of a very hard peroid of my life. Thank you

was that the arab stallion who used to do endurance races when he was in his late 20's? Cant recall his name but I think I'd know if it I heard it. fancy remembering that. it was so many years ago. this ones name was Aeneas and he won 5 tom quilty 100 mile buckles without a single vetout. considering the average vetout rate was 60% n more. then went on to win ironwoman races against horses a third his age. with margins of half and 1/4 of a mile

awesome reminds me of this photo, the horse is 26 years old

Sorry. but showing a dog by the very nature of its activity is a great way to socialise a dog. Where do you get unsocialised Show Dogs??? you would think so, but with a breed whose very standard says, suspicious of strangers, doesnt mean its not socalised, it does mean it doesnt go wagging its tail to strangers... sadly judy guards rehomed one that started judys nighmare didnt like the vet and everything went down hill from there, including said vet convincing the new owner the dog needed to be euthanised.. such a sad outcome on all fronts. when will some like that vet realise a dog does have rights to not like everyone...seems that dog was a very good judge of character in hindsight.

how apalling, so everything old is new again. never forget everyones horror some 50 yrs ago when the neighbours cat dissappeared only to be discovered when he returned home all his claws and teeth had been pulled out. didnt take einstein to figure what his intended fate had been. the good news was he led a happy and contented life for a further ten years and no...no stranger could get within a 100 mtrs of him either anymore.

so how do you define "sound decisions" been reading a thread on a suspected HD puppy. didnt take long to suspect the ethics of the breeder. "She was xrayed by the vet and there is no actual bone damage yet (as far as he could tell, and they looked perfectly fine to me), he just said there would be if she didn't get the weight off and stop over doing it with jumping, walking on back legs and running as her ligaments(?) are way too long, allowing her hips to pop in and out. I did contact the breeder a couple of months ago as she was already 6 kilos at 4 months (from memory, not sure exactly) and I was worried. Her reply was that the other puppies in the litter were also that weight. Obviously getting the sinking feeling that I have paid a puppy farmer." then wonders of wonders it was discovered pup is super gangly growing phase and very overweight for age. so no one is safe. considering how many 0 dogs and bitches can and do produce varying degrees of HD in the susceptable breeds and even some that its rarely seen can have it happen. i know of a pup was never better than the runt, the breeder spent mega time giving it every chance but it was one third the size of its litter mates . it was sold to a pet home at only the cost of its vaccinations as the breeder was concerned about its size suspecting dwarfism or something like that although it passed all its puppy checks fine but by 12 months was diagnosed with a form of hd. although no op was needed. bingo one unethical breeder. having bred best in show winners and never one like it before is no protection from your reputation down the gurglier with one disaster. so is a puppy farmer anyone who has a subsound pup ever turn up? that will rule out every breeder sooner or later, thats how breeding works. there is a very old saying.....put the best to the best and hope, for the best.....what does that mean? you have absolutely no guarantees the progeny will turn out half as good as the parents. and why does the story of the ugly duckling exist? because so many ugly duckings can turn out to be the swan, leaving an awful lot with egg on their faces. so if you ever breed you better realise one day (unless you never sell a pup) the day WILL COME, when you will be accused of being a puppy farmer................

waiting with baited breath.... that should be real interesting steve..........

Paypal. Thanks she doesnt want to pay using paypal... as you get the fees with it. Will tell her direct deposit You have to pay more for an international money transfer anyway. Pay pal is instant and clears straight away. the other can take days. exactly. why pay 30 for a $160 bank cheque for nz when paypal is a fraction of that?

how incredibly sad he didnt make it to the same trees he told his wife too.

you poor thing. some vet nurses,, some vets too for that matter need a lesson in manners. bit of humaity too at times. never forget the vet who had the hide to tell me any dog that cant tolerate ivermectin should die, that would eliminate the weak from the breed. also told me same thing about my chihuahua litter that he killed, he vaccinated them all with the full one ml dose, knowing his boss (he was a new employee) only ever vaccinated my 7 week old ones with half a mil as we had found too many died otherwise. the only satisfaction i got was he was fired. all 4 of my beautiful bitch pups died, being their mums last litter, n only daughters didnt help the grieving either.