asal

well its sure in the news now. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8045329/RSPCA-apologies-putting-boys-pet-kitten-Marshmallow-without-consent.html?fbclid=IwAR2nz8fc3VJtRB2DAVByam5NkRCLC6a6SpkOW1dws-s4y9FGmXiDfBL9tyI for a second I thought the story must be from the uk? with that in the link. but it is the Queensland Australia edition.

May be in another state, but pity didnt think to send a copy of this to the enquiry. note the mental anguish of the targets. perhaps one of the weak links of the human mind, has great difficulty coping with bullying. EWS SPORT ENTERTAINMENT BUSINESS LIFESTYLE HAVE YOU HEARD? PLACE AN AD SUBSCRIBE BREAKING NEWS WESTERN AUSTRALIA NATIONAL WORLD TECHNOLOGY OPINION WEATHER GALLERIES Greenough vets Matt and Ina Carrick, who argue they were harshly treated by the RSPCA. Credit: Supplied, Richard Rossiter WA News RSPCA accused of abusing power as WA vets ask to appear before parliamentary inquiry JOHN FLINTPerthNow August 10, 2015 6:37PM SCATHING REPORT: Former boss attacks ‘lost’ RSPCA PRIMARY PRODUCERS: RSPCA seen as ‘anti-farming’, inquiry hears INA Carrick remembers her first wedding anniversary in 2010. Instead of being with her vet husband Matt in Darwin for a long-planned romantic getaway, she was in a Geraldton courtroom, having been flown there — at the RSPCA’s expense — from the Northern Territory, via Perth, to be an expert witness for the charity in a horse cruelty case. The equine vet and horse-hospital owner had offered to give evidence via video link from Darwin, but the RSPCA prosecutor felt she would have a bigger impact in the courtroom. Her opinion on all things horse-related was evidently valued. Fast-forward five years and the Carricks are readying to provide different testimony. They have asked to appear before a parliamentary inquiry into the iconic institution they once supported. They now share the view of former long-time RSPCA president Eric Ball that the WA branch of the animal welfare organisation has lost its way. They claim to know too well the culture of “provocation and punishment” that Mr Ball says has replaced “care and compassion”. Dr Ina Carrick said the animal charity chose the big stick over diplomacy in a dispute that flared last year. Without any inspection of her horses, Dr Carrick said she and her husband were hit with a legal order to erect a shelter in their 8ha paddock at Greenough Equine Veterinary Centre. The paddock was home to 24 mares used as part of an embryo transfer program. The mares, most of them rescued from a knackery, were in perfect health, the Carricks say. The order — a Direction Notice issued under Section 40(1)(b) of the Animal Welfare Act — was signed by the RSPCA’s Perth-based chief inspector Amanda Swift and delivered to the horse hospital in March last year. The RSPCA claims it had received three complaints. “The complainants were concerned about the welfare of horses in the yards without shelter when the temperature was in the high 30s and rose to over 41C,” RSPCA chief executive David van Ooran told The Sunday Times. “The site was visited by the local inspector who took photographs and brought the matter to the attention of staff at the clinic. “Attempts to engage with the clinic were unsuccessful.” The Carricks dispute this. They suspect the Direction Notice was retribution for having spoken up for other horse owners in the area, who had been told by the RSPCA to erect shelters. Dr Carrick said horses in the area “don’t need to be provided with shelter 365 days of the year”. “Low humidity and ever- present strong cooling southwest ocean winds means that there are very few days in a year that a horse might feel any ill effect from the sun in this area,” she said. “In our situation we did have the contingencies to move them to paddocks with shelter as well as deploy several 100m x 20m sprinkler systems, if and when the need arose ... We were never asked about our contingency plans.” The order gave the Carricks four weeks to erect a shelter or be prosecuted and face a penalty of up to $20,000 and one year’s imprisonment. Instead they de-stocked the property. It resulted in the temporary closure of the hospital and the shutdown of its embryo transfer business. “We had spent a lot of money developing that business,” Dr Carrick, 34, said. “It’s gone, it’s finished.” They also had to scramble to find alternative properties to agist the 24 mares. The couple said the powerful notice also had implications for Matt’s vet practice, Bos Vet & Rural. Between the two businesses, there were five vets on site, but the RSPCA had overlooked their expertise. Dr Matt Carrick, 37, said the RSPCA wouldn’t tell him what type of shelter he needed to erect, or provide any specifications. “I took a stand because I just couldn’t handle being bullied and intimidated in this way when there was absolutely no welfare outcome to be gained by it,” he said. The Carricks were offended to be sent by the RSPCA “irrelevant” guidelines for running an equestrian event, as well as a dictionary definition of the word “ensure”. “As veterinarians with more than 20 years of combined experience we felt shocked, ” the couple wrote in a submission to the inquiry. “Serving a large veterinary practice with these type of documents (was) provocative.” Horses in a paddock at Greenough Equine Veterinary Centre. Image supplied by the RSPCA. Credit: Supplied To the Carricks, it felt like the RSPCA was throwing its weight around. Though the charity itself has no power, it can nominate staff to be appointed general inspectors under the Animal Welfare Act. The appointments are made by the Director General of the Department of Agriculture and Food WA (DAFWA), which is responsible for administering the Act. Dr Ina Carrick said the good health of the mares was pivotal to the success of the embryo transfer business. “I employed a nurse to look after these horses and to make sure they’re fed well, that their feet were looked after, that they’re drenched properly, they’re wormed properly, they’re vaccinated and that there are no mares that are getting bullied,” she said. “I went to a massive effort in order to ensure these mares were absolutely 100 per cent in their prime. The fact that there was no shelter in that paddock did not impair their welfare at all. If any were sick or showing even the slightest effect from heat, of course I would have acted on that because it would also not be in the horse’s welfare interests. It would not be in my interests either.” Even when MP Paul Brown intervened on behalf of the Carricks, the RSPCA refused to revoke the notice. At the crux of the dispute is the fact that a Direction Notice issued under Section 40(1)(b) of the Act cannot be reviewed or overturned by the Agriculture Minister, or the State Administrative Tribunal (SAT). Had a similar Direction Notice been issued under Section 47 of the Act, the Carricks could have appealed to the Minister or the SAT. The couple were told by DAFWA that Section 40(1)(b) applied to urgent situations. DAFWA investigated and wrote to the Carricks saying it would issue a newsletter to all inspectors to make “a reoccurence of an inappropriate use of Section 40 of the Act unlikely”. The newsletter says: “A direction under Section 40(1)(b) for food, water or shelter is to be used where there is an urgent and immediate need for the provision.” Ina Carrick of Greenough Equine Veterinary Centre with one of the mares on her property. Credit: Supplied Dr Ina Carrick said the RSPCA told her they disagreed with DAFWA’s instruction. And in a response to The Sunday Times, Mr van Ooran defended the use of Section 40(1)(b) over Section 47. “Direction Notices are issued by an authorised inspector who uses the section of the Act they consider most appropriate for individual situations,” he said. “In this particular case, the Direction Notice was complied with and the matter resolved.” Dr Carrick said the whole experience had been emotionally and financially draining. “At one point I stood in the middle of the paddock crying my eyes out while talking to the Department of Agriculture because I didn’t know what to do,” she said. “We were quite naive. We thought, ‘Surely this can’t be happening’. They don’t have any evidence that the horses’ health was compromised. No one to this day from the RSPCA has seen even one of these horses, so therefore they have no evidence ... But I wasn’t aware they didn’t need evidence. “After doing some research we found out that the Direction Notice we were given was irreversible and we could not appeal against it and that not even the Minister for Agriculture could reverse it ... We were informed by the department that it was only to be used for cases of extreme animal welfare problems, but it was it used against us ... We don’t want this to happen to anyone else. “Are all of my clients in breach of the Act because their yards are not under cover and their cattle are exposed?” MLC Paul Brown told State Parliament it was “mind-boggling” that a civilian organisation had such powers. [email protected]

I heard stories they can enter your home and take your mobile, tablet and computer, but didn't believe it. There it is in black and white in the order that had issued against this woman.the update at the bottom is weird? first the kitten is dead and then it isn't? Oh my, they got the warrant to take her body from her owner because she had taken her body home after they killed her, incredible ! Belinda Stevens 25 February at 01:57 NEVER!! AND I REPEAT NEVER!!! TAKE YOUR FUR BABIES TO RSPCA @wacol.. this is my story... I took my childrens kitten (marshmellow) down to the rspca at wacol after she was abit lethargic which she was like once before and made a full recovery! I walked in to their reception are and told the lady behind the counter that she was not feeling the best and was not sure if it was hypothermia?? She took my beloved kitten out the back for the vet to check over....(normal procedure) anyone would think...I had only given the lady my phone number also normal procedure, she said to me if I needed treatment for my kitten I would need to surrender her and if she was to sick I would need to give them (RSPCA) permission to euthanize her .. I refused euthanization and had not signed any paperwork as of yet when all of a sudden the vet has come to talk to me saying that marshmallow had to be put to sleep! I assumed that my kitten had to be sedated in order for them to check her. I was then led to the consultation room where my childrens kitten lay I noticed she was not moving and as I approached her she was not breathing also. I screamed "you killed our cat" where then the vet turned and said "arent you the foster caregivers" I replied " NO THIS IS MY CAT" her instant reply was "OH SHIT" not at any stage did i sign or give permission for them to put my kitten to sleep!!!!! They just stood there dumb founded not even 1 word!! I grabbed my now dead kitten in which they killed and walked out! With my son and I in tears. I then thought that this was not good enough and went to walk back in but to no despair all of the staff members hid out the back so i still stood there for 30 mins waiting buzzing the bell and still nothing!! It wasnt until someone else walked out that i finally was able to get back in to their reception to ask for numbers and names to make a formal complaint! I will be taking it further believe me I'll have their jobs for it!! And the worst part was telling my children that their beloved kitten was killed by them !!! This is now where our beloved kitten lays due to the hands of RSPCA!!!!!! ******UPDATE******* RSPCA have now come to my premises with a search warrant!!! REFUSED TO LET THEM IN....police were called....searched my premises asked where marshmallow was and my daughter ran off with her and hid.... as soon as she did that the inspector said " that's obstruction and we are now seizing marshmallow" I replied " oh no your not I'll fight you on that one" So they entered my property and looked at my animals told me I needed to clip my Maltese and seek medical treatment for my other dog due to his eczema...in which I replied yes I have cream for that, mind you he didnt inform that he was recording the whole thing?? I lost it after he said " you would have surrendered her anyway" had to walk away after I called him a wanker ! My son then came home from up the shop and turned to me and said "does he have marshmallow" I replied "no" which in return he replied " you sure " so I told him no he doesnt have her. The only thing they were worried about today was getting marshmallow but guess what they didnt and never will!

Another massive rspca fail. its gaining shares on facebook. pity the press dont do a follow up, only way to shame em though https://medium.com/@ClaireJHarris/the-rspca-has-responded-to-my-recommendations-32cf13c248f5

it was pretty upsetting listening to the representatives from the National Farmers Federation...........they didn't have a clue. were saying what a wonderful working relationship the NFF has collaborating with the rspca. even worse, happy with them doing the prosecuting with not a freaking clue that was not their field at all. Had always been done by the Public Prosecutor until they decided there was more money to be made doing it with their own inhouse team of money gatherers , (and that's literally), he became the President of rspca nsw. Talk about conflict of interest, wasn't even put out for tender

Odd comment The fanaticism to eliminate puppy farms borders on manic, along with the demands government micromanage all owner's. Curiously all it's achieved is the decimation of ANKC member's and the certification of more and more what? Puppy Farms? We live in interesting times. Prime example of be careful what you wish for.

Hey, How many know you can listen to the people being interviewed tomorrow? Could have today, But I didnt know You can listen live, tomorrow.......... just click on the links to listen tomorrow. wish had replay of todays available.. only just learned this https://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/committees/listofcommittees/Pages/committee-details.aspx?pk=263&fbclid=IwAR1BcynOOEbG9bwO4FUNk-pOfrBclCGA9i2vAxpfBMzxYUPAWzQNezDfJKw#tab-hearingsandtranscripts This is the direct link to the list of people who will be interviewed and asked questions and the times they will be... its two pages of names and times. https://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/lcdocs/transcripts/2293/Hearing Schedule - 13 Feb 2020.pdf This is the direct link to the webcast for tomorrow. 13/2/2020 https://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/pages/macquarieroom-webcast-page.aspx

Its remarkable how few have noticed the 'show' scene is pretty new actually. As Scratch pointed out, the show scene has done exactly that. limited gene pool and focused on too few traits to the detriment of the entire animal. Has morphed entire breeds into something else all in the name of a blue ribbon. The King Charles Spaniel was once the Cavalier King Charles in appearance. Until it was decided to recreate the dogs in King Charles paintings. Without the paintings who would have guessed what they once were. so many people have been asking for decades, why? so many posts with Photos of champions some 80 years ago that look nothing like the breed today. The ability to reinterpret a standard is incredible when its laid out in photos. its not just the dog world that is seeing this . My Uncle bred champion Persians in the 1950's , today the only place you can find them is roaming the streets as a feral or on old chocolate boxes. Now they have no muzzle, huge eyes and no tear ducts. Well not usable ones anyway. The show scene seems to make people forget the living work of art they are creating is a LIVE animal who would like to be able to breathe without veterinary intervention. breed without veterinary intervention and be able to move and live without pain. the show scene does not take that into account. So many breeds are so short faced they need surgery to breathe or suffocate on a hot day. legs so badly angled are arthritic by 7, in a horse with a normal lifespan of 20 or more that's pretty horrific to say the least. but these are bred and sold for millions in america, aka halter bred QH's https://equineink.com/2011/04/24/have-halter-horses-become-the-bodybuilders-of-the-equine-world/ Pity those who want to create works of art, dont restrict themselves to morphing clay or bronze instead of living creatures.

its all the usual political furphy to get votes. Pet shops will still be able to sell puppies through the window, just that they will have to be "rescue" puppies. and all it means is that the commercial breeders have to pay to be 'registered' same now as victoria and qld.. = money in govt coffers. its all a public relations feel good exercise. so now every 'breeder' will be 'registered' so joe public wouldnt have a clue which is an ankc breeder or a now 'registered' and legal 'puppy farm' except once its registered its no long a puppy farm its a 'registered breeder' wonder if they will have 'bin numbers' like qld or a different name? thats the only unanswered question perhaps Priceless, so because "some WA pet shops sourced thousands of puppies a year from illegal farms from over east instead of selling pedigrees responsibly sourced from the Canine Association of WA, DogsWest." Only rescues will be allowed instead? Nothing like punishing the majority because of a few. wonder if she will legislate all men over 14 will have to be castrated because some become rapists? Same mentality, so lucky for the men of australia that the majority of politicians are male and she hasnt a hope of getting that passed.

Well this is in Australia. wonder why it was fine to kill the quail in their eggs? let alone why seize an incubator full of eggs? Interesting, but tragic, this is now the second case I have heard of, the other target did not ask for advice until after they learned two of their pets had been killed by the seizing inspectors and the others sold, now facing court charges. they too only have photos of their pets to remember. The two killed were said to be underweight yet one had just finished laying had their vet said she was in normal condition for just after lay eggs? so if you have pet reptiles, the eye has turned to include them too now. take care folks Stormi Michelle Anderson 14 hrs Hi. I'm Stormi. I am autistic with a PTSD diagnosis and recently finished an honours year / 4th qualification in psychology. Requesting URGENT help. If you can help please read everything here (or expand this post): https://www.facebook.com/donate/165371678210659/165422614872232/ PLEASE HELP!! My emotional support animals were taken away!!!! And also very loved animals which belonged to two of my housemates. I cannot fight this alone. Please invite, share, or donate if able to. EVERYTHING helps. This situation has sent my anxiety and depression into absolute overload as my animals were and are my family. They have been taken against my will. All reptiles of mine that were taken were emotional support animals many of which I have owned for 5+ years and helped in managing symptoms of PTSD and anxiety. I am autistic. They also took my animals belonging to my two housemates. They seized an incubator of 70+ fertile quail eggs that I advised needed heat, but they unplugged and took it thereby killing any embryos. Please help us fight to get back our much loved pets & emotional support animals. We are starting this page to try to raise enough money to help pay for legal fees to help us fight to get back our pets that have been taken by an "animal welfare organisation." We are now being taken to court with the 'statement' from the organisation being based on made up evidence, exaggerations, distortions and misinformation and need to try to raise $3000 to pay for legal representation to fight these charges and have the truth come out. We have been denied video footage of when they took them by the organisation (who had body cameras). They have also advised that they hope to charge me $6000+ in boarding fees after taking them which I plan to fight through court. All reptiles we owned had been extremely well looked after and handled daily while in our care. I had met all legal requirements and appropriate licensing requirements to have these animals. We were regularly approached by people from our community when we had the reptiles out exploring our front yard. A lot of people used to stop by and ask to hold our reptiles or ask to take photos of our well-handled animals. A lot of these people are also unable to understand why these animals were taken away and believe the animals should be returned. They took my emotional support animals, nine of one of my housemates animals, and one animal belonging to a separate housemate. A page dedicated to our pet reptiles had been set up https://www.facebook.com/pg/TempestsSnakes/photos/?ref=page_internal that shows a number of people from the community holding our animals. We had become somewhat well known as 'the reptile people' by a large amount of people who saw us outside with our reptiles in the sunlight on a daily to almost daily basis. Background - Early December 2019 just before my birthday (that I didn't want to celebrate after this tragic loss) we had officers from an "animal welfare" organisation come to our property with a warrant containing unfounded and untrue information. This warrant was then used as a reason for these officers to take our animals which were all unharmed and in good health. While attending the property the officers were made aware that we were in the process of cleaning enclosures (which would have been very obvious due to the officers being direct witnesses to the fact my housemate was actually wearing cleaning gloves and a number of other cleaning items that were being used which are actually shown in photos that are trying to be used as evidence against us). We cleaned the reptiles weekly, or fortnightly at the very most. Hours per day was spent handling them and on animal care. One animal was left on an "educational direction" that could have also been used to leave the other animals with us if these officers had any concerns. (It took only a few hours to action the educational direction which requested our galah to eat pellets not bird seed, and two water bowls instead of one), and any other issues would have been able to be changed upon request without the officers using their power to take animals as their first and only option on their first visit). We are not sure why animals had to be taken at all as the vet that attended our property with the officers marked almost all reptiles she accessed as being in reasonable condition (one was marked as underweight who we had recently purchased from another person and we had been taking steps to make sure this snake was gaining weight in our care). This organisation provided little information or reasoning other than saying they wouldn't want to return any of our animals and any legal or human rights I have feel as though they have been taken away. Their only reason for taking them on the form was 'as evidence', yet none of us have been found guilty and we have done nothing. I have heard horror stories of perfectly health animals being seized then resold and also horror stories from numerous other people after I have open spoken and written about this who have experienced the same thing from the same organisation!! We have been offered very little transparency as to the reasons behind this. We asked for other options. We asked if they wanted changes to state them and we would comply. They refused. We asked if we could transfer the reptiles to family or friends instead of having them taken. They refused. We requested full video footage of them taking them as they had body cams. They refused. I requested to visit my emotional support animals. They refused until I found I had a legal right to inspect. I requested to handle my own animals as part of inspecting/visiting. They've refused. I've requested direct veterinary evidence that makes sense or contains any causal or credible evidence that warrants this. They've refused. We have to fight this through court, and We NEED HELP. We need to try and raise $3000 to pay for legal representation to fight this. I am doing my best with self-employment, busking, and desperately searching for employment after finishing my honours year in psychology at university. I am living off $10 per week for my own food, and all other money goes towards legal costs. While I've always had enough to afford to care for and feed my animals when they were in my care (they ate first, even if that meant I went to free food places), all my money now needs to go towards getting legal help to fight this so I can have them back in my care. Please help us get back our much loved animals. I will provide invoices and receipts for any legal costs so that people know any money (even the tiniest of donations can help) is going to a genuine cause. This is a very frightening experience, and any help (even in the form of sharing this fundraiser) is appreciated. Thank you again to each and any of you who can help. I am also looking for employment and willing to do any work I am capable of in the Brissie area if anyone knows of any jobs available through word of mouth (I am also applying for many through the standard channels). Losing my beautiful animals sent me into a spiral of panic and depression, and I need to fight to get them back especially given all are healthy and there is no valid, justifiable reason for them being taken away against my will. Please SHARE or invite. Or please donate (even $1 can go a long way) if able to. THANK you ♥ ♥ ♥ https://www.facebook.com/donate/165371678210659/165422614872232/

Judging by the links I think this lady is in the uk. the chilling bit is her story is a carbon copy of so many peoples day they learn the full meaning of helpless. https://www.change.org/p/help-us-campaign-against-the-hypocrisy-of-the-rspca?recruiter=9635855&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=psf_combo_share_initial&recruited_by_id=68601e10-c19d-012f-0874-4040b09128dc&utm_content=fht-48787-en-gb%3Av5

corrected the last sentence to include the vets assessment of his chances of survival of the op.

Any updates about the fate of the last six dogs they had not killed because of the uproar over the killing of the first batch of four ? So hoping they ended up giving them to one of the rescues who proved so well they could successfully re-homed their kennel mates.

Finally this video has come back to light. such a shame I could not find it before the enquiry submissions closed. was amazed at the time, they did not cut the footage of the inspector so disgusted he resigned on the spot rather than be a party to the slaughter, https://animaljusticeaustralia.wordpress.com/2017/05/31/rspca-shoot-healthy-cattle-they-claim-were-starving/?fbclid=IwAR0chtgqLILlq9hOFUoOmqnHPjxXlHnfQxUXTpd9E0y-x6T6oqU3R0C2S3w

The second stage is let them think you have left, but you haven't, you have gone where you can watch unseen..... the second they are naughty...........AND it will happen, just as you have discovered..........you come carrying on like a pork chop...........bad girl/boy! STOP that immediately..........and they begin to get the idea you have eyes in the back of your head and have the all seeing eye.....some breeds, especially working breeds are bred for initiative remember, I expect they have it in spades too....so they are independent free thinkers remember... its what makes them good at their job...........and outsmart you if your lazy.........remember

I know nothing about marammas, but my dogs I never turn my back on them during the training process. Be it not to chase the chooks, sheep, cattle or horses... or pull the washing off the line.............. if I have to leave, then the pup either comes with me, or goes into a pen until I return. To leave them unattended while still learning the rules, it setting them up to fail..........may seem a drag and seem to be taking sooooo long, but once trained its for life and these weeks/months will be as nothing compared to the years ahead you will enjoy.

Like the identical twins being told by ancestry that they had different ancestors percentages :-)........ Oops

just posted on faceplant " In light of this... what details do you take before allowing someone to view your puppies.... I’m seriously lost for words about this situation Take a photo of the car they are in and before showing puppies ask to see their license and take a photo. All The information you need to give to the police N B Great idea, I'm only 5 mins away with someone coming to look at a pup today and this post is the first thing to make me nervous Hide or report this T if you ask to see license and they are unhappy for you to take a photo, say you are not happy for them to see your puppies. M Not the first time it has happened I am very reluctant to allow strangers into my house or give address After weeks of messages and then phone conversations, if they have passed my radar I then meet them at a dog show and they can see the pups then. They don’t get to take the pups then. If possible I do a home inspection after that If they are ok then I allow them to come to my home L W The only people I allow to view my puppies are prospective buyers and known friends. I have name, address, contact details and alternative contact details of all prospective buyers. I must say I'm glad I don't live in suburbia, such an awful thing to happen. " Well remember the headlines a few years ago, a Chihuahua puppy was stolen at gun point.

Some of these are hilarious https://onedio.co/content/under-horse-photographer-captures-horses-from-underneath-14938

MY boss has vintage cars, he will NEVER let a buyer come to his home. No one in their club will allow anyone to come to their home to pick up parts they have decided to sell. strangely many advertising sites tell sellers to always meet in a public place, never allow a buyer to know where you live. Yet the dog world makes it a must that a person you know nothing about, other than the initial contact phone call or email the RIGHT. to expect to come to your home, inspect everything and assess whether in their opinion you are qualified to be considered ETHICAL. decades ago, the ROYAL NSW Canine Council... now rebranded DOGS NSW. ceased printing the names and addresses of breeders in their Litter notifications page. it had been standard practice for decades. Why? because once thieves realised there was easy money to be made taking entire litters in many cases the parents too. what was on the seat of one of the theives arrested with a vehicle packed with stolen puppies and dogs? Yep. A copy of the Canine Journal, folded at the Litter registration page with circles around the planned pickups for that day. So you see now its blackmail. "So question for the honest, ethical dog breeders. Do you have strict level of keeping people out I mean. At this point i would have paid her 4k. So a lot money if I'm trying to just get a look to steal dogs." So your options are few. to say no, is to automatically be interpreted as to self label as "dishonest, unethical" Open your gates and pray. because the alternative is you have just convicted your self of not being an "honest, ethical dog breeder"... I found prayers and thoughts, were little comfort when the day arrives to learn that lovely couple who came to see the puppies, or in some cases not a clue who seemed so nice, quite obviously was not as they seemed and you come home or wake up to discover some one has come back and "rescued" (its the new word now) who ever they decided will be gone to enrich their lives............or sell ..........which ever they decide. Ive had pure bred dogs since 1978 and over that period . NO? Correct that to since "ETHICAL" MEANS they have to come to your home.. no meeting them at McDonalds or Kentucky fried chicken for a meet and greet with who you are happy to let them inspect. I used to take , mum, dad, the kids and any grandparents who wanted to come for the ride. interestingly one year, I had a visit from the RSPCA after one such. The concerned potential puppy family had dutifully taken down my licence plate and informed them they were very concerned about the welfare of the dogs as I was living in the car with them... So our kind, helpful police, gave the rspca my home address.........only I seemed to consider it odd that although the police had given them my home address.........surely inadvertantly thus proving I lived in a house? They still came out to inspect the place and my car to ensure I wasn't living in it.. So since the new age and new rules. three disappeared while my husband was working on the car engine..........he heard the people stop at the gate and admire the puppies . he thought they were going up to the house to see me. but three dogs and puppy were gone when they left. but as he had not seen them and they sure did not knock on my door neither of us have a clue who they were. another I went out when I heard the car stop at the gate.... but they zoomed off at terrifying speed as I approached the car. only as I walked back did I two puppies were missing. to nick in that quick and grab and back to the car they obviously knew where they were kept. so again, repeat visitor. came home from shopping to have my neighbour tell me a lady had gone into my place and when questioned said she was out of petrol and looking to make a phone call. she advised her I wasn't home and welcome to use her phone.. she did think it odd she was wearing a lumber jacket in the middle of summer. it was only when it checked my dogs discovered three , four week old puppies were gone. nothing like a bit of excitement of wondering who will disappear today. If you decided to breed, remember, being a masochist might help you cope better, or perhaps derive more enjoyment from your hobby Welcome to the new age. if you have animals you are guilty, UNTIL proven innocent

never heard of any of them, do you have links so can look at them?

Hope you can find someone to show you how to put up her photo. Good luck. actually i realised today, I have no idea if she was a greenie.. all I know is she considered herself a tree hugger. guilty of just using the general term instead I like dingo's. like any canine it cannot be allowed to learn bad habits, be it a pet or wild. they have been camp dogs for over 40,000 years remember met a chap recently who has what he thought was a kelpie x. has only recently learned the people who gave it too him had found her and her siblings when they wandered into their place beside the national park. he has had some training issues. smart, affectionate but needs lots of work on recall, can scale a 6 foot fence as if it wasn't there has made keeping her home quite a challenge. until he solved it by building a large yard with roof for when she is not inside the house. My uncle used to care for the dingo's at the wildlife park that was home to skippy. think u know the one "skippy, the bush kangaroo". Also had a neighbour who had a pet dingo, she was just as affectionate as my border collie, mastered sit heel and stay. although recall was iffy if something caught her interest. She too could scale a fence as fast as a cat

it doesn't matter what some one approves or not. The fact is doing so is the best way to find out if a sire or dam carries not only good genes but will show up deleterious ones too. In which case it can be deleted from the gene pool. Now this cannot be done in dogs. it remains hidden until a dna test can be found. before the test for scids was found, the only way to know if you had a carrier was to either put it to known carriers, or mother to son or father to daughter's. As my horse had been accused of being a carrier even though he had never sired one, to find out I put him to his daughters. The results were not only clear, they were were outstanding saddle horses and in Andy's case became number 3 in the world. Another defeated 7,000 to win the National point score. of course in the dog world that now cannot happen because opinion is more important than fact. Line breeding has been the tool of many of the top breeders of all species, but the codicil is you need to have an aim and be prepared to accept and deal with the knowledge gained. the rules now ensure no one can use this tool in the future the hysteria about inbreeding being the cause of all evil has even extended to vets, now they tell you even a congenital defect was the result of inbreeding despite the fact there are two possibilities. "A congenital disorder is a medical condition that is present at or before birth. These conditions, also referred to as birth defects, can be acquired during the fetal stage of development or from the genetic make up of the parents." Now they just lump everything as genetic AND state the cause was "inbreeding" when in fact if it is genetic and not a developmenatal abnormality the parents genetic make up can still carry a defect without being related...... but it's far easier to say they must be "inbred" than go to the trouble of explaining. Although in the case of some, I dont think they even know the difference

When I bought my first chihuahua, I quickly noticed many breeders saw no negativity in continuing family lines that the mother could not deliver her puppies, some were generations of ceaser only deliveries? to me this was a cruelty issue. How many families who bought a pup from these lines was made aware if they decided to breed if they had bought a bitch puppy that was either too narrow in the pelvis, or too small to deliver. Was being handed a death sentence if they did not live within travelling distance of the local vet? in 1978 the standard had the sentence "In the case of equal merit, the more diminutive preferred" It only took attending a few shows to quickly realise a significant majority of judges didn't even pay lip service to "equal merit" , they simply called in the tiniest in the classes. So show males and bitches were significantly tiny, despite a standard that still stated then AND now............. "Weight: up to 2.7 kg (6 lbs), with 1.8-2.7 kgs (4-6 lbs) preferred." on the main show dogs both male and female were 1.2 k or less. Anyone who had a copy of Hilary Harmers book The Complete Chihuahua, she stressed the minimum weight for a breeding bitch. But the Aussie show scene was ignoring it. Pointed this out for years, suggested to a friend who was an international judge and bred chi's. that the "more diminutive preferred" needed removal as it was detrimental to the well being and health of the breed for decades. So many other things needed addressing in so many breeds but no one listened. and YES, YES, YES, a record of ages of the dogs is needed to help identify and preserve the long lived genes in all breeds. Cant express how disgusted and equally sad for the the pedigree dog world I felt when the first thing done after PDE aired was the offending words I had been asking be deleted for so long disappeared from the standard.........FINALLY. This the greatest weakness of the pedigree dog world. The failure to proactively lead by example. instead of only reacting AFTER being publicly shamed yes short faced breeds are cute.... BUT that is no excuse for shortening and shortening until the living work of art is suffering. the damage is not only to the dogs cats suffer the same insults to their health all in the name of a bloody blue ribbon and CH in front of its name. For decades, fellow members have been questioning, Why are our breeds morphing in the excuse of "improving" them when clearly the changes are getting so marked people have been posting "before" and "now" photos of the same breed, continually moving away from what it was, always excused by those selecting for the exaggerations as they are "improving". Arabians have suffered the same fate, as has the American Quarter Horse. At least the Arabians haven't ended up with hind legs so straight behind they have arthritis by 7. i began to see the "show" scene as the beginning of the end for health, soundness and temperament of so many breeds, Canine, Feline, and Equine. e.g. " OPENING UP A CAN OF WORMS (halter horses) Ok I'm a quarter horse man. Or anything that has QH influence whether it's a paint or whatever. And I like a big stout horse as much as the next guy.....But haven't we gone too far? Years ago in the old QH shows, they used to ride halter horses. YES, REALLY THEY USED TO RIDE THEM! Most (not all) of the modern day halter horses are laughable under saddle. They no longer are the model of what a riding horse should look like. They're overly-muscled, not flexible or athletic, and we've succeeded in breeding most of the good trainable minds out also. I'm not talking out of my butt here. I've been involved with some very successful horses and their breeders. I've ridden some that were good enough to make it to the Congress, etc. in halter. Kudos to the people for having good halter horses ridden! They brought pretty good money as dual purpose horses too. But they're the exception. Trying to talk the owners into breeding more usability into them is pointless. They know they won't win a halter class. Too specialized. In my opinion, a halter horse should be required to perform in at least 1 performance event. I know they won't be successful but maybe it would shame the breeders back into reality. I doubt I'm the only one who sees this problem and halter horses aren't the only specialized ones. Hunters don't even resemble QHs anymore, but I do think Halter horses are the most detrimental to the breed. What do you guys think? " https://equineink.com/2011/04/24/have-halter-horses-become-the-bodybuilders-of-the-equine-world/ My favourite breed the Arabian, has put so much emphasis on "animation" they are selecting for nut cases... The quiet, gentle kid friendly horses I knew in the 60's are the minority in the halter ring. only recently was an add for an Arabian filly.......THEIR selling point? SHE had LOADS OF SNORT!............... a GOOD Arabian, well once upon a time, is asleep until you mount up. only then did the head go up the tail go up and he or she looked like the fiery steed of old. Except said show off was totally attuned to you and loved to please. Temperament in a saddle horse is EVERYTHING. just as it is in your dog. I noted the QH chap mentioned the loss of temperament in his breed too. Will the show scene ever wake up? not so far But can only hope.

Update, Been advised if you had salt to the water it remains frozen even longer.