leopuppy04

It means 3. You can't compete in both CCD and Novice during the ONE trial (ie: AM trial) So you could enter 3 CCD classes and a Novice class over the weekend, but not both in 1 trial

:p woo hoo - Well gone Glorybea!!! And Arya - a HUGE pat on the back to you - sounds as though you should be jumping up and down with Tess' work!!!!! Goodonya! I'm glad the judge understood and probably hated taking thos points off I was showing instead on the Sat and came home with a PUPPY IN GROUP and RBCC with my little 11mth old girlie . Sunday - Leo had his first run through in Open - I received a few compliments saying he looked nice, but I beg to differ - he was a bit sloppy :D. No lack of enthusiasm though and we don't have any major issues - just gotta work on that d/b! So i'm a happy mum with both of my kids today . Well done again Arya!

Congrats Cosmo and Shoey!!!!! Glad to hear some good results coming through.... so when is the first trial????

hiya SB - yes I think the heeling has changed... BUT - if you read the 'rules' there is nothing stating about looking up at you etc - so what you describe, you could still score really well. So long as the dog is consistent and not infront of you one second and lagging the next, as far as *most* judges are concerned and the rule-book is concerned, the heeling you describe is fine. The UK heelwork to my knowledge has always been like that - no vision of light between you and the dog, head up etc,etc. They like that form of heeling over there and I must admit - so do I and I train for that type of heeling (although in AUS you can't have the dog touching you). I think it all comes down to appearance - people who train for the focus like the *look* of it - yet it doesn't mean that a dog watching you out of their peripheral vision can't see you change direction etc.... There is also the argument that a dog physically touching you finds the heeling easier as they just have to follow the guide of your leg..... I like the focus and I like the prancing (although I get them to 'gait' as opposed to 'prance').... I love the way they have complete focus on you also - so I train for that. Doesn't mean that i'm right, my way is the only way, or that someone who trains a dog who doesn't look won't score as high - each dog is just as likely to make the same mistakes . Keep in mind that if you train a dog to be constantly looking at you - you do 'strengthen' those muscles in the neck also - I do lots of tug games to build this up (yes, even with my anti-tugger Leo!). Certainly - your dog is not allowed to go too wide, but AUS doesn't demand the same precision of UK heelwork . You will find the criteria changes per country. Actually - it is not that difficult to teach at all - I found this method (of the focus etc) was MUCH easier than the 'old school' method I was initially taught. Also - it means that you don't have to constantly 'encourage' your dog in 'heel' and thus later have to fade out the talking. Put it this way - I have only spend a VERY short time training Kinta to 'heel' and she is already IMO heeling better than Leo.... just not for the duration yet :p. So although it looks like a lot of work, it honestly isn't! Especially when someone has shown you how to do it

Hiya Kristie, My 11mth old just wen through her 2nd fear period - joined with post-season blues, hormones raging and everything else. Her behaviours weren't as adverse as Hunta's, so I would advise what many have said on this list - keep her at home until she becomes more confident in herself - particularly if she is lacking confidence in the home envirnoment also. Kinta as 110% confident at home and only in certain areas did she show a mild fear response. So I only took her out in 'controlled' environments and was fussy with what I did with her - ie: at a show, I would keep her in a crate until we went into the ring etc. I think this helped her as she was able to 'absorb' the environment yet it full knowledge she was 'safe'. I kept up heaps of rewards for calm, confident behaviour and although I knew she was more 'sooky' I wouldn't really 'mollycoddle' that - she now seems to be back to her usual self - 8wks post season and about 2 -3 weeks after she initially started showing signs of her 2nd fear. If she was any more adverse, I would have kept her at home, but I was completely confident in the areas I was taking her that I could control her experiences as much as possible. BUT with what you describe for Hunta - keeping her at home sounds like the best decision.... She'll find her feet again

Interesting.... I haven't done the Shirley Chong clicker retrieve, but I do click a lot- and I have done 'snippets' of her steps. I think I covered (this is free shaping mind you) a whole HEAP of her steps in one session (5mins)..... definitely not 150 clicks per step.... surely I can't have albert einstein dogs - so I'd have to say I disagree with what she says - the steps are really basic aren't they - things like nudge the d/b etc,etc... hmm... it would only take me about 4-5 clicks to get that right?! As for time - well i'm a lazy trainer so it could be 3-4 weeks before the d/b resurfaces again

Don't see how it could be - all you were doing was watching...... weird

Not sure I understood your above comment but thought i'll say this anyway. In some instances i'm a 'purist' clicker - when I click I MUST treat. That is the way I build up the strong association. BUT I don't want my dog to be reliant on it, so when the clicker is away, it doesn't mean that you have lost opportunity for rewards. so I also use a bridge command such as "yes" to tell them when they have done the right thing. I use the clicker for 'training sessions, new tricks and precision work'..... Just thought i'd add it in so that you know to use your voice and other tools also so that you still have a reliable dog when the clicker is left at home . There are some good clicker links on my web page below

how did the ear pulling go !?

Sounds like you are doing everything right so far! *Keep the sessions short - clicker training causes dogs to burn out a LOT faster than normal training because we aren't giving them any clues. *this age is great to start with - you'll end up with a 'free thinker' - be it good or bad *If you like - you can just do a 2 min session of click,treat,click,treat,click,treat.... most dogs dont' need too long of that to figure our we like clicks :p *this is only a personal opinion - so you are definately not doing anything wrong, but if i'm shaping, I won't add a command in there. If i'm luring and clicking the correct behaviour - then a command is ok.... reason being - shaping is getting the dog to 'think' and they may not offer the exact behaviour and we have already cued it.... does that make sense? *Remember to click QUIET behaviours too - ie: lying on bed quietly, chewing on correct toys etc.... hmm... maybe not the last one (you'll distract them!). *Word of warning with the clicker and toileting - don't get too liberal with it :p. I have heard of cases (and had a little experience with it myself) of someone 'clicking' the toileting and the dog will stop mid-pee to get the treat - so it hadn't actually finished :D. I had problems with my girl going outside of home turf so I would get really excited when she did.... result is that she would do about 5 poos coz every time I praised, she'd stop coz she wanted the reward Someone else told me of the dog going through the 'motions' but not actually producing anything - they just wanted the treat! Good luck - it's heaps of fun!!!

So is anxiety a product of a comparatively low threshold to stress and pain and is it this that makes a dog 'biddable'? Nah - I don't think that this is what makes a dog biddable - there would be many genes that makes up that factor - coz you can have 'biddable' anxious dogs and confident yet biddable dogs. Personality would have to be one of the most complex parts of genetics - there are so many links between each other, not to mention, so many variations. And if the above is true, then wouldn't true 'aloofness' be a product of confident independence or a high threshold to stress and pain? When I picture an 'aloof' dog I see a dog that has an attitude of "Sure, you can pat me if you like, but I don't need you to" And just to complicate things more....I guess its possible that a dog could waver between anxious and aloof depending on the situation. Yes - I think you are exactly right - aloofness could also be pure confidents - I don't need constant tactile attention because i'm completely sure of myself. Definately - a dog could easily change it's 'emotions' - think of a dog that is perfectly confident and comfortable in it's own home - take it out and it falls to pieces!

Exactly! An aloof dog is neither nervous or shy - they just won't readily go up to a stranger - they aren't interested in plastering themselves all over them . It is a pity though as many breeders don't understand this (like you have said) and thus - if the dog backs away or shows signs of 'fear' they say - oh but it is the breed trait - they are meant to be reserved.....

Yep - i've heard this too. I think this is the reasoning to why Guide dog 'mums' spend sooo much time at the 'breeding facility' and come in weeks prior to whelping date - so that they can keep the stress to a minimum. Hmm... some substance to this yes, but there is still 'aloof' in my mind which isn't aggression (fear or otherwise) at all. For example, Aussies are supposed to be reserved. The correct 'reserved' aussie for me is one that doesn't readily go up to a stranger and screams "pat me!" (ok - so that rules Leo out ). A reserved Aussie is not one that is fearful but one that will just stand by it's owner - if a stranger went to pat it, it wouldn't bark, growl or shy away - it just doesn't readily seek out attention from others. So it is still perfectly confident in it's environment. But yes, there is a fine line and I have had many a discussion about this as to whether or not the trait is 'desirable' (mostly with US breeders/owners)... I think the people that do like the trait are ones that like to feel 'special' because their dog singles them out... Having said that - the standard clearly states that although they may be reserved 'upon first meeting' (ie: meet dog more than twice and you are 'known') it should show no signs of fear or aggression.... Sorry going off on a tangent - don't mean to offend anyone, and just trying to say that not all 'aloof' is fear aggression genetic - 100% genetic. To me - aggression can come in 3 forms - and can sit anywhere between the 3... 1. Genetic - so contributed to solely by parents 2. Environmental & Genetic - obviously the most common. 3. Environmental - perhaps mistreated earlier in life...

the males do tend to have 'bulkier' heads. Although it is assentuated in my pair as Kinta's head takes after her sire's side of the family - which tend to be a lot sharper. I'm not a real fan of her head myself coz I love the boofheads . Leo's head is beautiful IMO, although his muzzle is a little shorter than what it should be Oh I also noticed something else. Leo's ears on all the pics are pretty low in a submissive/respectful way but Kinta's are high (in a more attentive/interested way). I realized that Midge used to be like Kinta at the beginning but now it more like Leo. Does it change with age? Different lines again- and just different ear sets . Leo's just naturally sit a little lower - both are technically correct. Aussies ears should be semi-erect but the length of ear can't reach past the tip of the eye... so - that means if you grab midge's ear and pull it toward the centre of her eyes, it shouldn't reach past there http://www.shalakoaussies.com/BreedStandard_Ears.html This is a good website too

the males do tend to have 'bulkier' heads. Although it is assentuated in my pair as Kinta's head takes after her sire's side of the family - which tend to be a lot sharper. I'm not a real fan of her head myself coz I love the boofheads . Leo's head is beautiful IMO, although his muzzle is a little shorter than what it should be

LOL - nope - nothing has changed other than the weather . I'm just so glad he isn't so nekkid anymore I'm dreading to see what Kinta will be like when she drops coat for her seasons This is her now:

Coat now: It is growing back fast

Very vaild point. My two can sometimes be 'anxious' about getting something wrong - but there are so many variations to anxiety itself. Even though I know which type Cosmolo is talking about - perhaps they are all related.... soo.... if you find the gene that affects anxiety, breed away from it, and you have to an extent changed another factor in the dog (more headstrong perhaps?). Gotta love genetics - everything influences something else one way or another Not only that - usually multiple genes affect one trait - so in essence if you were to breed 'anxiety' out you could inadvertently affect another trait of that particular breed. Very few genes are so simple to be single or even a double trait...... Add to that also all the 'environmental' causes that affects the 'phenotypic' response and you wonder why we are only just starting to crack the surface of genes and genomes now Yeah - I have noticed breed traits to differ not only overseas but to a smaller scale interstate also. It would have to be down to the type of stock used, you would think. Tonymc: Let me guess - you are a farmer? LOL - I agree - there are clear differences between 'true' workers and companions, but as to whether or not i'd change that is another debate ;). But it again shows you the slight deviations in genetics and characteristics. Using working dogs coz I am a little more familiar with them - you want a 'true' worker to be slightly harder 'headed' so that they can 'refuse' a command when they deem ie: no i'm not going to come because a sheep has got out (a perfect example is Trim the other week). Joe pet owner wants a BC coz they are smart and listens to his every word etc.....

Do you see it at all in working breeds as well? I think borders, aussies etc are prone to it as well because of the traits we breed them for - to work close with handler etc, all day in the field.... Perhaps this is similar for Weims and GSP's..... Goldies too? I'm just prattling off breeds - I may be wrong! Another thought - we have moved away a little from the 'true workers' - so Bob who was a not so good worker but a great companion got bred to Sally who was the same temperament. They could still work, but their soft temperaments was desired by those who wanted them for companions.... Perhaps that is why?? So we breed for the 'softer' temperament and end up with a more anxious dog perhaps? What about drive? Were these dogs active, really driven dogs? I often wonder if dogs in high drive are also highly reactive.... not 100% related, but a thought... In terms of breeding - nope I wouldn't cut it out of the programme, but I would breed to a more confident mate...... and do HEAPS of social

what is lectade? what do you mean by electrolytes (ie: in what form - where to get etc..)

Perhaps because certain traits that they select for in a breeding programme is directly linked to anxiety also. It is my understanding that the smaller poodles and some cavvies can also be sufferers of anxiety?? So - using that as an example - they are bred to be devout lovers of humans and daily companions - so if you don't provide that they will become anxious. I notice a lot of GSD's are anxious too. So many genes are linked - perhaps that is how it comes about. You breed for one thing and it can cause another, less desirable trait to pop up.... Is that more along the lines of what you were thinking? Were these dogs that you have seen, correctly suited to thier families in your eyes?

Inspired by FTPO and Benson. There were some good suggestions that I hadn't heard of before. what would you give your dog if they have a bout of vomiting and runs, but don't really warrant going to the vet.... ie: dog is still feeling fine, acting normal. *I think Souff recommended giving natural yoghurt. *It is common that chicken breast and rice is good for settling a stomach. Any other suggestions?

Not to do with dogs but may provide some insight. http://www.nature.com/neuro/journal/v2/n9/pdf/nn0999_780.pdf another one on animal anxiety: http://www.springerlink.com/content/j5lw8q...e2/fulltext.pdf This one you have to buy (or go to a library and source!): http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pi...558787806001158 I haven't been able to read them so not sure of their relevance. Google Scholar is a great tool for finding scientific papers - just type in variations of what you want to look for. eg: "dogs and anxiety", "anxiety and genetics" etc,etc. I find it an interesting topic and am almost convinced that they are linked. Just like aggressive parents can give aggressive pups - it is just as likely that anxious parents can give anxious pups. Those formative 8 weeks can pick up so much from the parents - yet if you separate them, you will be far worse off. I guess this is why it is often commented how much the pups behave like their mother as opposed to their father. Some dogs are also natural worriers. I know that the aussies in America tend to me a lot more reserved than what Aussies tend to be here also. Result - end up in the wrong hands, not enough social and you have a fearful, anxious or aggressive dog, be it to other dogs or humans. I do believe there is speculation of studying this further - but I don't envy whoever will take it on - the project will be HUGE! I guess this is why knowing the parents is so important. If you know what the parents are like in a variety of situations - you'll have a pretty good idea of how the pups will be also

ooh - me to Abbey? I still haven't got around to getting PS :p

Nobody wants to walk into the lions den. :p I think Andy’s still looking for factual information Seems no-one is opposed to the proper and appropriate use of the prong collar. Why should they be - to me 'proper and appropriate' use means that the dog is not going to be harmed in any way - it isn't a question of whether or not you *agree* with the method or whether you would use it. I'd rather see a dog properly trained and happy no matter what method than locked in the backyard, uncontrollable and no human interaction...... LOL - just my thoughts as always.