EISHUND
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Everything posted by EISHUND
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Looooooong time since I've posted on here! I have a litter of White Swiss Shepherd Dogs due 4th April :D
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Hey Sway, could i be a pain & get my dogs breed name amended in the first results post lol. Absolutely rapt for our breed to get a group placing at Sydney Royal, most amazing feeling ever!! :D Should be "White Swiss Shepherd Dog"... Thank you! :)
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If he's doing that much damage, then yes, he will no doubt trash the door, doorframe, window edges of the room you lock him in. Crate is a temporary measure, long term you might be needing to go down the path of a secure run, weld mesh, cement floor & roof
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I did that last year, had a bitch in whelp moved to a cat4 country so I could get what I needed, its not a new rule, but a way to get a dog from a Cat 6 country that are not allowed in Aus from direct import. No, it is not the same thing :) Previously, a dog had to have a complete three generation pedigree AND all dogs in that pedigree to be from ANKC recognised CCs. Now dogs can be imported and registered with the ANKC, as long as the dog's pedigree is issued by an ANKC recognised CC. Without a pedigree issued by an ANKC recognised CC, dogs from countries where there is no ANKC recognised CC (ie: Turkey) cannot be re-registered by the ANKC. This is independent to the AQIS process that requires the dog to live in a category 4 country for 7 to 9 months before arriving in Australia. dogs still need a three generation pedigree I believe, well thats what I have been lead to believe and that was last year with another dog I was looking to import. But I will check this out. That's what I believe, atleast 3 gen for the ANKC.
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Not just the AKC but other countries CCs the ANKC recognises. Yes AKC / FCI and KC would be the main ones. I just checked the reg rules, the three generations / complete pedigree specification is no longer mentioned, so it is possible to import direct offspring from the exported dog. Regarding WSSD, when they are assessed & accepted overseas by countries still developing the breed with open stud books, they are registered with no pedigree acknowledged, just the individual dog itself is registered. I know this, as 'White Shepherd' pups of my own have been re-registered overseas. (Previous to me becoming an ANKC breeder after the WSSD was recognised in Australia). Any questions regarding my choices should be answered on the about page of my website www.eishund.com (it's very out of date, but you'll get the gist) I think it's a difficult one the WSSD, as although developed separately, they are still genetically the same as another recognised breed, having descended directly from it. However, now that they are separated, it is classed as cross-breeding, and rightly so if they are registered as different breeds. I personally have never cross bred White Swiss Shepherd Dogs with GSD's or vice versa, and think if breeders are serious about separation & want the member bodies to take them seriously, they should cease this practice as well. In my opinion, when acceptance into the breed happens (i.e; local lines are accepted into the breed via (for example) a development register), only then should integration with registered stock occur.
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Keep prog testing her next time,(even after the mating) you may find that her levels are falling & she may require tablets to keep her levels up to maintain pregnancy.
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I think that was stopped. Just to clarify. NEVER, has an ANKC White German Shepherd EVER been re-registered as a White Swiss Shepherd Dog overseas. Non ANKC (Unregistered) White Shepherds, have however, been exported & assessed against the standard & accepted for re-rego as a WSS in countries that have an open stud book. These indivdiual dogs can NOT be imported back into Australia as WSSD as they will not fulfil the pedigree requirement for re-registration of an imported dog with the ANKC.
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I show long coat White Swiss, and we do not trim at all. Part of being a long coat is their furnishings, so they stay. :) The only thing I would scissor is excessive hair on the bottoms of their feet.
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In the UK we have our registration papers (which is what PP has lost in the post) it gives details of parents names, health testing, reg number, endorsements, details of breeder and owner. It has no other pedigree information. The export pedigree is a 3 gen pedigree which will also list colours of each dog and the name/address of owner and breeder. The only extra details on the reg doc is probably just the health test results of the parents AHA, thanks for explaining Becks!
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Hi Ourgang, Whereabouts in Denmark?
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PP, are you listed as the owner on the pedigree papers that you submitted to DogsNSW?
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Hi PP, When I re-registered our Swedish imports, I took the following to DogsNSW. *Their original export pedigrees (must show your name & aussie address as the owner) *Import Permit *Bill of Loading *Completed application for Re-Registration So, has something changed?? Reading through your post I have no idea what they mean by that form??
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Bilbo Baggins: I think you are getting your wires crossed..... MDR1 “AFFECTED” status has NOT been brought in by the imported WSS gene pool. CARRIERS have been imported, and this was only discovered after they were already here and after the more information about the mutation was made available. There have been no WSS’s who have an “AFFECTED” status. Yes, there are MDR1 carriers in the ANKC Reg’d WSS genepool, but did you know that there are ALSO carriers in the Australian white lines (unreg’d)??? Please stop making out like the WSS imports only have this genetic mutation, when they don’t, because the local lines do too. Please do more research on the bloodlines before making statements that are waaaaaay off. Up until a few years ago, it was not reported in the WSS/WS breed. No dog was even tested for it here. That does not mean to say all dogs were CLEAR. One should NEVER assume. Only when the European breeders start testing for it and found the problem, did Australian and American breeders follow suit. Look at ALL the Australian unreg’d breeders..... Make a tally of what breeders HAVE tested & cleared their bloodlines and which ones haven’t. You will find that only a small percentage have tested and cleared it from their lines. One unreg’d Australian breeder, used a carrier with an untested local bitch. These resulting puppies went to several other breeders who use these pups in the breeding program. One of them who has been tested, is a carrier. Most still haven’t even been tested, so who knows what their status really is??? At least with the ANKC WSS dogs, ALL of the litters bred have been from MDR1 tested breeding stock, whereas the majority of unreg’d Australian breeders haven’t even tested their dogs – even though they use lines with known carriers! No good breeder would breed two carriers together, but given the numbers of untested unreg’d Australian dogs, there is MORE CHANCE of an unregistered Australian breeder breeding two carriers together and not even knowing it, because so many do not test for it. It’s all about being responsible, doing the DNA testing and avoiding issues. That way, you 100% stay clear of producing any affected dogs.... So no, Bilbo Baggins, MDR1 CANNOT possibly spread into future generations, when WSS breeders here are testing for it and avoiding producing affected dogs. (Edit for type)
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I was having a chat about this issue with a friend of mine who is very passionate about this subject, and I have been given permission to share their thoughts here: Sandra is right Buddy, the important thing to keep at the forefront of your mind is – breeding with carriers strictly depends on what disease or mutation you are referring to. Underfoot is also right, you always breed to improve the breed. What everyone have to remember is that each and every dog is a carrier of several diseases (statistically, this is approximately 8 diseases per dog). With each dog being carriers of several diseases, we know that the chance of the dogs producing problems in puppies will ALWAYS exist, no matter what we do. Until we map the entire canine genome, we cannot wave our magic wands and put an end to health problems – even if we take the “throwing the baby out with the bathwater” approach and wipe out known “carriers” from the gene pool. Bilbo Baggins is saying that you shouldn’t breed with carriers, no matter what, but considering ALL dogs are carriers of several genetic issues, are we not to breed ANY dogs at all? This approach is not going to result in anything, except a canine holocaust. Remember, “carrier” does NOT mean “affected”, so plenty of healthy dogs are produced out of carriers, who are not affected or carriers themselves. A lot of the time, affected dogs are a result of not enough 1. Honesty, 2. research and 3. Knowledge, resulting in combined blood lines with same diseases, in turn producing affected offspring. If breeders genuinely care about the health of their breed and keeping high ethical standards, they MUST do significant research of the diseases, the bloodlines, the genetics and mode of inheritance (whether polygenetic, autosomal recessive) and how to combine all of this to breed healthier dogs. List your breed-specific diseases. Know them and research them and the bloodlines as mentioned above. - Epilepsy - DM - MDRI - PRA - EIC - Orthopaedic issues; hip/elbow dysplasia - Reproductive issues or abnormalities - Other things like eye, heart, pancreas, liver related problems etc Serious breeders will take advantage of the DNA testing on particular diseases to really know their bloodlines. This DNA knowledge, combined with significant research, results in wiser decisions. We have the technology... why not use it to our advantage to help the breed and for the greater good of the health of our blood lines? I have known breeders take informed, but careful risks in breeding (some slightly risky and others more serious risks) and the results in progeny have been very successful. As a result, the gene pool has expanded substantially, quality has improved and most importantly - some issues bred out of the lines altogether. Though this can only be managed through managing breeding priorities and ethics, careful tracking and statistical research and ongoing dedication from the breeder. If you are going to do it, why not do it properly? Each and every responsible breeder should take health very seriously. It’s an obligation to the dogs you are producing and your chosen breed as a whole. What everyone has to understand, is that it ALL starts with knowing your breed’s hereditary diseases and how it all works. It’s of paramount importance that the community be upfront about these health issues in their lines. We must get rid of the stigma attached with the way people bad-mouth other breeders about the problems their dogs have produced , and start working together to improve the health of the breed. All that has to be put aside if we really want to do the best for the breeds we love. The approach has to change and an open registry should be created where people can report and track issues. This way, when passionate newbies come along, they have the research at the tips of their fingers, without having to get in the right circles to discover important information. The next stage is keeping track of all progeny and descendants, because sometimes there isn’t any DNA testing or way to know that your line is carrying something. You won’t know your line carries something until later down the line, it has been bred to another line who is also a carrier of a specific disease. Every single time we breed our dogs, we take a risk anyway. Why not make it an informed and strategic one? I suggest people who really want to know more about diseases, carriers, breeding healthier dogs and genetics, read Dr George Padget’s book “Control of Canine Genetic Disease” and Google his name to find some extremely interesting and useful articles.
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: Oh....my....god. There you go again, quoting alleged numbers of clear & carrier dogs. And yet again, the figures you have given are WRONG. You clearly do not have the intimate knowledge of the breed you claim to have, so perhaps refrain from quoting breed statistics until you do your research!!! If you are so interested in the breed, then I encourage you to learn more, and If I can help, I'm more than happy to do so as it's obvious you need assistance. And how many of the unrecognised local lines have been tested? A small handful yes? Therefore, how can one claim that the entire Australian genepool is clear when only minimal testing has been done. Wild, uneducated & unsupported claims such as that worry me! I can assure you, there is a lot more to be concerned about in the local lines than MDR1 in the imported lines! MDR1 is NOT A DISEASE, what part of that are you not understanding. What do you mean 'given the change of import rules bringing in clear dogs is also going to be an issue?' I highly doubt any type of restriction would be placed on the importation of a dog with a mutated gene that is not a health issue. Is that what you are implying? The aim of any testing in a breeding program is for it to be used as a tool to ensure AFFECTED dogs are not produced. The aim of testing is so carriers CAN be used effectively without limiting the genepool. With a severe health issue, yes, breeders can use it to weed out carriers if they wish, but MDR1 can NOT be compared with diseases. It's a healthy dog, always will be! No MDR1 is not a disease but an affected dog will die if given the wrong medication. Given the amount of carriers in the breed the only way you could stop an affected dog being produced would be to paediatricly desex all carriers and sell as pets. Keeping clear for breeding. This would then prevent an affected being produced 2 generations done the track. Because you can not control second and third generations. Some great points made by other posters Bilbo, There are many things you can give any healthy dog & it will die if administered incorrectly. It's about being responsible & informing owners about the breed correctly. What about Collies, Aussie Shepherds etc. A study I read in the USA claimed that as little as only 25% of the Collie breed was clear of this mutation. It's not a concern, it's just common knowledge they sensitive to certain drugs. Or do you think all of this breed should be desexed & placed into pet homes too Just as some breeds are suseptible to bloat, or heat stress, conditions that are not diseases, MDR1 to me is comparable to that. As i said, do some research as your claims are unfounded & unbelievable. Leave it to those involved in & that 'know' the breed to publically quote breed statistics in Australia. ;)
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HUH?! How do the import rules have anything to do with bringing in clear dogs? As Eishund has said I wouldn't be throwing the baby out with the bathwater when consdering breeding MDR1 carriers, its just a gene mutation. Its about informing new owners about what products are safe to use and what are on the no-no list. Even carriers can become symptomatic when given ivermectin based drugs. My Aussie is a carrier for MDR1 and as a precaution I don't give him anything containing ivermectin, better safe than sorry. What I meant about bringing in dogs was that its going to take longer and they are going to older and thus more expensive and this will put people off. What new rule are you talking about? What, that Sweden is changing to a Cat4. How is one extra country going to put people off importing? You either want to, or you don't! Expense certainly didn't play any part in my choice to import from Sweden, I had other reasons.
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: Oh....my....god. There you go again, quoting alleged numbers of clear & carrier dogs. And yet again, the figures you have given are WRONG. You clearly do not have the intimate knowledge of the breed you claim to have, so perhaps refrain from quoting breed statistics until you do your research!!! If you are so interested in the breed, then I encourage you to learn more, and If I can help, I'm more than happy to do so as it's obvious you need assistance. And how many of the unrecognised local lines have been tested? A small handful yes? Therefore, how can one claim that the entire Australian genepool is clear when only minimal testing has been done. Wild, uneducated & unsupported claims such as that worry me! I can assure you, there is a lot more to be concerned about in the local lines than MDR1 in the imported lines! MDR1 is NOT A DISEASE, what part of that are you not understanding. What do you mean 'given the change of import rules bringing in clear dogs is also going to be an issue?' I highly doubt any type of restriction would be placed on the importation of a dog with a mutated gene that is not a health issue. Is that what you are implying? The aim of any testing in a breeding program is for it to be used as a tool to ensure AFFECTED dogs are not produced. The aim of testing is so carriers CAN be used effectively without limiting the genepool. With a severe health issue, yes, breeders can use it to weed out carriers if they wish, but MDR1 can NOT be compared with diseases. It's a healthy dog, always will be!
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Wrong again! Are you for real???? Again, I reiterate, you do NOT own an ANKC White Swiss, so why on earth are you on DOL making false claims about the breed!?? eta: YES, I am annoyed!
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Unfortunately OSO there is 1 clear bitch in the country. You might want to get your facts right before you go off publicly sprouting statistics about a breed pool you are not involved in as you are WRONG! Denigrating the ANKC White Swiss Shepherd Dog genepool due to a mutated gene is ridiculous, there are so many other things that are of more concern. Just proves my point that when breeders choose to be responsible & test their stock, make their results public for the world to see, it is used as a tool against them to claim the breed is unhealthy. Initially I was concerned, but since then I have done extensive research on MDR1-IVM (and maybe you should too!), it is not a disease, yet those that lack knowledge on it treat it as such & look down upon carriers. Some breeds, IVM is so ingrained into the genepool, no testing is done, it's just common knowledge within that breed to avoid certain medications. Whereas, the WSSD community made the choice to implement testing to control it to avoid breeding affected dogs. Dxenion, it is ok that Rakim is a carrier (who is a perfectly healthy dog), as said above, as long as he is mated to a clear bitch he will NEVER ever produce an affected pup. And even an affected dog is a perfectly healthy animal that will lead a normal life, with no complications provided certain drugs are avoided. Health, Temperament, Type, Conformation etc, should be priorities, if we threw out every dog that carried a defective gene, well, we'd probably all be owning CATS!
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How Did Everyone Come Up With Their Dol Names?
EISHUND replied to huskies4life88's topic in General Dog Discussion
Mine is after my prefix, which is german for Ice Dog. Ice was my first White Shepherd Dog (a White GSD), so hence he started my love affair with the White Swiss Shepherd Dog, so it's a small tribute to him for igniting my passion & love for the breed. -
Yes, I have just had a litter with a confirmed carrier of MDR1 (IVM). This is not a disease, it is a gene mutation. She was mated to a male who has tested clear. I too am a believer that testing is to ensure no affected dogs are produced without limiting the genepool. I was the first in Australia to begin testing for this within our breed (White Shepherd, prior to recognition & my importation of White Swiss Shepherd Dogs, and have continued to test), and WOW was i absolutely ridiculed by some in the community, citing it as a waste of money & claims that I was trying to make myself look better by testing! OMG, I was of the opinion, that ANY available test for a condition within the breed was a great tool to take advantage of, and that is my reason for doing the testing, didn't expect to be outcast & called 'elistist' because of what I felt were good breeding ethics. My biggest issue is with the idiots out there breeding from known carriers & mating them to untested dogs, then on-selling their pups to buyers & not informing them, who then go on to breed again, untested, to untested dogs! Grrr... That type of irresponsibility irks me & shows a complete disregard of breeding ethics if you ask me! Mind you, this is within the unregistered genepool. Thankfully ALL of the ANKC registered dogs used in breeding programs around Australia have been tested & their status known, and I hope it stays that way. =)
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Sometimes I wish we had the 'like' option like Facebook on here! I'm with you dancinbcs!
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Sorry to go OT, but is it common practise to restrict registration of puppies when allowing someone to use your stud dog? I've come across it in a different breed, where the only pup on main could be the one the bitch owner kept. This is just unheard of in the GSD world. (Yes i know I have WSS, but there are not many of us yet for weird things to creep in LOL)
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How many pups constitutes a litter?
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Sorry for your loss. I'd be taking the pup away & packing everything up. Allowing her to keep the dead pup 'until she is ready' is just prolonging the whole traumatic ordeal for her.