Kelpie-i

Hi Erny...thanks for the recommendation Indi_dog, yes I met you that day at the herding workshop (just as everyone was leaving). I hope you enjoyed it. If you are still having problems with Indi, please give me a call or PM me. I have dealt with many of these types of problems before and can show you some good techniques on dealing with this type of situation. I do the private consults over at Kepala anyway.

HERDING

Thanks Erny, we're glad you came out and most importantly, enjoyed the day. Sorry about the dust..it may have added some flavour to your lunch...LOL! I'll pass your thanks onto David as well!! Now just remember your "backs" and "overs..

bridgie_cat, just wondering why you say that you "can't enter for a bit"??? Is your dog ill or injured? Workshops will be held once or twice a month. CTD, siblings can be very different from each other when working. They have individual personalities and mind-sets just like us, so no two siblings will ever work the same. Whilst one may have good distance, another will work close and/or want to head, another again will be timid and so on. I think you'll find it very interesting watching Tia and her brothers.

Hi Sam, I have spoken with Dave and you don't need to attend another workshop. General lessons are held on either Saturday and Sunday afternoons by appointment so probably a good idea to contact Dave to book a time. To update everyone, there are 4 places left for the workshop on 28th April, so if you wish to book, I suggest you get in quick :D Thanks.

Hi Bonnie, there are some really good suggestions given to you regarding your problem, but I have another suggestion you may wish to consider and something that owners of "stock chasing" dogs, don't often think about - as long as he is not 'going in for the kill' with the stock, I think it would be a possibility...... It certainly sounds as though your dog has a strong instinct to chase therefore I wouldn't go past the option of perhaps taking him to some herding lessons where at least his instinct can be channelled into herding rather than just chasing stock. His chase instinct will be placed under control and his movements branded which then become commands thereby giving you a lot more control over him compared to what you have at the moment. What's more important though, is that through herding, you teach your dog to stop on command regardless of where they are and what they're doing. If this can be done with Kelpies and BC, there is no reason why it can't be done with other breeds. In fact, we have worked with Labs, Rotties and Dalmations... and just today we worked a Standard Poodle whom we taught to stop on cue whilst herding. Who knows, it could turn into a sport that you can both enjoy?? Just a suggestion....:D

Alpha, Apologies if I came accross somewhat blunt and I don't doubt for a minute that your grandfather has more knowledge about life on the farm than most. Your post stated "often the younger ones", obviously implying that it is the younger farmers who are less tolerant of their non-performing working dogs. Having been involved in many aspects of working dog training with farmers and their dogs, I have found that it is often the younger farmers who come out to learn a thing or two about working/training their dogs, rather than the older (or should I say more mature) farmers. I wasn't brought up on a farm but am fortunate enought that my line of work now brings me in contact with many farmers and their dogs therefore my comments are made based on conversation, involvement and observation over the last few years. I agree with this Alpha, however there are certainly those dogs who just don't cut it as "all rounders". Some people buy dogs with the "all rounder" tag thinking that the dog will perform in paddocks, yards and truck work etc, only to get a dog who's forte is paddock work only and is generally scattered with close truck and/or yard work or vice versa. In which case, the farmer then needs to go out and find a dog who can cover the rest of the work. Those that own good all rounders are extremely lucky. Some people are not as lucky and are faced with some hard decisions. Sorry to the OP for hijacking this thread......us "sheep dog" people just can't help ourselves.

Hello All For those of you who missed out on the last 2 workshops and really wanted to attend, we have set another workshop date. Saturday 28th April 2007. As previously, places will be limited to 10 on the day. Cost is $60 per dog and $40 for second dog. If you are interested in attending, please click on the link to my website below, select "Training Services" and "Herding Clinics" for more information. Thanks

I just checked out the links to the UK heeling and if the Oz judges consider that crowding, then what would they say about the Schutzhund heeling where the dog is driving so hard at heel?

Alpha, not sure if you've been around many farmers, but it's not so much the younger ones but rather the older ones who tend to act this way. Most of the younger farmers seem to be more inclined to have their working dogs trained and/or train them themselves. Unfortunately, it's mostly the older farmers that have neither the time nor the inclination to want to train their working dogs or to even re-train a problem dog. I once met an older gentleman farmer at Casterton who told us about the "reject pit" he had on his property which was nearly full of dogs which did not perform. The saddest part of this story was that he was at Casterton to buy 2 new dogs to replace the ones he had previously shot. Jesomil, not sure but is this what you're trying to say...? Obedience trialling or any form of trialling is a "sport" and as such, you do not derive an income or a living from this. It is purely done for one's own pleasure or status seeking. So to be rid of a dog that doesn't work in the obedience ring, whether it be due to training faults or dog's genetics is totally unfair. What about the dog who's job it is to contribute to the income of a family that just doesn't work out for the reason based on genetics ie. wrong temperament for the job etc? What do you do with this dog? Would you rehome a dog with strong working instinct as a family pet??

Hello CTD, it was good to meet you yesterday. I'm glad you enjoyed the day and we hope to see you back for practice soon. Your pup was lovely and worked well. Yeah gotta watch out for those little horns but you managed a good leg spread -LOL!

Wow CTD, loved the coights (sp?) one. Perhaps I'll teach my own dog that one as I don't think I'll see Pete the pug again soon......I already miss him

No, didn't get to record it unfortunately. It was supposed to be one the of the skills for the program but unfortunately it has been cut short so no-one will ever get to see it ;) Shame really when so much work went into it....oh well dem's the breaks. I'll have to endeavour to video tape it if I ever see him again Let me tell you Haven that having an ex-footballer tackle you like that ain't gentle!!!

Thanks guys...challenge - you bet but loads of fun and a huge learning curve for me!

Hi Cosmolo Most of the time, but I'm sure we'll do a Sunday one to cater for those who cannot make Saturdays.

I just needed to share this small success with everyone, especially since no-one will ever get to see it I had to teach a pug to retrieve. "So what" I hear you all say! Well just to give you an indication of what I was up against... This dog has absolutely no interest in toys whatsoever, what's more he's never put anything (other than food) in his mouth. And of course as we all know, pugs are not retrieving dogs (even though I'm sure there are some out there who do). Anyway, after about 7 days (total training time) over a span of 3 weeks of working on this and slowly building up his interest to the small rope toy (using food of course), he is finally retrieving the item. I almost cried when he finally brought the object to me and dropped it at my feet. I jumped up and down like a mad woman. I have taught many dogs to retrieve items in my years as a trainer, but all of these have been either dogs with a natural inclination to retrieve or dogs with some form of toy drive. This has certainly been an experience I will never forget - I feel invicible now...I think I might try my hand at training a cat

Hello All Just thought I'd let you know that the workshop for the 31st is totally booked out. There are still some places left for the 7th April but these are filling up fast as well, so if you are interested, please send me an enquiry form by following the link via the website. If you miss out on any of these dates, don't panic as there will be more workshops scheduled in the coming months. Thanks and looking forward to meeting everyone who is attending

bloss344, this is a good way to re-train from dog away from using "stay" commands.

Thanks Hannah, you are correct. And t(AD)pole, No, you don't need to be a member of the school. Sunday clinics will be held by appointment only and these will be pay as you go, the rate for which has not been finalised yet. There will be packages made available but I will need to confirm with David for these. At this stage, we are only taking bookings for the Workshops. Hope this helps ;)

Hi t(AD)pole, yes it's directly opposite Kepala and the cost is $60 for the day.

Arrrhh, Hannah you beat me to it..... What Hannah wrote! ;)

I think it all depends on the instructors "schooling" as to whether they will teach a stay/wait or just use the command word. I notice that all kennel club instructors teach the stay/wait, as do many of the books written by either English or American trainers, which is where I think Australians have adopted this from. There is no right or wrong and I have seen dogs excel using both sit/stay and without. Dogs are not stupid and will usually learn what is expected from them, so at the end the of day, it is whatever the handler is comfortable with or used to. I personally believe that less is more and so I don't use stay/wait, even when herding. If I tell my dog to "stop" whilst in the sheep yard, I expect him to stay stopped until I give him the direction in which I wish him to go next. I use the same principle with obedience and it works just fine. In herding, we also use hand signals with which the dogs tend to respond to better - and there isn't a hand signal for "stay" in herding. However it is certainly interesting reading other people's comments and feelings on the subject. Good question Cosmolo...one I've thought of many times but never worried about asking.

I must say I was one of the those skeptical people when it came to the clicker as I always believed I could use a bridge word instead but I thought I'd try it out and the results have been astounding. I now recommend a clicker to people who have aggressive dogs and I cannot believe how much faster the results come. One Dali at school initially couldn't walk into the training grounds without wanting to "kill" every dog within a 2 metre radius of him. I showed the owner the clicker and suggested he work on focus and click/treat whenever the dog was calm, within 2 weeks the aggressive behaviour began to subside and was slowly being replaced by the dog focussing on the owner whenever another dog came near. 5 months on and the owner is now able to join in a class, albeit he still needs to be extremely vigilant but both of them are a lot calmer and happier. This is but one of the success stories I've experienced with a clicker. I don't use a clicker for everything but for tricks and sharpening up heeling etc, it's brilliant.

Hi Fang I can completely understand your anger. You state that you called these people about your dog's supposed "separation anxiety" problem. Are you willing to share with us your dog's behaviour and also, the "advice" if any, you were offered by this trainer??

Whoooa....I'm dizzy!!! ;)