Kelpie-i

dasha, do you mean that she goes in harder ie. with intention, when she is going clockwise?? Becomes 'pushy'?? If so, then my boy tends to do this when working smaller flocks of sheep. This is a lack of confidence to the clockwise position and I'm guessing you're right handed?? If she doesn't shut down then this is good...it means you can keep working her. You need to relax yourself as well as if you're anything like me, I tend to get worked up about this. You want to teach her some distance and you can achieve this by placing some old tyres between her and the sheep in a round yard. Use a stick or something long to keep pushing her out. Work with a small group of sheep. I'm not sure if this will help...it did for me. Good luck and let us know how you go with the 3 sheep trial.

Oh okay.......my answer still stands however.

Law, if you are training your dog correctly then you should never need to use any of these.

To Everyone who has booked in for the Steve Austin seminar....... Thanks for your bookings. The Agenda for the day will be sent out to everyone next week. If you do not recieve this by mid next week, please PM me with your email address. Many thanks and looking forward to meeting everyone on the day. :rolleyes:

Some herding trainers will suggest you train one direction at a time. I have found that teaching both simultaneously makes it easier for the dog to learn the different commands. Work on the weaker side more as Janba has suggested, otherwise you'll make the mistake I did. Some very good suggestions already given here. Just a silly question....what do you mean by sensitive? Are you applying too much pressure on her or becoming frustrated and raising your voice or is she sensitive to the rake?? Some dogs are sensitive by nature and may not be as confident as we may like to think they are. The slightest bit of extra pressure switches them off. You can usually tell this is happening when the dog stops and sniffs the ground and/or seems to lose concentration even for short bursts. These are usually the first sign of stress. Best to train in short, successful spurts rather than long drawn out sessions. Just my 20c worth.

My teeny tiny brag would have to be Gabe's first ever time working cattle on Monday! Moving the steers from the paddock to the holding pen, he saw we were struggling on our own so decided we needed his help. He did an excellent job for a first timer on cattle, stopping on command and moving them swiftly when one of the steers went for him. He jumped back in fright but then bounced right back and continued to move them into the pen. My hero

Triple Crown clicker for me! I'm not a huge fan of the i-click...each one i've had broke too easily, not too sure why

Beautiful explanation Rom!! I wasn't looking at it in that sense.

I'm a little confused here..... The video clip does not show any negative punishment just you controlling the dog before he got the reward. You did not remove anything from the dog (well not that I could see anyway). Are you referring to the way you taught the exercise?? Ditto

That all depends on how the initial training of this was applied. Without knowing HOW this was achieved, it is difficult to answer. My answer's a little different, I think that it all depends on how you initially trained the exercise. I don't think the OP asked the question regarding method of training used to achieve the result, rather the actual finished exercise as it stood. Well that's how I read it anyway!!

Hi Denis I cannot see any punishment being used here. From what I can see you are controlling the dog's drive/urge and rewarding him for leaving the object by allowing him to have it on your cue. We use a somewhat similar method to teach herding dogs to come off the sheep. Their reward for coming off is to allow them to go back in. It's controlling the dog's instinctual drive.

....bump.... Only a few places left!

Who are the lecturers here wayrod and what are their qualifications? Are you one of them?

URGENT NOTE!! For anybody who has contacted Kepala directly regarding the Steve Austin seminar and was given a mobile number to call, please note that that particular mobile number is not active as yet. Best to PM me directly for an information flyer with all information. Thank you.

Oonga, Steve will be covering quite a few different topics - many based on how to get the best out of your dog - working with different reinforcement schedules, drives etc etc. For a full list of topics, send me a PM and I will send you the info.

STEVE AUSTIN "FUNDAMENTALS IN DOG TRAINING" SEMINAR One day only - Sunday 30th March 2008 Hosted by Kepala Conference Centre (Kepala Canine Country Club) Diggers Rest, Vic. Steve Austin is one of Australia’s foremost experts in dog training, if not the world. Steve has been a major figure in the professional pet industry for decades. From lecturing to American Law Enforcement Agencies, to training Australia’s first truffle detector dog in Tasmania, to speaking on animal training at Sydney’s Taronga Zoo and much more. Steve’s knowledge and experience is second to none in Australia. Steve’s conference at Kepala Conference Centre in Melbourne will be centered around dog professionals and those with an interest in training their own dogs. This will be a Steve Austin seminar like no other! Please PM me for more information and/or to book. Alternatively, contact Kepala directly (ask to speak with Dale or Tina) on 03 9740 1272. Places are limited to 40 people, so book early. Thanks

I often wonder how one could become a "dog trainer" in 4 weeks. This is a very scary situation, not just for the dog, but for the franchisee who hasn't had any previous experience with dogs and is called into deal with an aggressive case. Dogtech's public liability insurance must be through the roof I reckon! It's not just Dogtech, but any other franchise who offers crash course type training for their franchise buyers. You get more training if working for a bank than you do working with a living, breathing animal with a working brain! Be afraid.....be very afraid!

Yes I agree wholeheartedly MarkS. I too come accross mis-matched owners/dogs with these sorts of problems. It's just that I have seen a dog which I believe to have true HK many years ago and it wasn't a pretty sight, infact I really felt for the owner and the dog. She was by no means a lazy person and did most things right and tried very hard. In the end you could see it was starting to take its toll and she just wasn't enjoying time with her dog anymore. The dog was constantly in a frantic state of mind, except at night time when it slept. The other thing that tends to lead me towards this way of thinking is that RB's other dogs are not displaying this behaviour. I saw her other dog working at the Herding clinic and she seemed like a nice relaxed dog, even when she was just waiting her turn. Usually, all the dogs in the family will show some sort of uncontrollable and hyperactive behaviour if the leader isng't doing his/her job properly. Having said that, I cannot make an assumption without seeing the dog, but just wanted to give RB another possibility. Working an already hyperactive dog in drive is not the solution, but keeping tabs on leadership and what the owner is rewarding is very important if the problem stems from mis-management.

MarkS, you are correct. True hyperkinesis is there constantly, regardless of environment, however certain situations can and WILL trigger the chemical imbalances associated with hyperkinesis and this is where the dog starts up. As stated in my earlier post, the only way to tell whether it is true HP is to have the test done, which they don't have the facilities to do here in Oz. Amen to that, but in the case that it just might be HK, a dog's life can be shortened due to the heart being continuously overworked as well as the continuously high stress levels. In cases like this, a drug may just be what is required to bring the dog's activity level down a few notches. Don't get me wrong, drugs are the absolute last resort for me as they should be for all problems, whether dog related and/or for humans but Rachellebuck needs to decide what to do if she is truly uncomfortable with her dog's behaviour. I think to do as MarkS has suggested and keep a log book of the things that trigger her episodes. I would further recommend you switch her over to a raw food diet to eliminate the possibility of her hyperactivity being caused by reactions to the various preservatives and colourings added to commercial brand dog food, whether super premium or not. Give this 2 weeks and see how you go!

Yes very true, but in this case it would be wise to rule out any medical reason for the dog's intense hyperactivity. I own working dogs and whilst they are extremely active, they do have their an off switch. A dog that continues this behaviour each waking moment is not displaying normal or even higher than normal levels of activity. I make this call merely by what the OP stated in her opening thread, so it could very well be a case of a naturally highly strung dog, but just want to point out that there could be an underlying medical problem for it.

Hi Rachellebuck, I have only stumbled accross this thread and if possible I will add my 20c worth. Unfortuntately, whilst it may add some dimension to the problem, there isn't much in the way of help or vet assistance here in Australia as the Australian Veterinary association will not approve any research for this condition here in Oz.....anyway, here are my thoughts on your dog's behaviour. Way back when I was studying to become a behaviourist, I did a thesis on a condition called "Hyperkinesis" which is a form of ADD in dogs. Now before everyone goes jumping up and down and says" Kelpie-i have you lost your mind?". Hyperkinesis has been scientifcally proven to exist in dogs via the studies done in the US, with many tests being done on dogs suspected of having this condition. Dogs suspected of having Hyperkinesis have been described as being on the go continuously and never having an off switch..."frantic" was one word they used. Their heart rates are constantly at a high level as is their stress levels as they cannot find a means to relax. Their pupils are almost always dialated and in severe cases, the dogs always pant and can even become aggressive. They very rarely drink water! The dogs tested showed varying degrees of the condition from mild to severe. The way of testing for Hyperkinesis was done by taking a reading of the dog's pulse before administering the drug (I forget the name and will need to look back at my notes). Once the drug was given, the dog was left alone for 1 hour and then the pulse was taken again. If the dog was suffering from the condition, the pulse rate would lower dramatically to almost normal levels from one dosage. The dog would then be put on a regular dosage to keep the levels at a stable and normal rate. The dogs who responded to the treatment were later descibed as being as close to "normal" as possible and learning and rehabilitation could now take place as the dogs were now in a calmer state of mind. The dogs who did not respond to the treatment continued to display the behaviour as the drug did not work on them as it was intended to. Now, I am not sure if your dog shows any of the characteristics I mentioned above and we cannot be 100% certain that this is the condition bothering him as many dogs are just naturally highly strung, but just the fact that you say that your dog is continuously hyperactive may be a small clue to the problem. Hyperkinesis is seen mainly in working type breeds like GSDs and Heelers etc. If you wish to research Hyerkinesis, William Campbell has a book and some thesis papers on the subject which is a great read. Many years ago, I had a dog come to class (Blue heeler x) funnily enough, whom I was 100% certain had this condition. I gave the owner all the information that I had at the time and asked her to go to see her vet. As suspected, the vet was no help as they don't have too much knolwedge about the condition but he did put the dog on chlomicalm which did seem to help the dog a little. The owner was at least able to start teaching her dogs some things instead of the dog acting wild all the time. Just to add that the drug used for Hyperkinises is not a calming drug, rather the opposite but it works in reverse for those with true Hyperkinesis. Please don't get me wrong as I am not an advocate in the use of drugs for dogs, but sometimes they do help in getting the problem to a manageable state where you can then start a rehab process with the dog. Hope this helps some....!

Copraphagia is something that comes very natural to some dogs but repulses humans. When bitches have just had pups, they eat the faeces of their pups to keep the den clean. Most of the time, when a puppy starts eating his own faeces, it is diet related. A missing mineral or vitamin triggers the body's natural instinct to source it. This is why most dogs will eat cat faeces or faeces from other dogs. If your dog is a loner, then he will simply eat his own. Problem is, the more they do it, the more of a habit it becomes and it can even become an obsession to some. My male kelpie showed signs of copraphagia when he was young and as soon as I changed his diet, it stopped completely. Here are some other tips to help out: 1: As mentioned earlier, get the dog checked out by the vet to ensure that there are no nasties lurking in his gut. 2. Make sure you are worming your dog regularly (worms eggs can lurk in the faeces) 3. Change the diet ie. try another brand of dog food ie. something super premium (if not already on this). A holistic brand of food is best! 5. Add some pumpkin (and other vegies) to his meals. 6. Brewers yeast is also said to help 7. Remember to keep the area as clean as possible to help break the habit. Good luck!

Poor Erny.....she'd be pulling her hair out right now!

Yes I have 4 of them to feed, vaccinate, worm, bath etc etc etc etc etc etc. I could've been rich by now, but instead I have 4 beautiful companions. Who needs money anyway??!! a&e, a puppy showing signs of aggression at such a young age is not going to get better on it's own. This is usually a sign of things to come. If you cannot afford a behaviourist, then do yourself and your family a favour and return the pup from where ever you purchased it from. You may not get all your money back but at least you can be assured you'll not end up with a very large headache in the future. Just my opinion and recommendation!

Thanks for that llink PAX. Nothing really revolutionary that I can tell....but then again maybe I've been around too long???