Amazetl

I think most here support the idea that not everyone should be a breeder and not every dog should breed but I think it’s more about how difficult some breeders do make it to allow those who do want to do so.

And prices continue to stay high, not as high as lockdown times but still higher than before covid. A lot of people locked out of being able to have a quality (pedigree lines tested) pet. But at the same time, I think with what goes into breeding with time, effort and their own money, prices do need to be high if they want to make their money back or profit. I can’t remember where it is that I saw lately, but when looking through the puppy adds for various breeds one breeder said their price is very negotiable for the right home. So the question is are breeders meant to be able to make a good profit, or one at all, or are they meant to prioritise best homes and not worry so much about money. Lowering the prices though will make many unable to continue breeding just because the costs are so high. There are all kinds of road bumps in all this. Not sure what the answers are.

As long as councils don’t make all pet dogs desexed. I guess there will be some who fall through the cracks intentionally still but heavy fines or worse may deter that. Then the perfect storm.

How common is getting a vasectomy now? Or any other way to sterilise without harming the hormones? Forgive me as I don’t know a lot about it but have heard that a lot of large breeds they prefer to do that than the traditional neuter these days however I have no idea if all vets do it etc.

How would they know if you did desex or didn’t? Do they make you provide a receipt/desex certificate? I guess they would. Again, most shouldn’t breed but just talking about contracts here and how they are enforced.

I think perhaps it depends as sometimes breeders do get one drawn up by a lawyer. If that’s the case do you have to stick to it or not? I would assume so. Best to check everything first for sure. There are many puppies now too that are being sterilised before sale but I would assume you would be told that before buying. How does the ACT ever breed puppies? What happens if they do that with more states? Wouldn’t puppies become really rare and then eventually gone completely? Or is it not that hard to get a permit? What is happening with the dog world! Dogs are already having trouble and facing extinction with some breeds and probably more in the future and this doesn’t help. I do think however not everyone should be a breeder and not every dog should be bred of course. How do we make legislation to be the most appropriate? It’s quite worrying.

Interesting, I will do some more research. Thanks.

I have never met one. I do much prefer them natural with their ears. I know a lot about dogs but years ago I had no idea that their ears weren’t naturally pricked up. That shows how little research I’ve ever done on them. I really don’t know much about them. I was thinking probably a pup so that they can integrate well with the current dogs but I’m not against a mature dog. Thanks for the interesting tips on selecting a puppy with more potential for having the guarding instinct.

Thanks guys for more info. Whatever dog I would get, its needs would be met, whether that’s obedience or agility or tracking etc. I’m not interesting in training for protection work though. I don’t really want a dog who will actually bite, but one who would just stand in front and look scary. I had a man jump the fence in the middle of the night when I happened to be outside with my Lab who did just that. I didn’t even have time to react, my dog just saw how out of the usual it was and stood in front of me, stretching his body out to make it look big and took a stance, deep deep bark that I hadn’t ever heard from him before then and a warning to not come close to me. The man was visibly taken aback. We were in the night sky and my dog is a choc lab so wouldn’t have been able to see him too well. The man ran off right away. But he is a Lab. I don’t know but I think he’s more protective than a usual lab. He’s also much larger than the average lab. But he is also really friendly with everyone except when something is out of place. He meant business. I doubt he would have done more than bail up though. He has also protected other dogs from dogs. He took on a German Shepherd by standing in front of a smaller dog who was with us and pushing the Shepherd back with his body without touching the dog. The dog came at us again, wasn’t aggressive but was trying to get to the little dog. He pushed him back again and at that point the shepherd (thankfully) decided to run off, not scared but looked like he figured it wasn’t worth it. I was glad because my lab has never laid a paw or teeth on any dog and I don’t think he’s capable of doing that so would be horrible in an actual fight. Another time he body slammed an aggressive approaching dog who was flipped in the air in the process and stunned then ran off. I don’t believe there ever is one dog breed that will fit perfectly for everything but if I go down this track I want to get the best breed that would most likely fit the best. I know that not every dog bred to have that guarding instinct will necessarily actually have it. That’s why I was thinking of a more larger dog who just by looks can make people not want to step forward. I hear lots of stories of some people who have odd neighbours who come looking around and sometimes frequently. So it’s not about so and so I know but just anyone in the area who feels they might have a look. My retrievers are all inside when I’m out but I want them to be safe too and not have anyone see them and think they can take them for all sorts of reasons. I don’t know how it is now but I know in the past there were warnings about labs in particular being stolen for baits in dog fighting. It is probably not going to actually happen but due to my sometimes paranoia concerning the dogs I just would prefer to have a larger dog who would deter a lot of people just through their size and deep bark.

Yeah almost all the giant breeds don’t live long sadly.

Yeah it’s really sad. I don’t think many make it past 8 but there are some lines that are getting longer. But then you could get one who doesn’t make it past two. A lot of Goldens have similar problems but not to the same extent. Even in my older girl’s lines there were several who died at a year or two from cancers. I’ve read from some people that however long you get with them is worth it, and then others say they’ll never have one again because that can’t take the heartbreak.

The dog isn’t going to just laze around. There will be lots of happenings and walks around the property and then also in town. I’m also big on obedience and other dog activities but I do have the retrievers and was hoping to have a dog who is more happy to relax a lot. The dog will also live inside. Everything I have read about some of the dogs I’m thinking of says to socialise them to normal everyday sights and sounds, not make them be petted by everyone etc but for them to distinguish between someone who is acting normal to someone who they should be wary of. I don’t want a dog who has never seen a large gruff guy for instance, I want that to be normal to them. To know that they aren’t more dangerous than anyone else. But if that person or any other started acting unusual and threatening for them to then take notice. No one in particular coming around, just anyone curious, that sort of thing. It’s more for me to feel safer. I don’t want to train any protection dog for protection. I just want their natural abilities to kick in if they feel they need to, like my Lab does. I’m not a sociable person so don’t want neighbours thinking they can just drop by etc either. I also don’t want liability so another reason for just those natural instincts to kick in. This won’t happen until I end up buying some land. I’m not really planning to have farm animals except some horses perhaps. I also want to be able to take the dog with me if I’m on my own doing things and feel safe as I am someone who sometimes starts imagining this or that could happen and have had past trauma so a lot is to feel secure (emotionally too) more than anything. Edited to add, I forgot to say that I’ve got nothing against German Shepherds and Rottweilers but I just don’t fully trust them. I prefer Shepherds though. I work with one and he is a lovely lovely dog but also dog reactive which really makes me sad as I have a multi dog household and I just don’t want to take risks with them. I have a lot of experience with large large dogs. My extended family used to have Wolfhounds. I also knew a couple of lovely cattle dogs and at least one was really aloof and fine with other dogs but I also knew another who would act very intimidating towards anyone and other dogs. Thanks everyone.

I met some Curly Coats and wow they were so beautiful. One was the liver colour and reminded me so much of my choc lab just curly, with how he was a big puppy rolling around and having fun. I really wanted one right then. They are a bit easier to come by than some of the other rarer retrievers. Read that they are more alert to strangers, not as social and friendly to everyone like a lab or a golden but still good natured. I love the Bernese Mountain Dog. We used to have one live down the street and he was huge but played so well with my Lab. They are definitely something I’ve thought of. I didn’t initially put them on my list because some sites say they are good at guarding and some say they really aren’t. But they are big so that itself would be a deterrent.

As far as I can tell the Curly is more stranger aware than the Flat. They seem a bit more like the Golden, super friendly. But they are darker colours so appearance wise… Everybody and anybody comes right up to my Goldens and reaches out to them and everything without asking and does soft sweet talk to them because they look so soft natured and so happy. And they are. I’m sure their colour has something to do with it too. No one does that to my big brown lab. I think my problem with a gundog for this purpose is that they’re going to have more energy. They’d fit in better with my current dogs but I kind of want a dog that will play some but enjoy just lazing around and keeping watch.

I’m wondering whether I should go for another Lab but black. I’ve also considered the Curly Coat as they are a bit more stranger aware, I like the Chesapeake Bay Retriever too but I’m a little alarmed that everywhere I read about them they can be dog aggressive. The Irish Wolfhound feels to me to be one of the better choices but as you say I’m concerned of keeping them contained as I’d prefer to have them off leash while outside of the enclosed fenced area (would still have farm fencing but that’s not much fence for any dog). Interesting about the Wirehaired Vizsla. Are they a bit more protective than the Vizsla? Are there other gun dogs that might do a good job? I know some are pretty decent at offering protection but then many also have lines that are more highly strung so difficult to discern. I know not all stay close to owner either. Thanks for all the ideas. If anyone has any more I’m always curious to learn what might be suitable.

I’m not really after a livestock guarding dog, although I love many breeds that do that. I’m more after one that will stay close to the house and follow me around the property, and be good with my retrievers. Be alert but well socialised so they can tell the difference between what’s normal and what isn’t. Prefer one who would stay close and stand out in front or bail up, not bite, and prefer one with a deep bark and one that makes you not want to step forward incase and backs you up rather than charges and pins etc.

Ooo I really love the other Italian breed the Bracco Italiano. Does anyone know if they are a bit protective? I don’t want an aggressive dog, more thought of one that looks scary to strangers and has a deep bark and will step up if they feel something is out of the normal. I don’t want a dog that will go and hide or get behind me. My Goldens get behind my Lab if they perceive a danger and my Lab stands in front of me. He is huge and excellent at just standing in front and stretching his stance out. I noticed he began to do this from puppyhood BUT he is also super friendly, which is great because well socialised to see the difference between normal and something amiss. I kind of want a more dog than my Lab though, as in one that looks more the part. He is also getting old now. I really love the Ridgeback and what is described about them on this thread really makes me want one more but I’m still a bit weary of higher energy levels and being too much dog for me.

What are blue heelers like with other dogs? I always thought they were more of a one dog situation. I’d prefer to have a dog that is happy to laze around a lot of the time and then go on big walks around the property off leash as well as into town to do plenty of socialising to sights and sounds and people etc. Don’t they have a lot of energy? Thanks.

I have read many stories of Rough Collies being scared or timid and running to hide when someone comes over etc. But I’ve read some good ones too. It is a bit of a worry. Big dogs don’t intimidate me. Just something about the Rotty and Shepherd in their looks do. Perhaps growing up I was conditioned to think they are aggressive… I think they are two of the most cutest puppies though. Funny that.

I think a Giant Schnauzer would be too much dog for me, from what I’ve read. That’s interesting about the Rough Collie - I’ve never met one before but I’ve liked what I’ve read about them. I have met some Rottweilers and even though they have been nice I feel intimidated by them. I feel a bit that way by the German Shepherd too. Another breed I really like but feel like it would be too much dog is the Rhodesian Ridgeback. I feel most comfortable with the Irish Wolfhound, perhaps due to experience. I would also with the Newf or the Saint and I understand about the shedding and mess, though I’ve not experienced it firsthand. I do worry though a bit how I read most of these breeds can have aggression in some lines. I used to be really interested in the Leonberger and have been looking at them again. I’ve not met one before though. My Lab is protective but I know that’s not really usual. I thought about a Chessie since they are a bit more protective but again worried of aggression or overly dominant behaviour.

I know it’s a bit rare but I have seen some byb’s do the appropriate health testing or at least some of the testing before breeding their dogs. Usually they don’t appear to do everything. Some do just the basic orivet testings and some do just hips and elbows but sometimes not at the correct age, too early. But I guess I just find it interesting that some are trying to be a bit better, although perhaps it’s just a marketing technique thinking they can then sell for more without papers still. But you can get the breeding dogs tested for whatever they need to be for their breed and if they are good then breed them without papers. I guess that’s the theory I’m trying to point out. But unfortunately it doesn’t seem like it’s very common (if at all for everything?)

Yes. I’ve read thoroughly about them all. At the moment I’m leaning more to a Saint or a Dane. I have had experience with Great Danes and Irish Wolfhounds. I helped to raise one in extended family as a pup and he was one of the most beautiful things I’ve met. So big but such a baby. I know the giant breeds have health issues and lower life expectancy but if they are more what I am after than a more high energy dog then so be it, I guess. I don’t mind drool or slobber, don’t mind cost of food etc. I’ve heard how messy some can be. The only thing I do worry about is if they get sick or injured and about moving them to go get help. I just would like a laid back dog who is loyal and gentle to his family including his dog family. I met a 7 month old Great Dane not too long ago and he was so beautiful and well behaved but I love so many different breeds so I want to try to narrow it down to what might be the best for our situation. Reading more about the Mastiffs has me concerned that they may become too protective…

What is their grooming like?

Thanks for that. I hadn’t considered them before but having a look at them I’m going to put them on my list.

What are they like off leash? I would have a secure enclosed area for the dogs but I also would like them to be able to go for off lead walks around the property.