Amazetl

I’ve been helping out a friend walking their medium size cross breed and he is leash reactive. I’m pretty sure he just wants to play with other dogs he sees on his walk but he lunges and tries to drag me even onto the road if the dog is on the other side. The dog can be as far away in his sight and he starts up. I’ve been working with him but something I’ve noticed is that there are so many leash reactive dogs about. Is it because they have been allowed to greet dogs on walks before? Is it dog parks? Harnesses? I’m sure it’s many things but it just seems like I’m noticing it more and more. This dog used to go to the dog park so he sees another dog and expects to be able to play with them I believe. Do you see this too when out and about? I am lucky with my own dogs. They have never been allowed to greet other dogs on walks, although sometimes a dog will come right up. They have never been to the dog park and show little natural interest in other dogs thankfully so that’s why I wonder if it’s those things since dog parks have become so popular.

Interesting and what I already thought, thanks. I do wonder where they get their breeding stock? Have they lied and just gotten a dog from a breeder and use them I bet without paying everything to do all appropriate tests. It’s concerning. What if the dog was tested though and healthy? I know it’s not so simple but my mind goes to crossing smaller dogs with a healthy breed like the Jack Russel then crossing them back to their original breed and continuing to do that until you’re back to the standard but with a mix in there and larger breeds something like with the Border Collie. I know it’s probably silly though. There are just so many breeds I love that seem to have health issues but I’m glad to hear that with Berners being healthier on average now.

What do you think it would take to make some of the more unhealthy dog breeds healthier? I know there are some breeders trying to bring healthier breeds into the mix but it isn’t recognised. Would that even work? What are your thoughts on the topic? What do you think of those who are selling mixed dog breeds such as the Bernese Mountain Dog mixed with poodle to create ‘hybrid vigour’? Is it even real or just marketing? Probably they are more in it for the money but what about the idea of creating some healthier lines? Or is it better to just focus on pure bred dogs who already show living longer and healthier and breed only them? Same with breeds with breathing issues etc?

There are several popular oodles on social media and I get the appeal with them being so scruffy or fluffy and cute but to keep that hair is a crazy amount of work and most people think they don’t need to really brush. That’s one of the biggest things that concerns me with oodles, is that so many have matted hair that must hurt. I think a lot now do genetic testing but that doesn’t mean they are still breeding quality dogs. I think the marketing behind them has been more successful than any other breed. The idea of a teddy bear type dog that is more human like. And that’s all people see until they get them and some come into problems with them.

I had a good system but recently moved everything is a bit different and trying to think up some ways to train them to the new environment. Thanks.

This is what I’ve been doing as well and it works to an extent but they can still be very hard to calm down once they see the other dog gets to go out and not them. Same, mine don’t have separation anxiety thankfully, just they want to be the one going out.

That’s really good, how did you get them to be calm though when taking the other out? That’s my problem. They will carry on and jump against the door and I can barely even get out with the one dog.

Recently moved and it’s a bit of a different set up and we haven’t figured out quite yet the easiest way for one dog to go out on either a walk or in the car and leaving the others behind without them going crazy. My dogs unfortunately aren’t crate trained. I don’t trust leaving chew toys with them, they always are inside when I’m out and are nice and settled but just get so upset when one goes out without them because they want to be the one going out instead. Some ideas I’ve had are some sort of a pen arrangement or baby gated in the spare room so they don’t see the other dog going out, but I don’t know how to condition them to that without leaving them with some distraction. They eat treats pretty quickly and although they always get a treat when I leave the house, I think they’ll eat it too fast and then be upset they aren’t going with and are now in a different room. Maybe if I just condition them to that set up throughout the day? Feed them there etc? What does everyone else do who has a multi dog household? Any ideas would be so appreciated.

It would be important if they can do that to find out if that is the reason or rule it out so that there isn’t some hysteria around this particular dog breed. But how do you prevent a dog from just snapping due to a brain tumour? Are there subtle signs beforehand? How does a person protect themselves from the very unlikely event of that happening? I don’t understand the injuries in this case. How did that cause a fatality? This dog was a show dog? Did he sire anyone? Are there any other aggressive cases in his lines? I remember years ago reading about a dog breed (not Rottweiler) where they had a male dog in their breeding lines who they decided not to breed from and put him to sleep as he was showing aggression which is very off for the breed it was. I remember thinking how awful that would be but how strong they were to not breed from him and to keep everyone safe. I don’t think we know yet if there was any prior aggression in this case or whether any of the lines are overly aggressive etc. It sounds more like some particular obscure circumstance. Hopefully more comes to light so that we can know what happened and how to prevent it in future. What a terrible situation.

I’m shocked. What happened?

I’ve read it was a Rottweiler and there were two other Rottweilers they own who weren’t involved, that the one who attacked had been having aggression issues for a while. I wonder if it was a possessive behaviour and the dog went far too far. Also, I read he had injuries only to his legs so that tells me the dog must have bitten an artery pretty bad.

Yes what happened that the dog did this instead of a growl or a quick bite and go find their own space. It’s not normal for dogs to do this and is extremely rare yet there seems to be more and more attacks lately. What is going on?

Do you know if they were intact? Is it unusual for breeders to place two same sex dogs of powerful breeds like this? Like so many, it seems it could have been prevented without banning the whole breed.

It would be better if they were aggressive lines in a way and then we could have that answer. But it seems it was two male dogs together that something caused a fight. So education is needed in what to do in that situation, whether you should have two same sex dogs together that powerful, were both males dominant? Does the breeder choose the most suitable pup for the home, making sure to choose the most submissive if you already have a dominant? It needs to not happen again without banning the whole breed.

I think the problem is that what if the recent attacks that happened were also never showing any prior signs and then it just happened due to circumstances? Or was it more breeding aggression into the lines? Were there signs before? I don’t know how popular they are but of course there are way more that never do anything than those who do. Banning them is like trying to bury something under a rug and not think of it. It would be better to figure out why it happens sometimes and how to address those incidents more to prevent it from happening.

There was more information too that when the neighbour was hitting the fence trying to help, one of the dogs was jumping up against the fence barking at him. So if the second dog was doing that, when did he start? Did he go back and forth attacking and then guarding at the fence? Or was he scared and confused and adrenaline driven? Things we won’t probably know. It’s so terrible, it seems they were close with their owner but whatever happened that day between the two dogs… did they know what they were doing? I don’t suppose it makes much of a difference. It would be good to learn the most effective way to stop it or not get involved etc.

That’s true about covid dogs missing out on a lot of socialisation perhaps with people who ordinarily wouldn’t have been dog owners and didn’t get the training or support they need themselves. Don’t forget how so many backyard breeders jumped on high costs of puppies to make profits so a lot of the younger dogs out there aren’t properly bred either.

Not sure there should be calls to total bans when this sort of thing happens. It’s a higher percentage than a lot of other breeds yes and historically too but breeders tried hard to fix up aggressive lines and now I imagine these dogs are probably backyard bred or something. More needs to be looked into lines and allowing people who want powerful dogs better management skills, perhaps a short info course, must be from trusted lines, etc. Rather than a total ban. Bans probably do work somewhat in AU but bans often just make the wrong sort go under ground. There has to be much more that can be done without jumping to a total ban, and much more that would be more effective and educational. Edited to add. More needs to be done to prevent dogs from escaping, there should be penalties or something. Bystanders should never be subject to a loose dog coming over to them. It’s not fair and can have devastating consequences. Crack that down first before calls for whole breed bans.

Very true about suburban yards and management. Sorry, I was referring to how they were both later put down, not the shot during the attack.

I wonder what happened to start this. Were they playing and play turned into aggression? Were they guarding something? Was it possessive behaviour? Had there been any indications beforehand to her or anyone else? Where were they bred? What are their lines? So many unanswered questions. Would it be educational to behaviour test the dogs? Do they do that or do they just put them down and be done with it? Aggression has no place but it seems so quick that these dogs are destroyed and questions still remain. For instance just how many other people have dogs related to these dog lines? Just how many (petite) women (or children) have two really large powerful dogs like this? What would they be thinking right now as they cuddle their dogs. There should be some sort of review on why these things happen and how to prevent them.

Yes that could be, but the trainers have used it as an excuse to why the dog seemed so skinny ‘he was like that already’. Despite not eating for 4 days. I hope more information will become available soon.

Yes, most dogs are capable of causing serious damage to other dogs, even the ones who have never had problems before or are so friendly. There are so many variables that happen with each dog meeting and triggers that happen too fast for us to react. That’s why it’s so important that everyone have control of their dog and don’t have them off leash in areas where they’re not supposed to be or if your dog runs up to others. So common to hear ‘don’t worry he/she‘ s friendly’ but what if the other dog isn’t? I have a dog who although has never been in a fight or done anything, gets very scared and unsure of strange dogs coming up to her, I quickly get in front of her before she gets to a state where she would feel like she needs to defend herself or myself. But the other person way aways yells out not to worry because their dog is friendly. Yet their dog is right in my dogs face, after having run up with no warning to try to sniff my dog’s face. That’s not how dogs are meant to greet even.

We don’t know what went on, however it does say that the dog hadn’t eaten for 4 days before the trainers notified them. 4 days. That’s a lot to not be notified by. One thing I noticed though, he went to the vet the day before going to the training facility and was said to be healthy, but did they give him any medication or injections there or worming/flea medication that sort of thing? Could any of that have done something as it has to some dogs? The trainers said he was skinny to begin with, why? Was he not fed enough or did he have some problem that he wasn’t putting on weight to begin with? Why was he suddenly reported to be enjoying himself and doing well and then the next day went so down hill so fast? I also don’t like that the trainers apologised and offered to cover vet costs but told them not to share it with anyone. How can you trust reviews if you only get to see good reviews? There are lots of questions and I’m sure two sides to the story and then the truth. Regardless though, I think the trainers should have notified the family earlier. I don’t agree with these training facilities at all and there have been many stories around the world of these things happening there, as well as dogs who have spent the majority of time there in a small crate. Not saying that’s happened here but I wouldn’t trust someone else to train my dog for me, plus no bond built between you and the dog etc. It’s better to get a trainer in at your home or go to classes with your dog. It’s very sad what has happened and I hope they find out exactly what did happen. Just very sad reading that story, poor doggy.

That’s how I feel. I just have the urge to rescue in the future and I realise I most likely won’t know all the history. Best tip seems to be make sure as with any time getting a dog, to have funds available dedicated to that dog. I just know with retrievers, if I went that way, that they might need some very costly surgery on their hips etc. But I just want to give them a loving home because they didn’t deserve any of the consequences of poor breeding (not to say that health tested pups are completely free of getting that too).

Yes, they are normally regarded as gentle giants and even a friend to all, unless they are in hunt mode I suppose. There are a lot of mixed hounds around that are used for hunting that look similar to Wolfhounds and Deerhounds, they are much more common. A well socialised and well trained and well bred Wolfhound should be able to control itself if a little dog comes up yapping. They are so much bigger and it shouldn’t bother them too much (of course unless it starts to attack) but nonetheless, it doesn’t appear that’s what happened here. If you can’t control your huge dog due to size and strength then you shouldn’t be having them out and about. Most dogs aren’t properly able to be simply controlled through strength but they are trained not to pull and lose the leash where something could happen. I understand sometimes people are naive or it hasn’t happened before but people have to know the strength of their dog and act accordingly. It’s not an excuse. Also, in the case of your friends, the other person shouldn’t have had their little dog off leash if it was going to run up barking at much larger dogs (or any at all). Unless it’s your first time walking them then you should know a bit about how they act in those situations, and if it is your first time out with them then precaution should be taken and definitely not off leash.