Staranais

Tough situation. If he were mine, I'd be sticking him on broad spectrum Ab as soon as I could, and if he wouldn't drink, would be getting an IV line into him if possible to keep him hydrated. Keep him warm. Feed him mushy or liquid food. However, I'm not a qualified vet. Hopefully one of the forum vets will be able to give you more qualified advice.

Cavalier, you're still here? Would you go have a look at the skewer puppy thread please?

Ah, I misunderstood then, sorry. I didn't realise you were saying Cavandra should test after vaccinating to see if the dog had seroconverted originally. I thought you were saying Cavandra should titre test annually and revaccinate her dogs whenever the titres weren't still at "protective" levels. Your point about puppies is a good one and is something that some breeders don't understand or consider, IMO. Pups can't get maternal antibody protection if the dam does not have circulating antibodies to the disease. Whatever vaccine protocol a breeder chooses to use for her other dogs, giving a bitch a vaccination before breeding her can result in far better transfer passive immunity to the pups.

Well, you were the one who asked why two vets would have different opinions, and how could you tell if a vet was in it "for the money". I was merely answering.

Take him to a human doctor if possible! Next best thing to a vet. In the mean time keep him warm, and hydrated. Rappie, Charles K, and Cavalier are the qualified DOL vets. PS, have also PMed you Gav.

Not sure about Oz, but over here it's barley grass that's the prime culprit in grass seed issues. Regular lawn grass or pasture ryegrass is different.

Depends where you live, I guess. There would be no need to vaccinate so young if you could guarantee the pup wouldn't be exposed to parvo, but if Cavalier is in a high parvo risk area and particularly if she is treating parvo dogs herself at her work, then I guess she may be quite right to be concerned the pup would be exposed.

Same way you know which breeders are in it for the money, and which breeders are in it for the dogs. You talk to them, ask them questions, and pick the one that seems to know their stuff and that you feel comfortable with. Vets have different opinions since the issue isn't black and white. Which vaccination protocol is best will depend on the dog, and on the disease prevalence in the local area, and on the particular vaccine being used. Different vet schools will teach slightly different things. Different vets will have read different research, or come to different conclusions from the research they have read. Or vets will have their opinions guided by what they've experienced in practice - a vet that's seen lots of puppies die of parvo is probably going to have a different opinion on optimal vaccination frequency than a vet who hasn't seen much parvo but who has seen some serious vaccine reactions, for example. In your case, those two vets may recommend different protocols - perhaps the recommendations that one vet is giving are best for the brand/type of vaccine they're using, and the other vet may be using a different brand which is licensed for another protocol? If you want to go to your breeders vet, then I would say go to your breeders vet.

If the pup didn't get any colostrum, Nekhbet, it wouldn't have any maternal antibodies. Cats and dogs get minimal IgG across the placenta. And I'm pretty sure that Cavalier is the vet.

It is interesting! Amazing his little immune system can respond so well when he's still so young. And... where are the puppy photos, hmmm?

Were those animals tested after the puppy vaccines to ensure they seroconverted, though, or are we just assuming they became immune to parvo after vaccination and then lost that immunity subsequently? I doubt anyone will ever design and conduct the perfect vaccination study, but I've seen several large studies that strongly suggest vaccines tend to protect dogs for at least three years after their full puppy vaccine schedule, and haven't seen any good studies showing that adult dogs can lose their parvo immunity after showing a protective titre. Joelle, I agree with Cavalier that you should go with your vet's advice, they know the local conditions, and they know how to use the drugs that they're prescribing. If you don't trust your vet's advice, then get a second opinion from another vet - not from your breeder, who is probably well intentioned, but doesn't necessarily know much about vaccines.

None of the above. All other things being equal, I prefer C3 at 8, 12, and 16 weeks. There is IMO no need to do a vaccine at 6 weeks except in exceptional situations (for example, a shelter pup living in an environment where it might be exposed to parvo, and which might not have had sufficient colostrum to provide sufficient maternal antibody protection). But which regime you follow depend on more than what you think is "right" - different vaccines from different manufacturers have different recommended schedules, and your vet may advise a different schedule again depending on the prevalence of different diseases in your local area. If you have a pupp then IMO the best thing to do is find a vet who you trust, and who is happy to answer your questions and explain their reasoning, to advise you.

That's ok... My dogs can do all that stuff already. I'm not into dancing with dogs though. I was just trying to think of a competition application for both side heeling. The OP might find it helpful though. We already do enough to keep us suitably busy! (ie. All other eligible sports except HTM and DWD!) I'm not into dancing with dogs, either, though it can be fun to watch other people doing it. But I think we'll train wrong-side heeling anyway just for fun. It can't much hurt, and I think it will be good for her little brain (and her neck).

This is a good one to start with: http://shirleychong.com/keepers/retrieve.html

Guess so. I can't imagine being able to work my dog without her communicating with me. My girl is trainee SAR. I was doing an offleash area seach last night with her. It was dark, so I sent her off to find people and soon lost sight of her. She appeared a few minutes later by my side and barked at me. That's our signal that she's found someone, so I immediately praised her and followed. I wasn't going fast enough I guess, because she came back half way and body slammed me, then barked again. When we reached the subject, she pounced on them with both feet, and then whirled round and stared at me expectantly, waiting for me to produce the reward. She couldn't have communicated more clearly and deliberately if she'd been wearing a flashing neon sign.

Yes. It's about people who want to live with wild animals on the animals terms. I'm certainly not going to be dragging a roo carcass into my back yard and eating its liver first to ensure my dogs respect me. I don't see a direct comparison to establishing a bond of trust and respect with a domesticated dog. For a start, they don't want the wolves to function in their home or in society. I don't see them taking the wolves walking in public on a loose lead, expecting their wolves to tolerate the presence of strange people or wolves or obedience training them to recall on cue. well i think the principles are the same when it comes to you as the leader and your dog as the follower. JMO Was Shaun Ellis the leader of his pack of (captive) adult wolves? Not from the interviews I've read. He had to defer to at least some of the wolves to be "allowed" to remain with the pack. Interesting to read about, but not my idea of a good technique to use with my dog. Luckily, my dog isn't a wolf, so she's been bred for thousands of years to communicate with humans and look to humans for direction. she can communicate with humans can she?????.... How did you teach her to talk? Yup, she surely can and does. If you think your dogs don't try to communicate with you, I think you need to pay more attention to them.

And don't forget everyone in the house eating the raw meat only diet, so that they "smell right" to the dogs! Yummy.

Yes. It's about people who want to live with wild animals on the animals terms. I'm certainly not going to be dragging a roo carcass into my back yard and eating its liver first to ensure my dogs respect me. I don't see a direct comparison to establishing a bond of trust and respect with a domesticated dog. For a start, they don't want the wolves to function in their home or in society. I don't see them taking the wolves walking in public on a loose lead, expecting their wolves to tolerate the presence of strange people or wolves or obedience training them to recall on cue. well i think the principles are the same when it comes to you as the leader and your dog as the follower. JMO Was Shaun Ellis the leader of his pack of (captive) adult wolves? Not from the interviews I've read. He had to defer to at least some of the wolves to be "allowed" to remain with the pack. Interesting to read about, but not my idea of a good technique to use with my dog. Luckily, my dog isn't a wolf, so she's been bred for thousands of years to communicate with humans and look to humans for direction.

Yes, I was going to suggest David Mech. He knows a lot about how wolf packs really work. Raymond and Laura Coppinger's popular science book on canine evolution is worth a read, too. It's probably in your local library. (Edited to add: OMG, this ended up ahead of the post I was quoting. How bizarre.)

Which wolf pack studies are you referring to? I'm interested in that too. You dont watch national geographic, animal plant or have even watched the "wolf man"......obviously not. here is a website on wolf communication - http://www.wolfweb.com/facts-communication.html "Wolves use body language and facial expressions to communicate with each other. Dominant wolves will freely look other animals directly in the eye, this declares and reinforces their superior rank." You tell me then, if this is not the case how do wolves communicate then???????? Ah, I see. Animal Planet. Sorry, but...

Which wolf pack studies are you referring to? I'm interested in that too.

I've started doing some clicker perch work with my new little girl to build hind end awareness, and have just started naming the positions: "front" "heel" and "otherside" so she can learn to flip between them on cue. I think when I start teaching a formal heel in a month or two, I might do it on both sides. We only dabble in obedience, I'm not a serious competitor, but I'm always a little worried about dogs stressing their necks by spending their whole obedience careers only heeling on one side. Plus it seems like it would be fun to teach both. Does anyone else do this? Is it done in Rally-O? I've never seen it done, and I don't know why. Are people concerned the dog will get confused between regular and off-side heeling? (We're also practicing between the legs heeling after viewing this video to help build some hind end awareness and just for fun, and it's fast becoming her favourite game: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xx_e4S-vHM )

Oh my goodness, I missed that. If you tried that at my house, I think you'd be looking for your lips. My pup would let me put my mouth over her muzzle, if I wanted to, because she already trusts and respects me. If someone she didn't already trust or respect tried putting their mouth on her muzzle in order to intimidate her, they'd probably end up with a face full of holes. And serve them right, I say.

It's also an excellent way to get your face ripped off, if the dog doesn't back down, has poor bite inhibition, or is faster than you (and guess what? Most dogs are). Scruffing, IMO, only works on a decently sized adult dog if it isn't yet 100% serious about what it's defending. And it only works if the handler is prepared to hold the dog until it surrenders 100%, even if they get bitten in the process. Neither of those things can be predicted over the internet. And yes, IMO scruffing it can have backlash in terms of hurting your relationship, if you do it to the wrong dog. It's extremely confrontational, and some dogs don't cope with that well. I'd love the input of the professional behaviourists on this topic (Erny? K9? Cosmolo? Nekhbet? Kepie-i?) Do you routinely scruff pet dogs during training, or think it's smart to advise people on forums to do so?

So,.......If you went down to the pokies every day, and were lucky enough to "hit the jackpot",........It wouldn't be a jackpot?? If you started to expect it was going to happen, then I guess it wouldn't be a jackpot. If you were still suprised and gratified every time it happened, then I think it would still be a jackpot. I think it's all about expectation. If my dog knows I've got a hamburger in my pocket so she recalls for me, IMO that's not a jackpot, it's just a big reward. If she's expecting something like a piece of kibble when she recalls, and I whip out a hamburger, then to me, that's a jackpot, because it's suprisingly larger than her expectation. But like I say, I don't know if there's any official dog training definition of jackpot anywhere! That's just how I've heard the term always used, and always used it myself. Perhaps someone's who has done the Australian or Delta dog trainers courses would know?