Staranais

Not trying to start an argument, cos like you say it depends what you want out of a dog, but I've got to say I feel exactly the opposite! I think that it's nice for my dog to be able to play with his dog friends, but that it's not worth any decrease in his off leash reliability. I wouldn't ever let him off leash to play unless I was confident I could recall him back. I figure if he's some how gets off leash one day and sees a dog across the street, I want him to listen to my recall instead of deciding to take off after the other dog. It's just a safety thang.

How's Ollie?

It's best to get training for a professional if you do decide to use one. Does a prong hurt the dog's neck? Well firstly, the dog can't feel the prongs unless he pulls. I've tried one on myself, and it hurts if you pull hard on the leash, but I personally felt that the sensation was less painful than the same strength jerk on a choke chain. (Yes, I tried one of those too...) If you meant does it injure the dog - then no.

Does that mean you never let your dogs play with other dogs at all, K9, in case they get hurt or scared? Or do you just mean you need to thoroughly check out the temperament of the dogs that you let your dog interact with, and make sure you're in control of the situation at all times? *edited for sense!*

They're also good for tramping and running with your dog. When tramping, you can give your dog a wee boost over logs and boulders by tugging on his harness, not something you want to do with a collar! And when running, it means that if you inadvertently tug your dog along, he doesn't get his neck jerked. I agree a harness isn't a training aid - but your dog is already trained, it shouldn't matter what you walk him on, cause he won't be pulling on it.

Sorry, if I misinterpreted what you were saying, Lablover. I think that's good to hear too. She's only young, so there's plenty of time to become stricter when she gets older. At the moment she's learning that obedience is fun and rewarding - and that can only be a good thing, right? ;)

I've talked to a girl who used one on her dog. She said it worked to stop the dog pulling (though only while it was wearing the harness obviously!), and that the dog accepted it much more easily than a head collar.

I think Lablover means try to understand your dog's point of view. Things that might seem obvious to us (like the meaning of the work sit, or the undesirability of peeing in the house) are much less obvious to an 18 week old puppy. And if your dog doesn't fully understand what you're asking, she is not going to be able to do it!

Do they walk her too? :rolleyes: I'm just wondering, cos I've never had to clip my boy's nails: a short walk each day keeps them down just fine. Even 15 min on concrete daily seems to keep them OK. If your friends' dog's nails are growling that long, then I'd wonder if perhaps she isn't getting enough exercise for her general health either?

If my psycho dog-aggressive devil dog ever earns any obedience ribbons, they'd be hung on the wall right next to my university degree (and I'd be just about as proud of him too!) :rolleyes:

No offense, but I'm just wondering why you want your dog to cock his leg? I'm continualy trying to persuade my dog NOT to cock his leg on everything (he's better, slowly...), so I'm quite jealous that you have the opposite problem! I figure marking is a pretty gross habit (who wants pee spots all over the garden)? Not to mention it's a hassle if you're ever trialling (you don't want a dog deciding to mark inside the ring), and a hassle if you take your dog visiting (you don't want him peeing on the strange smells in your parent's house or garden, right?) Plus I personally don't think it's a great idea to let an aggressive dog mark everywhere. My dog's aggression did improve a little after I stopped letting him mark on walks (and therefore stopped letting him claim the whole neighbourhood as his own territory). Just my opinion.

Just speaking from experience, my boofhead mostly picks fights with dogs that react to him (if that makes sense). So if other dogs react to him differently, as if he isn't a threat or a challenge, he will possibly get into less fights? About the first point, the learned behaviour point, I was wondering about that too. But if you're going to attempt to retrain an adult dog who has learned anti-social behaviour, then perhaps these implants would be a good idea during the training process? The testosterone might not be the whole picture with these dogs anymore, but it is possibly adding fuel to the fire. Just musing - I don't really know much about this.

Wow Melbell, that sounds like a dream come true... I'll definately have to ask about this implant next time I'm at my vets.

Yeah, I've heard that about desexed bitches. I guess bitches have more testosterone in the system after desexing or something - kind of the opposite of desexing a male dog? Might have to ring up my vet and make enquiries.

So is the implant only for entire male dogs, or can de-sexed ones have it too?

It just seems a little silly to me that your dog should have to be hungry to learn. I expect my dog to pay attention to me regardless of whether he's hungry! I mean, what happens in real life when you want your dog to obey you, but you've just fed him dinner?

Hi Aly, Have you thought about the possibility of it being a contact allergy, perhaps to his bedding, or the carpet, or something in the garden? My stafford used to get a bumpy rash on his belly, eventually we found out he was having an allergic reaction to one of the plants in our garden. Wandering Jew - apparently the allergy is quite common. Might be worth checking out?

I have talked to one woman who worked for Delta, and she said that Delta is a very "positive" organisation. Not just as in focused on reinforcement, but as in actively discouraging people from ever physically disciplining their dogs at all. She used a prong on her dog at home, and said several of the other Delta people did, but their work wouldn't let them suggest them to customers. I don't know how true all that it, though - it's just what I was told.

I think breed does have some input into a dog's quickness of learning and willingness to work. Dogs that have been bred to work in close association with humans (think shepherds, shelties, border collies) are always going to have an edge over dogs who were bred to work independently. I don't know if that has any bearing on your situation, and your two breeds, though.

I'm currently teaching my dog a "look at me" heeling command (simply because he is quite reactive to other dogs, and I figure if he is consistently watching me he can't simultaneously be eyeing-up the other dogs in the class or on the street.) During the teaching process I've become aware that this style of attention heeling places the dog in a really vulnerable position. In effect, the dog is completely trusting you to be his "eyes" and keep him safe from harm while he's heeling. If I ever walked my dog into something, I think it would probably take a long time for him to feel comfortable heeling like that again.

I attach my dog's long line to a harness, not a collar, for this very reason. Even if I have to stop him dead on it, it won't hurt his neck. Glad everything worked out for you, Chelseasmum!

The above is true if you ask the dog for attention, then when he complies you bring out the treats and reward him. But I was under the impression (from your post) that if the dog got distracted, you brought out a treat and showed it to the dog to get the dog's attention? In effect, what you're doing there is reinforcing the dog for non-attention. The dog is inattentive to you, which gets him a treat. He's not actually learning anything except that you have food, and might give it to him with no effort needed on his own part. See what I'm saying? Big difference - and I'm not sure which one you're doing? I think it's meant to be a pattern interupt. If the dog is focussing on something else and ignoring you, a quick squirt will theoretically break his focus on whatever he is finding so fascinating. Haven't used it myself.

Yup that's true, and I do hide the reward until I'm ready to give it. On the other hand, he's not dumb - if I've asked him to do a few things then rewarded him with his tennis ball, he knows the tennis ball is on offer and his enthusiasm sky-rockets when I ask him to do further tasks. The only problem I can envision with randomisation of toy & food is that when he's hyped about the ball, he just looses interest in food, and it then becomes fairly useless as a reward. Not entirely sure why - perhaps it's a drive thing. If I reward with a ball once, then try to reward with food the next time, he'll ignore the food and keep staring at me oh so hopefully, willing me to produce his ball. :p That's probably the best bet - I'll give it a go, anyway. He'll definately be more interested in food as a reward if it comes before he realises I've got the ball... Sorry, Kelpiecuddles, for hijacking your thread!

Thanks YB, that would be great. He's a bit too short for a hand target, but maybe I could use a target stick?

Lol, have you seen my dog, yogi? He's like a big brick on little stumpy legs - not the most aerodynamic of dog shapes. I could give it a go, though. Do you generally lure to teach it, or have you got another method? Not quite sure what you mean by an "auto" stand or sit? We do normally practice our finishes just from front position (i.e no recall). You mean tell him to finish, then say "sit" when he gets to heel position? If I do that, he tends to still carry right around to front, then sit quickly, with a big proud sloppy staffy smile. It's quite frustrating. If I'm rewarding with food, he'll finish very slowly but quite precisely. If I'm using toys, he'll finish enthusiastically and quickly, but loses the precision... Or have I misunderstood what you're saying.